Episode 350 – Back From GRPC

 

Full Episode Download: http://traffic.libsyn.com/politicsandguns/350.mp3

Open and Personal News Segment:

News Segment 1:

News Segment 2:

Interview Segment 1: Guests Tina Maldonado and Brittany Sutton

DGU Segment:

Email and Show Close:

 

Introduction

“An armed society is a polite society.. and this is the Polite Society Podcast where we support and report on civilian self-defense.”

Paul: Welcome to episode 350 of the polite society podcast presented by the Firearms Policy Coalition recorded on Sunday October 11th 2015, I’m Paul Lathrop

Rob: I’m Rob Morse and on tonight’s show we will talk about the murders at Umpqua Community College .

John: I’m John Richardson, and we’ll talk with

Tina Maldonado and Brittany Sutton about Texas students for concealed carry.

Gary: I’m Gary Daugherty and in one of our DGU’s  we talk about a Houston criminal that made a very poor choice in the victim selection process. so climb aboard

Rob: strap in

John : and hang on!

Paul:  episode 350 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.

Show intro music.

 

Seg 1- Personal news from each participant (when you are done with your segment please ask the next person what has been up with them)

Rob- I carried at GRPC.  I had an additional adventure on the way home because I had a gun.  Here is a pro-tip for traveling with a gun.  Carrying a gun only adds a few minutes to your travel time at the airline counter, but it could add one problem.  You CAN NOT be late at the airport, not even by one minute, if you’re carrying a gun in your bag.  There are hard cut-off times for checking a bag before your flight.

 

You can’t dash to the gate and then check your bag as you walk down the boarding ramp.  We have to check our bags at the counter if we’re flying with a gun.    I missed my flights so I had to rent a car and drive the last hundred miles.

 

One of the highlights of the trip was to meet AWR Hawkins.  He has been writing a lot these days.  I also got to talk with Jim Irvine.  One of my disappointments was the people who did NOT go to GRPC.  Come on, guys.  Go to Tampa and stop making excuses.  Really, I lost respect for some people who didn’t go to the conference.

 

You know we have to shout out a thank you.  You know that, don’t you?  Guys?  Who do we owe a thank you?

 

I was on Mark Walter’s Armed American Radio and on Bill Frady’s Lock and Load Radio program a couple of times.  We have to tell them that we’ll hold a seat in the front row for them in Tampa.

 

I’ve also stopped carrying concealed in Louisiana.  I carried as a non-resident because I had nonresident reciprocity from my licenses in other states.  Those licenses are not valid for carry in Louisiana now that I’m a Louisiana resident.  I’m applying for my new permit and going unarmed.. unless I go to Texas, where I can carry again.  Don’t you all feel safer?!

 

I made room reservations for nra convention in May.

 

I have some training coming up.  I’ll be a line coach with Jeff and Robyn Street in Naples Florida on October 24th.  They are having a glock range day at the LouLand Gun Club.  The entry fee is $5, and they have loaner guns.  If you’re on the South West coast of Florida and are free on Saturday, October 24th, you should look into it.  Maybe you have a friend who talked about self-defense.  Look for glock range day at step by step gun training in Naples, Florida.

 

John – I spent yesterday morning at the local gun show working the Grass Roots North Carolina booth. We got a number of people to sign our petition saying no more gun control at the Federal level. It will be delivered to our US Senators and Congressmen. While at the show, I bought enough ammo that Hillary Clinton would say I need a license to purchase – if she had her way.

 

I have talked to a number of people about attending the next GRPC in Tampa including fellow GRNC volunteers. I think this past GRPC in Phoenix had to rank as one of the best. I talked to more activists than ever before from a number of states. I credit the podcast for this as I was more visible and people sought me out. The other thing I enjoyed about this GRPC is that I finally got to meet Gary and Rachel in person. It’s one thing meeting a person over the Internet, it is another to meet them in person.

 

Gary – What training do you have coming up?

We have a weekday evening ILFCCL class coming up October 19-22 it will be four evenings from 6-10pm.

I had to block a friend on Facebook for posting a name calling article to me. That really makes me sad, when someone reverts to name calling they are admitting they have lost the argument. Please try to avoid this in your conversations with the anti-gun crowd. This brings me to this post on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/CourageCampaign/photos/a.164423892567.119987.7364882567/10153300704932568/?type=3 This is a post about the concealed carry school ban in California. The horrible things people are saying to each other, from both sides of the argument, are despicable. Please remember we are a polite society. Aside from that, someone posted “…no armed bystander has ever stopped a mass shooting. Ever.” and it got 8 thumbs up. There were also several posts about how a concealed carriers will just start wild west shoot outs with the bad guys and cause more carnage and kill innocents. I just want to say with no animus and only love in my heart, if you believe this you are flat out wrong.

 

I and most concealed carriers take carrying a self defense tool as seriously as most people do driving a car or surgeons do when operating on people. If you think me being in your proximity while I am carrying a concealed firearm puts you in more danger again you are just wrong.

 

Oh, yah GRPC…the water slide was awesome. Seriously, amazing, got to meet so many positive minded gun rights people that it recharged my energy to do whatever I can in my own small way to support gun rights. Take your time and watch all of the video that we recorded at GRPC, I promise something from the speakers or one of our exclusive interviews will make you say to yourself, “Wow, that was interesting or I hadn’t thought of that.” The listeners have been so helpful in the past I’m reaching out to them again. I have a student that is interested in switching to a shoulder holster for the winter and since it’s been over 20 years since I did bodyguard work and wore a shoulder holster under a suit I’m sure things have changed, so if anybody out there is currently using a shoulder holster please share your experiences with us at OnAir@PoliticsandGuns.com Sig P938

 

Paul – WOW what a GRPC in Phoenix. Had a great time while we were down there and an amazing trip back. Highlight of my time down there had to be Dave Workman giving us a little grief and then jumping on the mic after finding out we were on the air and coming through like a trooper. Also getting Alan Gottlieb (my personal hero in the gun rights arena) on the air.

Highlight of the trip down was a tie between meeting Laura Carno for lunch and taking US 160 just east of Pagosa Springs Colorado. Really experienced truckers that spend a lot of time in the west or southwest will know the reference to Wolf Creek Pass, made famous in the C.W. McCall song. It is a BEAUTIFUL drive… in a car… I can only imagine what a pain in the butt it is in a truck.

The Trip back was highlighted by a stop for breakfast at the Shooters Grill in Rifle colorado. A few things about this stop, first there isn’t any truck parking close by. the nearest truck parking is about a mile and a half away at a rest area.  Secondly the food is REALLY good. I was expecting that they were getting business off of the gimmick of the staff open carrying, but I was pleasantly surprised!  Yes, our waiter was open carrying (he carried an XD) and was super attentive to us. Another surprise about Rifle is that of the 3 cafe’s that were on Main street 2 were open for breakfast and of the 3, two had pro gun signage up. Also there were 2 ummm marijuana dispensaries and both had very clear no guns allowed signs.

 

Was on the GunBlog Variety Cast this past  week, thanks to Sean for asking me to come on and doing a masterful job of editing my ramblings. We talked GRPC and why more people should be there.

 

Break

 

Seg 2- News

 

UCC shooting

The members of the Polite Society Podcast would like to extend our sincere condolences to the family, friends and community of the nine victims off the Umpqua Community College tragedy. Trapped by madness and religious hatred and bigotry, the students and staff of UCC paid a fierce price in what the school administration had declared as a gun-free zone. Not even the school’s single security guard was allowed a firearm to preserve the fantasy of an unarmed oasis.  

Obama didn’t wait for the bleeding to stop before he rushed before his cameras. In twelve minutes of rambling petulence, he expressed his frustrations with his six years of gun-control failures. Referring to himself 28 times, much more than twice a minute, he personalized the gun-control debate, holding it as a personal affront that his desires had not been granted. He trotted out the usual non-sensical “common sense” demands, backed by discredited studies, half-truths and outright lies. And he pledged to politicize the tragedy even further and push the usual gun banner’s dreams – NONE of which would have prevented the murders.

Obama targeted a unnamed, sinister, shadowy organization that was wholly responsible for frustrating his whims. His willing minions in the media were quick to take up the boogeyman fallacy. More than a few people who should have known better responded and demanded that the NRA be labeled as a terrorist organization. No mention was made of the millions of people that actually make up, support and guide the NRA.

 

It’s hard to believe this latest divisive distraction from his collapsing presidency will go anywhere legislatively. The Congress is in relatively friendly hands, even if Boehner and McConnell roll over once more for old times sake. The danger is in Obama’s lawless and unConstitutional executive actions.  The one phone and pen action that has been floated will do absolutely nothing to affect violent crime, other than possibly criminalizing some wives for selling their late husband’s firearm collection.

What the Obama tantrum did is identify his desired end state for the gun “problem.”  He favors the British and Australian models of gun control. Have no doubt those models mean draconian bans on nearly every firearm in private hands, door to door confiscation, mass destruction, and the centralization of all arms and power in the hands of the government. This, Mr President, we will resist.  

It’s going to be a long, difficult wait until the Twentieth of January, 2017.  

 

Comments:  Okay – I’m outta here. The Princess is back.  Thanks again

How’s the tone for the above rant?  OK, Dan.

 

-john – I want to point out the killer passed background checks.

 

Paul -There were widespread protests in Roseburg, Oregon when the president came to visit.  Roseburg is a deeply red working class town.  The president and the media were widely resented as using the town’s tragedy for their personal profit.

 

Rob- I want to talk about gun control.  Oregon has mandatory firearms registration.  The murderer registered his firearms.  Oregon has mandatory background checks.  The murderer passed those background checks.  The school campus is restricted as a gun free zone, and honest students were disarmed as the murderer went to a gun-free zone.  Oregon is a gun control paradise, and the state is ranked 18th out of 50 by the Brady campaign because of its strict gun control laws.  Obama had to speak out quickly.  Not because he has a solution, but because his policies failed so miserably and he needed to distract the public from noticing his failure.

 

As to the news media, they have been horribly corrupt in their coverage.  Here is a thought experiment for you. Do you think the media would be chanting for more “gun-free zones” if the murderers we’ve seen this last year were attacking newsrooms rather than schools? I think the newsies would start carrying at work.  The CNN studios in New York had armed guards the day after the Charlie Hebdo murders in France. and they do today as well.  They have armed security every day.. yet they say we should put our children in disarmed schools.. and blame the National Rifle Association even though the NRA has begged for armed school guards.

 

Open comment- If gun free zones are such a good idea, then start with the White House.

 

-John – I will say that some Republican presidential candidates responded appropriately. I want to mention Bobby Jindal and Ben Carson in particular. Jindal asked where the father was and Carson asked why more people didn’t fight back.

 

Rob- Did you hear where 22 people were stabbed when a 16-year-old boy went on a  rampage.  It happened in Pennsylvania.. in a gun-free school zone.

 

Hate to the NRA

Top strategists in the Democrat party have decided this is the year to attack gun owners.  We’ve heard several outbursts from politicians condemning honorable gun owners and the National Rifle Association after this last public murder.

  • Hillary Clinton said “You know, the NRA’s position reminds me of negotiating with the Iranians or the Communists. You know there is no possible discussion and it’s for political purposes.”
  • President Obama asked America’s gun owners ..to think about whether your views are properly being represented by the organization that suggests it’s speaking for them.
  • Bernie Sanders said “we have got to come together on common sense approaches.. to ban semi-automatic assault weapons, guns which have no other purpose but to kill people.”
  • The Chicago Sun Times says every politician in washington should pass a law making it illegal to sell a gun online or at a gun show to anybody who is a convicted felon, repeat domestic abuser or seriously mentally ill.  How unreasonable would that be?

Obviously the Chicago Sun Times and leading democrats don’t know existing firearms laws that already make those transfers illegal.  They don’t know how mass murderers actually get their guns.. or they don’t care, because they only need to sell voters and advertisers, not solve a real problem.

 

Gary?  open comment-  The NRA is the only organization that gets blamed for things its members never do.

  • John – I don’t have a problem with neg. like the Iranians. They got the bomb and the USA got nada.

 

Rob- I called the NRA and asked them how NRA membership numbers look.  In particular, I asked the membership office in Fairfax, Virginia  if people were calling up and cancelling their memberships.  They aren’t.  The rate of new memberships and renewals is up, but they have noticed a particular surge in new lifetime memberships.  Life memberships are usually a thousand dollars, but the NRA runs a promotion at each annual meeting where they drop the rates.  You can become a life member, an endowment, patron or benefactor member.

 

A friend of mine in New York City is a photographer.  She doesn’t own a gun, but after hearing the progressive politicians dump hate gun owners and the NRA, she became a member.

 

John- Now your friend gets daily e-mails from Fairfax.   

 

CF- She doesn’t have to get them if she doesn’t want them. The NRA is EXTRAORDINARILY good about respecting their members desires. My Father bitched and moaned until I talked to the NRA for him. They immediately took him off all their mailing lists. This forced my Dad to find something else to bitch and moan about. 😉

Break

Do Non-Badged Citizens With Guns Ever Stop Mass Shootings?
In his televised fit only hours after the UCC murders, Obama dismissively asked if more guns actually reduce crime? Eugene Volokh, of the Volokh Conspiracy blog, answers definatively: Yes they do!

 

Professor Volokh cites ten times where a civilian with a gun stopped a mass shooting.  Of course, such instances are relatively rare, as the diseased mass killer usually chooses places where he will not be restrained in his sick fantasy. Areas like gun-free zones. As an example, the Aurora theater killer deliberately bypassed nine closer venues and choose a smaller movie house – because it was the one protected by a gun-free zone sign.   

It seems the only logical way to reduce these mass killings is to eliminate gun-free zones.   

 

Rob- I’ve written about this.  John has written about the failures of gun control.

Gary- Massad Ayoob has written about this. He references an article that talks about a dozen cases where a concealed carriers stopped mass shootings.  It is good to see other journalists weigh in.

 

-John – I love what Mas calls GFZs – hunting preserves for psychopaths.

 

Cuomo Throws an Anti-Gun Tantrum

Speaking of petulant tantrums, New York Governor Cuomo threw a beaut at the funeral of an ex-aide. His former aide and friend was shot at an early morning party in the Bronx. Instead of eulogizing his friend, the rabidly anti-gun Governor of New York City and Albany delivered a political anti-gun stump speech. He demanded the Democrats shut down the nation’s government until the gun control laws that are not working in New York are legislated nation-wide.   

 

We certainly agree with Cuomo’s demand to shut down the non-essential portions of the federal government. However, the laws that the citizens of his state are roundly ignoring are nothing we could tolerate under our Constitutionally guaranteed Rights. Better try again, Stumpy.    

 

Ronald Reagan Carried a Gun While President
Another President had very different ideas about personal gun possession and use. Brian Meltzer, author of the new book The President’s Shadow, reports that President Reagan carried a weapon in a bag or briefcase with him after the assassination attempt. A Secret Service agent revealed this info to Meltzer while he was researching the book.  

Looks like the nickname Ronnie Raygun was a little bit closer to the truth than his detractors would have hoped. Good on you, Mr. President!   

For any commentator: Sooooo, what gun do you think Reagan carried?  A 1911?  ;^)’  Old School Cool.  

 

Paul- I remember an old interview where RR stated that he saved a woman from an attack from his room by pointing an unloaded handgun at the perpetrator. It was widely thought of as a made up story until NPR (seriously!) tracked down the nurse who corroborated the story.

 

CF-Yep, a 45 Colt single action, if I remember correctly.  Definitely old school cool.

 

Felon Shoots and Paralyzes a Veteran Outside of St Louis Cardinal Stadium
This story strikes too close to home for one of our staff members. A 43 year old veteran celebrating his mother’s birthday at a St Louis Cardinals game was shot and paralyzed by a felon with a decades long rap sheet.

Chris Sanna and his girlfriend were walking back to their car after the Cardinals game when they were assaulted by two armed robbers. Despite giving the criminals everything they wanted, Sanna was shot in the back. The bullet punctured his liver and lung after destroying two vertebrae and his spinal cord. Doctors do not expect Sanna to walk again. There has been a recent spate of victims being shot after a robbery, perhaps related to the racial tensions in the city.  


Several days later, police arrested Kilwa Jones for the assault. Jones was already in jail for beating the mother of his two children. Police found video of Jones using Sanna’s credit cards. They’ve also recovered a 9mm Hi-Point from the career criminal’s car.


The Cardinals do not allow any weapons in their stadium; that includes knives and pepper spray. They do back up their policy with metal detectors, but that works only inside the stadium walls. Fans must walk the downtown streets to get to get to their cars. The fans are known to be weaponless – and very attractive to criminals. From personal observation, city police and security guards are largely absent from the streets after the games.  Fans disarmed – and abandoned – Cardinals games will be few and far between.      

 

Rob- Gun free zone.  fugitive from justice.  Tell me again how the state will protect us from thugs.

 

Governor Brown Vetoes SB347
It’s a sad commentary on the state when “Flaky Jerry” Brown, Governor Moonbeam of California, is one of the more rational political voices.

 

Senate Bill 347, authored by Senator Hannah Beth Jackson, a member of the Barking Moonbat Caucus, would have eliminated Second Amendment rights for some minor firearm-related misdemeanors. For example, possession of a single round of ammunition on school grounds could have cost a citizen their firearm rights for ten years. Brown vetoed this bill and eight others, stating; “Each of these bills creates a new crime — usually by finding a novel way to characterize and criminalize conduct that is already proscribed …without commensurate benefit.”

 

Congratulations Governor Brown, for bringing a small amount of common sense to California.

 

Unfortunately, sanity was apparently only a fleeting acquaintance, as Jerry has signed Senate Bill 707. The bill, despite the experience of the UCC murders, prohibits licensed, law-abiding CCW holders from carrying firearms on school property. The law further criminalizes the simple possession of ammunition on campus, even without the firearm. Apparently, the politicians decided to Gun-Free Zone HARDER!

 

Rob- This is more of the culture war on gun owners in California.  So the inadvertent possession of ammunition on school grounds was vetoed in one bill and then passed in the next bill.  The democrat politicians of California are abusing gun owners while they build another school shooting.  The California Attorney General said the legislature should show autopsy photographs of the murdered students in order to pass more gun laws.  I like that.  I want to show the pictures of the murdered students to show how their gun free school zones failed again and again.

 

John – I think Gov. Brown is trying to split the baby. He vetoes one anti-rights bill and then signs another. It doesn’t work that way. You are either pro-rights or anti-rights. There is really no in-between. The fact that SB 707 creates a privileged class – retired LEO – is wrong.

 

Professor leaves Texas for Australia

Here is a lighthearted take on the very somber subject of guns on campus.  MIssouri and Texas passed laws allowing carry on campus.  A local campus denied its staff the right to carry.  In similar situations, some professors have written articles saying students are at a greater risk once licensed concealed carriers are disarmed.  One law school professor at the University of Missouri is suing the school for a civil rights violation by denying him the right to carry. A business professor at Purdue in Indiana is also fighting for that same right.

 

John- William A. Jacobson is a clinical professor of law at Cornell Law School.  He also blogs at the Legal Insurrection website, and he came out against gun-free schools.

 

In contrast, one professor at the University of Texas at Austin said he will leave Texas and go to Australia to teach because of Texas carry laws.  Another 390 faculty members from UT said they would not allow students with CHLs to carry in their classrooms.  Given that few of their students are over 21, that is a hollow threat.

 

John- They could be 18 if they were in the military.

John –

 

Susan- Rachel had this to say about her fellow texans.

Maybe all the anti-gun professors will leave and get replaced by a friendlier faculty.

I hoped that someone who has the credentials and education to be a professor would understand some basic logic, including but not limited to the following points:

-We’ve already had campus carry for almost 2 decades, just not inside the school buildings

-this new law does not allow 18 year old freshmen to have any more access to guns, nor does it permit them to use guns to murder professors

-someone intent on shooting a professor out of anger is not super likely to go to the trouble, expense, and time of obtaining a chl.

Unfortunately, UT Austin professors are baffled by such simple arguments.

 

Rob- Most of these professors are elitists.  A university president with either conviction or bravery would accept their resignation and say good riddance.  If you’re carrying in class, it is not a sin to tell a lie to someone who does not deserve to know the truth.

 

Gun Quotes- Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.  Martin Luther King, Jr.  I would add, do you love your family and community enough to protect them?

 

Hang on everybody, we’ll be back with our guest (Name).

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Segment 3 Interviews

 

Campus Carry in Texas

Campus Carry goes into effect on August 1. It will allow CHL holders to carry concealed inside buildings on campus. Schools in Texas are currently deciding what their policies will be, since they are allowed to restrict carry in areas of their choosing. Our activists are speaking up to try to prevent carry restrictions.

 

Guests:

Tina Maldonado, UT staff member and chapter facilitator of A Girl & A Gun

Brittany Sutton, student leader of Texas A&M Students for Concealed Carry on Campus

 

Action items:

  1. UT-Austin is conducting a survey. Please share it with your people who are connected to UT and ask them to fill it out. This includes students, staff, faculty, and also anybody in the community. Link: https://utexas.qualtrics.com/jfe/form/SV_9QrRbfdWtcjk0Bf
  2. Everybody in Texas knows somebody connected to A&M. Find those pro-gun students and tell them to join the facebook group Texas A&M Students for Concealed Carry on Campus. There will be public forums – make sure they go and speak up. Link: https://www.facebook.com/groups/tamusccc/
  3. Befriend a college student and take him or her shooting.

 

Segment 4 DGUs

 

Houston Deputy Shoots Home Invader

A Houston, Texas criminal made a very poor choice in the victim selection process. Behind Door #1 stood a Harris County Deputy Sheriff and his duty weapon. When his door was kicked down and the invader rushed into his home, the deputy fired. The suspect fled in a car likely driven by a second suspect. Because blood was found in the hallway, it is almost certain the Deputy wounded the invader. Area hospitals have been alerted to watch for a black male with a gunshot wound.


We note that the Deputy was in the same desperate situation that many normal homeowners are finding themselves. He relied on his weapon to save his life, as many of the other homeowners have done – and will do in the future. That’s certainly a common sense reason to own a firearm.  

 

Three Against One Turns Out Poorly For Home Invaders

A homeowner turned the tables on three home invaders – through the use of a firearm.  A Dallas-Fort Worth homeowner found himself under attack by three invaders. Their robbery and assault was going as planned until the homeowner was able to grab a gun. Neighbors heard the five shots that hit all three invaders. The criminals ran from the house and escaped in a car driven by an accomplice. The driver abandoned the car at an intersection, and the three wounded robbers were arrested and taken to a hospital. The feckless fourth remains at large.

 

Rob- Point shooting was taught at an NRA safety class.

John- look for one handed point shooting Col. Rex Applegate.

 

Husband Shoots From Behind a Robber
As they say: Location, Location, Location. An elderly Indianapolis couple is together today because the husband used the advantages of position, stealth and a firearm to stop a deadly attack.

The 75-year-old woman was at their property rental office when she found herself under the gun of a 27-year-old attacker. Her husband heard the commotion from the front office, entered the room from behind the attacker and saw the gun pointed at his wife’s head. The man describes his fear for her life and shooting into the robber’s back. When the criminal got up and pointed his gun again, the elderly man fired twice more. Those shots struck the thief in the head. The attacker is in critical condition in a local hospital. He has a long rap sheet with several outstanding warrants for his arrest.

 

Police will not charge the elderly man. A spokesman stated that if someone comes into your home and you’re in imminent fear of danger for your life, you have a right to protect yourself.

In such a deadly situation, an armed citizen is under no obligation to warn the attacker, nor chivalrously face him. The elderly man was completely justified in shooting the attacker in the back without warning. He rightly used every advantage he had in that deadly situation.

 

However, most firearm instructors advise to shoot until the threat stops. Allowing the criminal to regain his feet and point the gun again is not a good strategy. Many self defense instructors also believe that with a finger on the gun’s trigger, a central nervous system hit is best. For immediate incapacitation, without the reflexive tightening of the trigger finger, a shot to the brainstem, the medulla oblongata, is recommended. However, the citizen must be able to make the shot to a racquet ball sized target at the base of the brain. Education, training and practice are a must.  

This episode is just one more common sense reason to have a gun — and to know how to use it.  

 

Rob-

 

Another Craigslist Ambush

Police say at least two criminals were shot after a Craigslist ambush was foiled by an intended victim.
A father and son from Grand Rapids drove into Battle Creek, Michigan to buy a car. When they arrived, they were jumped by three robbers. The son, a concealed carry license holder, fired twice, hitting two of the alleged attackers. The third criminal is still on the loose. Because of the son’s action, neither father nor son were injured.  

 

It should come as no surprise that people with cash or valuables meeting anonymous strangers at an unfamiliar location are in a risky situation. Buyers and sellers should both take precautions. Many police departments are setting up Craigslist Transaction Zones outside of their stations. We urge our listeners to stay careful, observant, and prepared.     

 

Don’t Torque Off The Old Guy

“I wanted to shoot him really bad. I really wanted to shoot him”; said Old Guy Robert Hamm, who had his 10 AM nap interrupted by a man carrying an armful of his tools. “I just pointed the gun at him and told him I’d blow him in two if he moved.” The very expressive Old Guy made the thief lie on the floor until the Carter County, Kentucky Sheriff’s Department arrived. Hamm said he’d known the suspect from birth and he has a reputation for this sort of thing.

Unfortunately, the 75-year-old might get his shot, as the home-invader is still at large. The suspect was so intoxicated from pills and booze that he was taken to a hospital to detox. A day or so later, the thief checked himself out of the hospital — and disappeared. Hamm felt it’s inexcusable that a man who broke into his home carrying a knife was given a chance to walk away. “It made me madder than hell.” The Old Guy had predicted the legal system would let the burglar off lightly. “I’ve seen where they’ve turned people loose who’ve done it four or five times,” he said. Officials say the burglar could be held in contempt of court (ooooo!) since he didn’t turn himself in.

Hamm’s not overly concerned about a return visit. The Old Guy said, “I wish he would. I would finish the job.” The thief should know that you just Don’t Torque-Off The Old Guys. And you certainly don’t interrupt their naps.  

 

We post each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com  Please take a minute and share them with a friend.

 

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Segment 5 Show close

 

Listener e-mail discussion

 

Email #1

Subject: Guns in the cold

 

Apologies for the delay in sending this in. You had a guest on recently discussing the effects of extreme cold on the functioning of semiautomatic weapons. Immediately it made me remember the exploits of my “cousins” back in Finland during the Winter War with Russia at the outset of WW2. The winter of 39 was one of the coldest on record, so cold that the Baltic Sea froze ships in place. The Finns had to change how they handled the cleaning of their guns, adding gasoline to their gun oil for their rifles,  mainly Mosin Nagants.  For automatics and their artillery they used a mix of alcohol and glycerine to avoid the freeze. I’ll attach an image from William Trotters book Frozen Hell (an amazing read FYI).

 

As a side note, this would have been the practice of Simo Hyha during the war. Hyha is by far the highest numbered sniper in World history, especially confounding when you consider the short time span of his engagement. Also his weapon of choice was an iron sighted Mosin, scopes raised his head too high.

 

Love the show, keep it up.

 

Aaron

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Email from Bud with the Subject line Crazy Gun Studies

 

I happen to run across this interview today and couldn’t believe what this professor was stating.  I immediately posted it on Facebook, with a detailed overview and the links, to show to my pro-rights friends and followers.  I couldn’t locate it on Facebook, so I reposted it later in the day.  I think that I will post it daily and in different areas of Facebook and other social media sites to ensure that it is seen by many.

 

Here is my posting

 

Is anyone buying what this “Professor” is selling when it comes to CHL’s, guns and crime rates?  “There isn’t any correlation between concealed handgun license holders and crime” according to the professor and his colleagues at Texas A&M.   He also describes how they collected and formulated their data, which is drastically different than normal research performed by others.  You can listen to a short interview that the professor gave on Wednesday, September 30, 2015 at http://dfw.cbslocal.com/audio/minute-with-mitch.

 

Texas A&M Regents Professor Emeritus Dr. Charles Phillips states that he was not surprised by their findings.  He said a couple of things during this short interview that leads me to believe that he has an agenda in obtaining his results.  One is he states that “according to the NRA, if you don’t carry a weapon, you are a CHUMP”.  And secondly, “the NRA’s definition of a victim is someone who doesn’t own a gun.”  I’ve never heard anyone from the NRA state this and I’ve never seen it written on their website.  Maybe the Dr. can point this out or provide a link where I can find this information?

 

He states that their research shows that the number of CHL holders in Texas counties has a direct correlation with the number of firearm dealers in that county, but nothing due to crime rates.  CHL holders are very seldom convicted of crimes, but when they do happen they are big time serious crimes. He references previous studies that he or Texas A&M have done named “When CHL Holders Break Bad”.   In these studies they found:

  • There are very few convictions or occurrences of crimes by CHL holders
  • They are violent crimes
  • A firearm is usually involved
  • There is a death

 

He also states that “easy access to a means of deadly force means that it is likely to be used.”

 

Dr. Phillips cites 3 recent studies conducted by the American Journal of Public Health which conclude that more guns (he doesn’t state whether legal or illegal, and I have not read them yet) equal:

  • More police officers are killed
  • Higher rates of young male suicides
  • Guns are more likely to be used by, or on, another occupant of the home, rather than to protect you from an outsider or stranger (criminal).

 

The Dr. provides the following advice – “If you are thinking of buying a firearm for home defense, consider the following:

  • Guns in households are dangerous
  • It is more likely that GUN suicides will occur
  • Don’t believe that you are going to save yourself from, or during, a criminal encounter.”

 

Just for the record, I am biased on gun ownership, CHL holders and I’m a lifetime member of the NRA.

 

I hope that you guys can create a research topic on firearm studies and results in a near future podcast.  I would really like to hear someone have Dr. Phillips on their show to challenge him on his research tactics and conclusions. Maybe having Dr. John Lott on the show to discuss specific issues with the way that studies such as this one is slanted for certain results would also be very enlightening?  We all hear of different studies, with major differences in their results and are often left wondering who is right.

 

Keep up the good work on the Polite Society podcast.  I look forward to listening to it each week and I have even gone back and listened to the older podcasts to hear topics of the times and the fine DGU stories.

 

Thank you,

Bud

 

-John – Believe or not, I actually know Charles Phillips. Or did. He was an asst prof of political science at UNC-Chapel Hill when I was in grad school. He got there in about 1981 and left in 1987 when he didn’t get tenure. He was one of the young liberal professors. I didn’t know he had become a prof of public health.

 

Rob- I’ve read the studies.  They count a criminal bringing a gun on your property as if it was your gun… and therefore you had a gun on premises.

 

=============================================

Jacob emailed us a video of a hero who stepped in and ended up losing his life trying to help rescue a woman being threatened by a man with a gun

 

http://higherperspectives.com/homeless-man/?utm_source=cleo&utm_content=inf_10_34_2&ts_pid=2

 

This guy is a hero. Full stop. He made a risky move when he saw an opportunity, and it could have turned out very poorly, but I find it hard to fault a man who is so clearly willing to give his life for a stranger. He gets shot, mortally wounded, and continues fighting to subdue the attacker and save the victim. I hesitate to call him a victim in return, because I doubt he would want that – I think he knew the trade he was making and went in knowing he might not come out. I think it really drives home what Paul always says – weapons and tactical advantages might make defending yourself easier, but the fight is never over as long as you’re conscious and willing to fight back.

==========================================================

William also emailed us.

 

Greetings All,

I’d sent this weeks ago but I am a world class master procrastinator. I’ll reference several shows.

You had referenced the wonderful NY trigger and kind of equated it to that of a double action revolver.

While that can be true it really depends on the revolver, specially the time frame of it’s design and build. My wife has an old Webley revolver made back in the early 1900’s. It was carried by her grandfather who served as a sheriff somewhere in West Texas. We don’t shoot it but the trigger pull is such that I’m tempted to use two fingers when I play with it. (Not very often due to its on hammer firing pin.) I suspect that is very close to the NY trigger. I hear the new S&W J-frames are as bad but haven’t pulled the trigger on one to see. On the other hand the K-frames made back in the 50’s and 60’s when the police were using them were very nice. Maybe 7 to 8 pounds, smooth and were a joy to shoot, if you used proper trigger technique. Still kicking myself for selling one that I had. And while python’s stack a bit differently I’ve heard few complaints about their triggers.

Next topic. Several time you, and those on other podcasts, seem to make a distinction between the police and civilians. Unless a police officer is also a member of the military they are also civilians. While that is nitpicking word usage we really need to be careful as those opposed to our views will use anything they can against us. Perhaps “private citizen” would be a better term to use for distinction.

Last topic for this email is the apparent misconception with regard to using a gun to protect property in Texas. In spite of what has been said Texans can no more use guns just to protect property than anyone else. We do however have a bit more leeway. As it was explained to me back when I took a concealed carry class in the 90’s. The teacher was a police officer and what he said summarized and in my words.

If I see someone in my workshop I can go out and confront him. However unless he has a weapon, picks up something to use as such, or makes a furtive movement I can’t just shoot him. I can however have a gun in my hand. At night things are a bit different because I can’t see as well. Does he have a weapon I’m not seeing? What during the day time might look innocent might look like a dangerous furtive motion at night. Is someone else hiding in the darkness. It all comes down to whether we think we are in mortal danger.

>From past episodes I know you will say that you shouldn’t go out and confront them. While that may be true it is a personal decision and realize that when people live in rural areas things are a bit different. That 911 call which may take 10 long minutes in town can take hours in the country. The last time I needed an officer’s assistance they had to patch me through to the responding officer so I could talk him in. Couldn’t find the place.

Either way, I for one, don’t want to just sit and watch while someone carries off all my stuff. I guess it boils down to the feeling that if something is worth having it is worth fighting for. It is a decision I’d just have to make at the time and the situation. If there is a team, they can take what they want. My life isn’t worth the risk.

 

Is a human life worth my table saw? I don’t know. Is the bad guy really human or a predatory animal? While legally human you have to wonder what will he do on his next job? I think we all would do what was necessary to stop him if he was stealing a firearm. It’s a very complex issue with lots of what ifs.

Enjoy your show. Keep up the good work or I’ll cut what I pay for your show. 8->

William

 

Rob- badged and unbadged civilians

Gary-

=====================================================

 

Paul: Rob, do you have any new posts from your SlowFacts blog you want to mention?

 

Rob- I posted the links to the Gun Rights Policy Conference along with a list of the speakers.  I did that for each of the three segments we recorded.  I also wrote up a review of the conference.

 

After the recent murders in Oregon, we’ve heard the howls for more gun control.  The politicians and news media got me thinking, and I asked myself if gun control works.  We know it doesn’t work in schools, but I wondered if I was missing something, so I looked at the data from each of the 50 states.  I put the states in order based on their level of gun control, and then looked at the FBI data for the crime rates in each state.  I printed the data out as a graph so anyone can see it.  After looking at the results, I can say that gun control does not reduce violent crime.  The article is called “Does Gun Control Work”  I’ve seen several other authors write similar articles, so it is a good time to study that question.

 

This may sound simplistic to our long time listeners, but most people have not studied these issues at all.  They think violent crime has increased when violent crime has fallen since the early 1990s.  I want to thank our listeners for reading past the headlines and staying informed.

 

In another article I said gun-free zones and fatherless boys are killing us.  That was in the article called Liberal Politicians Blinded by Feel-Good Policy on Guns.

 

My articles are up at Ammoland and Clash Daily.  After the shooting in Oregon, I noticed I had 55 entries in my category called Public Violence.  You can find all of them on my blog at slow facts dot wordpress dot com.

 

John, tell us what’s new at your blog no lawyers only guns and money

 

I’ve done a number of posts since GRPC but this is one I want to highlight. Dr. Carson said that if the Jews had not been disarmed it could have made a difference with regard to the Holocaust. He was correct and the mainstream media piled on trying to discredit his statements. They are trying to make out like he is a kook and trigger happy. Frankly, they are afraid of the truth. One need only listen to our friends in JPFO and read the writings of Stephen Halbrook to know that.

 

I will have an important post coming out on the 15th. It will be called Every Picture Tells A Story, Part 3. It will be in honor of Maine going live with Constitutional Carry on that day. It graphically shows the growth of freedom from 1986 through 2014.

 

That and more is at only guns and money dot blogspot dot com.

 

We would like to thank Charlie Foxtrot for writing up show notes for us. Even though you don’t hear him on the air he is certainly part of what you do hear. Look at his blog at not one more gun law dot blogspot dot com

 

Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast.  I’d like to thank (Guests) for joining us today.  co-hosts, will you be with us next time?  I’m looking forward to it.  Until the next time…

Gary: stay safe,

Rob: be aware,

John: and we’ll see you down the road.

 

(after show close) How could we have made this episode better?

 

(DO NOT READ)Look at the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.  Subscribing from the link in our show notes helps Bob and Ben as well as helps us here at the Polite Society Podcast.

 

(DO NOT READ)Join your local civil rights group like the New Jersey Second Amendment Society, Arizona Citizens Defense League, Gun Owners of California, Commonwealth Second Amendment,  Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Florida Carry, Georgia Carry, Georgia Gun Owners, Grass Roots North Carolina, Illinois Carry, Maryland Shall Issue,  Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry, and  Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.

 

There are Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance,  Nebraska Firearms Owners Association,   Citizens for a Safer New Jersey, New York State Rifle & Pistol Association,  Palmetto Concealed Carry, Open Carry Texas, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Virginia Open Carry,  West Virginia Citizens Defense League, wisconsingunowners.org, and Wyoming Gun Owners.

 

For our Canadian listeners, and their supporters, join the Canadian Shooting Sports Association and the Canadian National Firearms Association.  If YOUR state or local organization isn’t read each episode, then send us an email and we’ll add them!

 

(DO NOT READ)The Polite Society download app is out on Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.

 

SAF Gun Rights Policy Conference 2015- Video Segments

PSP crew

We live streamed the 2015 Gun Rights Policy Conference held in Phoenix, Arizona.  Here are the links to the video along with the scheduled program for each segment.

Segment 1- GRPC 2015
Saturday 8:00 a.m. CALL TO ORDER- Julianne Versnel
8:15 a.m. State of the Gun Rights Battle- Joseph Tartaro, Alan M. Gottlieb


8:45 a.m. Federal Affairs Briefing- Mark Barnes, Larry Pratt, Joe Waldron



9:15 am. State Legislative Affairs Briefing I- Stephen Aldstadt, Andreas Allen, Brent Carlton, Dave Kopp, Tony Montanarella, Richard Pearson, Alexander Roubian







10:00 a.m. State Legislative Affairs Overview- Trevor Santos

Break

10:30 a.m. State Legislative Affairs Briefing II- Sean Caranna, Jerry Henry, Genie Jennings, Philip Journey, Don Turner, Paul Valone, Philip Van Cleave
11:15 a.m. The Impact of 3D Printing on the Future of Gun Control- Alan Gura
11:30 a.m. The Global Gun Grabber’s “Alphabet Soup”- Rick Patterson, Julianne Versnel, Allen Youngman
Break
12:15 p.m. Awards Luncheon- Mark Walters, Kirk Evans, Alan Gura, Governor Jim Gilmore,
Break
2:00 p.m. Winning Firearms Freedom One Lawsuit at a Time- Paloma Capanna, Don Kilmer, David Sigale, Miko Tempski

GRPC Segment 1

GRPC Segment 1

Segment 2- GRPC 2015
Saturday 3:00 p.m. The Gun Rights Battle from a Media Perspective- AWR Hawkins, Kevin Michalowski, Mark Walters
Break
3:45 p.m. Heller & McDonald: How We Got There- David T. Hardy
4:00 p.m. Reversing School Disarmament- Jim Irvine
4:15 p.m. The Urban Initiative- Rashad Gray, Joe Tartaro
4:30 p.m. Facts vs. False Claims- John R. Lott
5:00 p.m. What’s Wrong with Obama’s Gun Control Medicine- John Edeen, Arthur Przebinda, Timothy Wheeler, Robert Young
5:30 p.m. Q & A on Saturday sessions
GRPC Segment 2

 

Segment 3- GRPC 2015
Sunday 9:00 a.m. Second Amendment Outliers: Blades, Suppressors and Hunting- Carrie Lightfoot, Todd Rathner, Doug Ritter
9:30 a.m. Using Media to Advance Gun Rights- Charles Heller, Don Irvine, John Richardson, Herb Stupp, Cheryl Todd, Dave Workman
10:00 a.m. Oddities: Language, Movies, Journalism and Guns- Alan Korwin, J. Neil Schulman
10:15 a.m. Outreach in a Brave New World- Andrew Gottlieb, Bryan Hartong, Philip Watson

10:45 a.m. State Coalition Building- Tom Bolioli, Gene Hoffman,
11:15 a.m. Gun Owners and the 2016 Elections- Alan Gottlieb, Jeff Knox
11:45 a.m. Q&A on morning panels
12:00 Noon Report of the Resolutions Committee
1:00 p.m. Closing remarks

GRPC Segment 3

Feel free to share the links.

~_~_

Rob

Full Episode Download: http://traffic.libsyn.com/politicsandguns/349.mp3

Open and Personal News Segment:

News Segment 1: 

News Segment 2:

Interview Segment 1: Lance Reeter from www.theShootersHangout.com

DGU Segment:

Email and Show Close:

 

Introduction

“An armed society is a polite society.. and this is the Polite Society Podcast where we support and report on civilian self-defense.”

Paul: Welcome to episode 349 sponsored by the Firearms Policy Coalition recorded on Sunday, September 20th, 2015, I’m Paul Lathrop

Rob: I’m Rob Morse and on tonight’s show we will talk with Lance Reeter who started The Shooters Hangout.com

John: I’m John Richardson, and we’ll discuss a poll saying that registered voters don’t want any new gun laws.

Gary: I’m Gary Daugherty and in one of our self-defense stories we find that it took the police over an hour to arrive .. so climb aboard

Rob: strap in

John : and hang on!

Paul:  episode 349 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.

Show intro music.

 

Seg 1- Personal news from each participant (when you are done with your segment please ask the next person what has been up with them)

 

John – I am still trying to get over this crud. However, I have brought in the big guns to clear it up before I leave for Phoenix – the high-powered cough syrup that pharmacists keep in a safe. Seems to be working. I am also working on what I plan to say in my presentation at GRPC. As the only person coming from new media, I see myself as representing all of us who blog or podcast. I only have five minutes and that can be a lot of time or not enough.  I’m open to suggestions.

 

Rob- Got my standard capacity magazines.  Nothing else.

 

Gary – What training do you have coming up?

rob

Paul – Sorry that I wasn’t on last weekend’s show, and sorry that it took so long to get the episode out. What usually releases Sunday evening didn’t release until six days later on Saturday afternoon. On Friday of last week I got the call that I needed to take a California run for a driver that couldn’t make the run that night. So on Sunday while everyone else was recording I was driving to make a Monday drop. After we finish tonight I get to tear down the studio and pack it up as we leave on Tuesday afternoon to start the drive to Phoenix.

Break

 

Seg 2- News

 

Poll show Registered Voters Resist Additional Gun Laws

This had to have hurt: A CNN/ ORC International poll shows that the nation’s registered voters are increasingly becoming concerned with gun rights as well as other internal issues. A significant majority of us now believe that gun laws are about right or too restrictive. The recent poll showed a loss of faith in gun control, as 56 percent of registered voters doubted more gun control “would be able to prevent those with mental health problems from buying guns” and 58 percent doubted more laws “would keep guns out of the hands of convicted criminals.”

(here, this will make it feel better.)

 

The above findings are a significant improvement over prior years. The difference is the ongoing, broad-based efforts of communication and education. Gun rights leaders, gun owners and activists, like our listeners should be proud of their success.  And mindful that there’s still so much to be done.  

 

John – I think people are seeing more restrictive gun laws don’t stop anything.

 

California Residents: “Attention Scum, You Loot We Shoot.”

When an out of control brush fire forced residents of Pope Valley, California to flee, they left behind a pointed message: “Attention Scum, You Loot  – We Shoot.” There have been many reports of looting with the 70,000 acre wildfire. Residents who were able to stay behind will be keeping their eyes open.

 

Only media, first responders, and those authorized by law enforcement are allowed to enter the area. However, tech-savvy looters are using social media to locate evacuated homes. Two were arrested with burned-out safes in their vehicle. When things get hot, it’s comforting to have some way of protecting yourself from those all too willing to take advantage of a crisis.  

The Obama Administration Is Doing Something Good On Guns
It’s probably just one more screw-up, but it does look like the Obama administration Is doing something right on guns. The U.S. Department of Justice granted $2.4 million for firearm-safety education and free gun locks through NSSF’s Project ChildSafe program.

Show friend Miguel Gonzalez saw the antis immediately lose their minds. The misnamed gun-banning group Committee to Stop Gun Violence (CSGV) took to Twitter to write a frothing damnation of the grant. They ignored the long running successes of Project ChildSafe and the NRA’s Eddie Eagle to complain about the NSSF. Apparently, the CSGV’s hatred of their blood enemy overwhelms their concern for the children. Shame on them.  

We haven’t been able to say this in a very long time, but Good on the Obama administration.

John – CSGV believes that the state should have the monopoly on violence.

Appeals Court Strikes Down Some DC Gun Laws  

The U.S. Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit ruled 2-1 that the city of Washington DC must allow gun owners to register several firearms at a time.  The city had claimed that honest gun owners only needed to register one gun a month.  The judge said “the suggestion that a gun trafficker would bring fewer guns into the District because he could not register more than one per month there lacks the support of experience and of common sense.”  This lawsuit was brought by Dick Heller, the same human rights advocate who was the title plaintiff in the original DC VS Heller case.  The court also said gun owners cannot be forced to re-register their firearms every three years, and the city cannot demand gun owners bring their guns to city hall, or pass a test on firearms laws.

 

Unfortunately, the court upheld other parts of the law, such as requiring that rifles and shotguns must be registered along with handguns. The ruling upheld that gun owners pay certain fees, complete a firearms safety training course, and be fingerprinted and photographed.

 

But wait.. there is more and we’ve saved the best news for last.   DC copied its oppressive firearms laws from the laws in New York City and Maryland.  That means we have regulations in New York and Maryland that have been found to be illegal in Washington, DC.  A federal district court will have to decide who is correct.

 

Rob- bullets- re I wonder about the bullets outlawed in DC. Mark Witaschek was found guilty of “attempted possession of unlawful ammunition” for having antique replica muzzleloader bullets.  Because they called it attempted possession, Witaschek was denied a jury trial.  DC says you can only have ammunition for guns you register.  DC also says you don’t have to register muzzle loading rifles, but you can still be convicted of owning muzzle loading ammunition.  That is insane bigotry against gun owners.  Anyone heard of a criminal using a muzzleloading firearm in the last hundred years?

 

DC still has their special need requirement before citizens can get a carry permit.  The city will be back in court.

 

John – I think the ruling Heller II should be helpful in the Wynn case or so I hear.

 

BREAK

 

Papa John’s Pizza Stands By Employe Who Used a Gun

Here something we can all sink our teeth into: A Decatur, Georgia Papa John’s Pizza franchise will stand behind their delivery driver who used a gun to defend her life. While Papa John’s prohibits their employees from carrying a gun, the woman will not be fired, but moved to another position within the firm.

The woman’s Sunday night pizza delivery turned into a violent ambush. A thug pulled the  driver from her car while another got behind the wheel. She was slammed to the ground and things were looking bleak for her. However, the woman had a pistol in her pocket; she fired from the ground, striking Donquaz Stevenson, 24, in the face.  Stevenson was captured hiding in a backyard, abandoned by his confederate escaping in the woman’s car. Authorities said the woman was protecting her life and there will be no charges.  

 

The job of delivery driver is one of the most dangerous in the States. We applaud the company’s recognition that the drivers do not have to die for Papa John.

 

Mmmmmm, Papa John’s Pizza

 

John – While I’m not a fan of Papa John’s pizza I may have to reconsider.

Paul

 

You don’t have to take a bullet for your boss

The Utah Supreme Court said you don’t have to choose between your life or your job.  Walmart fired six employees because they fought back against threatening customers.  Store policy says  employees must withdraw when threatened.  The court said that employees could be safer if the defended themselves.  Those situations included cases where they could not retreat or if they were immediately threatened with injury or death.  After the court’s ruling, those employees who sued for their jobs will have their case go to trial.

 

Rob- Walmart said everyone is safer if employees retreat.  They judge said everyone is safer if employees use their judgement and management does not second guess them.

Chicago mocked in the satire site “The Onion”

We talked about Chicago last week, the city where jobs, gun rights and honest citizens go to die?  Chicago’s reputation is so bad that the city was mocked at the online satire site “The Onion”.

 

Quote “Chicago officials unveiled Monday the city’s new gun-sharing service, “QuikShot,” which allows individuals to check out a loaded firearm for short periods of time.

The municipal initiative, through which users can rent semi-automatic pistols, shotguns and rifles at more than 250 self-service kiosks, has reportedly been designed to make firepower easily available to residents and tourists alike nearly everywhere within the city limits.”

 

Thanks to listener Greg for sending in the link.

 

Rob-  I know it is only average satire, but I think a business like that has possibilities in free america.

 

The Donald on Guns

We’re seeing position papers come out from the presidential candidates.  Trump posted his position on guns this week.  We summarize it.

 

Enforce laws on the books and put criminals in jail.

Stop ignoring mental illness and fix our broken mental health system.

Defend the rights of law abiding gun owners and stop gun bans and magazine bans.

Fix NICS so states report criminals and the mentally ill.

Form a national right to concealed carry.

Allow the military to carry on base.

 

Rob- I didn’t know The Donald was a listener to our podcast.

 

Gun Quote

I will fight to defend liberty because my family knows what it’s like to lose it. Ted Cruz

 

Hang on everybody, we’ll be back with Lance Reeter from The Shooters Hangout.

 

advertisement Concealment Solutions

Segment 3 Interviews

Lance Reeter from www.theShootersHangout.com

I’m talking to Lance Reeter from San Diego, California.  Lance started TheShootersHangout.com  It is a regional online clearing house of shooting activities.  Lance also includes news articles of interest to most shooters.

Lance, how is it being a gun owner in Southern California.

 

Here in Krazyfornia gun owners have to deal with a lot of things that most of the rest of the country do not have to deal with.

 

Things such as:

Not having a concealed weapon permit in California?

Being limited to 10 rounds in your handgun AND your rifle?

Being required to have an asinine bullet button on your rifle?

Not being able to own a short-barreled rifle for home protection?

Being limited to buying only handguns on an approved CA roster?

Why is it that the rest of the country doesn’t have to worry about these backwards things, but here in Krazyfornia our gun rights are severely limited!

The reason is that individually we have no power against liberal politicians. By myself I cant change things, by yourself you cant change things. Together we can change everything!

So what sort of things have you done to change the firearms culture in San Diego?

 

How?

We do that the same way Colorado did it, by unseating and ending the careers of anti-2nd Amendment politicians! Thus putting career ending fear into all other politicians who even THINK about taking away the peoples gun rights!

We cannot sit and simply HOPE that things will get better. That tactic only results in more gun rights being taken away.

We cannot sit and HOPE someone else will change things for us, we get the same results.

We all have to work together, and together it is not hard work.

Usually all that it takes to make major changes is to shoot off an email or fax when a gun right bill is up for a vote. Or vote for the right candidate in a political race. Just that easy!

But we all have to be on the same page so that you know that an email needs to be sent out, or a certain candidate needs your vote.

That is where gun rights organizations like Gun Owners of California come in. They are a force multiplier buy leveraging the power of hundreds of thousands of gun owners in California. Also media organizations like the news site TheShootersHangout.com work hard to keep the gun owning public informed and educated on important issues.

On August 25th the shooting community came out to meet both of these organizations at a free social event 2nd Amendment Night!

They dont ask a lot from anyone, but if every gun owner is willing to carry one small cup of water then we can flood the political landscape in Krazyfornia and get our gun rights back!

Tuesday, August 25th the free news site TheShootersHangout.com and gun rights organization Gun Owners of California hosted a 2nd Amendment Night at a large microbrewery in San Diego county.

-There were drink specials, woodfired pizzas and BBQ.

-They also set up a mini gun show set up with 25 local firearms businesses setting up display tables, showing the products and services they provide.

400 people showed up for this event, including almost a dozen pro 2nd Amendment politicians.

This event was all about bringing the shooting community together to form a cohesive and powerful coalition that will be successful in restoring Californias gun rights. This coalition being made up of the shooting enthusiasts, manufacturers, retailers, instructors, gun rights organizations, the media, and pro 2nd Amendment politicians.

 

To follow the activities of Gun Owners of California and TheShootersHangout.com simply go to www.TheShootersHangout.com and subscribe to their free email newsletter.

 

Segment 4 DGUs


A Long Wait For 911

We covered this terrifying story last week: A Detroit woman had to shoot an invader who broke into her home for the second time in two years. What we didn’t know was that the woman had called 911 an hour before the shooting to plead for the police. She was told she would have to wait her turn. She huddled in fear until the violent felon finally found her. Fortunately, she had a firearm, and she was able to defend herself when her government would not.

When seconds count… the cops could be an hour, or a lifetime, away.  

John – Unlike the story we covered from Pope Valley, Detroit isn’t a rural area. It is a major US city.

Paul-  young lady from Oklahoma took an hour as well but she was in VERY rural Oklahoma

Gary –

 

Sometimes There’s a High Cost For Defending The Family

Nothing is certain in this life. Sometimes self-defense comes at a very high price. The very same price that not defending oneself might incur.  A Houston area man paid the ultimate price to protect the lives of his wife and daughter.  A price that all who carry concealed or keep a weapon for home defense should consider.  

 

A family’s trip to a Houston ice cream parlor was interrupted by an armed robber. The felon jumped into the vehicle and pointed a gun at the wife demanding “everything you have.” The husband struggled with the robber, enabling his wife to escape. However, their two year old daughter was still in the car, requiring the father to continue the struggle. The fight eventually went to guns, and both the father and the crook were mortally wounded. However, in the end, the daughter and wife were unhurt.  

We salute the young man. The epitaph “Died Defending His Family” is a harsh and bitter one, but very honorable.  

High Cost For Defending A Business Incorrectly

There can also be a price for doing things wrong. An Albuquerque, New Mexico used car dealership owner will likely pay a high price for defending his firm. He shot a burglar — when maybe he shouldn’t have.  

Jorge Mateo-Segura was tired of his dealership being burglarized. The police didn’t seem to do anything. So when the alarm went off once again, he told the alarm company not to send police and that he’d check it out himself.

Mateo-Segura found Joe Gutierrez breaking into cars at the dealership. The owner said he thought Gutierrez was reaching for a gun and he shot him. As part of their investigation, the police arrested Gutierrez, who had an outstanding warrant for breaking and entering. Mateo-Segura was cuffed for assault with a deadly weapon and battery with great bodily harm, citing his inconsistent and changing story. Gutierrez, who admitted to breaking into the cars, has filed a criminal complaint against the owner, saying he was running away when he was shot. A civil complaint is sure to follow.  

Self-defense law is clear, the victim cannot take the law into his own hands. If life is not endangered, the victim cannot employ deadly force. In many jurisdictions, the victim cannot be the aggressor. So if the criminal is running away, it’s Vaya con Dios. If Mr Mateo-Segura had taken some self-defense training, this would have been explained in significant detail. Enough, perhaps, to prevent him from throwing his life away.  

Gary –

John – Very rarely does state law allow you to use deadly force to defend property. The case of Joe Horn in Pasadena TX is the exception.

 

Pacifist Kills a  Home Invader

Reality came a-knockin’ in the early hours for a 59 year old New Mexico man. The avowed pacifist had his dog pepper-sprayed and a shot fired at him. He used his cane to knock the gun from the invader’s hand. And used that gun to fire the fatal shot into the suspect.  

Paid liar… excuse me, lawyer Richard Cravens said his client suffered a broken arm and cuts to his face. Other reports have the homeowner’s injuries as minor. My client is completely traumatized, Cravens said. He’s a pacifist and was forced to deal with an extremely violent situation. As author Robert Heinlein observed, “A pacifist male is a contradiction in terms. Most self-described pacifists are not pacific; they simply assume false colors. When the wind changes, they hoist the Jolly Roger.

 

By the way, police found found a large amount of cash and more than 200 marijuana plants in the home. No mention was made of a Jolly Roger.   

 

Five to One Odds
Five against one is horrendous odds, but it really helps if your opponents are Floridians. Five proto home-invaders staged themselves in a stairwell outside the target apartment. However, they did so with enough hubbub to attract the attention of the designated victim. So when they finally got organized and bum-rushed the door, they ran right down the barrel of a gun. The 18 year old female ringleader and three of her accomplices are in jail, charged with home-invasion with a firearm. Their point man is cooling his heels – permanently. The survivors will likely be charged with the felony murder of their accomplice

 

The Stupid is Strong With NBC

In our DGUs, much of our discussion is based on the broad range of advice from leading self-defense thinkers, authors and instructors. They’re people with literally centuries of cumulative experience; Mas Ayoob, Kathy Jackson, Michael Bane, Andrew Branca, etc. We try to stay well within the accepted span of the opinions of people who know the best.

 

NBC’s Today Show apparently felt none of these obligations to their viewers. In a September 8th scare piece on home invasions, contributor Jeff Rossen spoke with William Zeins, a retired NYPD detective and hostage negotiator. How his 22 years as a negotiator made him an expert on home invasions was never explained. Zeins has almost no Google or web presence, nor any books or articles we could find. He does, however, have a bullet-proof hair-spray pompadour.  

Zeins’ advice runs counter to much of the accepted advice for home invasions. Among other things, Zeins wants the victims to treat the invaders like royalty, sleep with bedroom doors open, run throughout the house gathering the family, and keep a can of wasp spray by the bed. There was no mention of training, awareness, on hardening the perimeter of the house, dealing with strangers at the door, hunkering down in defensible spaces, nor any any active defense with firearms or other weapons; with the exception of the long-discredited wasp spray.

In our opinion, The Today Show has put their viewers at significant risk with their poor advice. Bad show, NBC. Get professional trained people, and don’t listen to the mainstream media: they don’t know what they’re babbling about — and they likely don’t care.

 

John – Too bad another former NYPD officer has passed away. I doubt Jim Cirillo would have given the same advice.

Gary –

 

We post each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com  Please take a minute and share them with a friend.

 

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Segment 5 Show close

 

Listener e-mail discussion : Beg and plead for emails.

 

Paul: Rob, what did you write this week at your SlowFacts blog?

 

Rob- I posted the second second part of a series on the virtue of self-defense.  Society often treats self-defense as a right we are barely willing to tolerate.  It should be more.  I have some ideas about what we can do today if we really value life and the virtue of self-defense.

 

First, if self-defense were a virtue, then a private school would include self-defense as a required element in the school curriculum.  If we’re going to value human life then we need to children to defend theirs.

 

The second point is that several anti-gun states have passed pre-emption laws so bigoted politicians can pass local gun-prohibition.  Those same laws could allow pro-rights politicians to advance the right of self-defense.. for example, by issuing non-resident permits.

 

There is lots more.  The series is called “Guerrilla Tactics in the Culture War”  It has been shared about 600 times on facebook.  You can find my articles at Clash Daily, at Ammoland, and at my Slowfacts blog. That website is slow facts dot wordpress dot com.

John, tell us what’s new at your blog no lawyers only guns and money

 

John-  I did a post on Thursday about an attack on Sen. Rand Paul in which the Coalition to Stop Gun Violence referred to him as an “insurrectionist thug”. My response that it is Senator Insurrectionist Thug to the likes of them, thank you very much. I pointed out the hypocrisy of CSGV who would be all up in arms if we had called Josh Horwitz or Ladd Everitt a “Commie traitor” or “jack-booted, regime supporting authoritarianists,” At the end of the day, they are hypocrites who like to dish it out but can’t take it in return.

 

That and more is at only guns and money dot blogspot dot com.

 

We would like to thank Charlie Foxtrot for writing up show notes for us. Even though you don’t hear him on the air he is certainly part of what you do hear. Look at his blog at not one more gun law dot blogspot dot com

 

Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast.  I’d like to thank Lance Reeter for joining us today.  Rachel will be back with us next week.  We’ll all be at the Gun Rights Policy Conference in Phoenix.  Please come see us there, or watch us online at youtube dot com and polite society podcast dot com…

Gary: stay safe,

Rob: be aware,

John: and we’ll see you down the road.

 

(after show close) How could we have made this episode better?

 

(DO NOT READ)Look at the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.  Subscribing from the link in our show notes helps Bob and Ben as well as helps us here at the Polite Society Podcast.

 

(DO NOT READ)Join your local civil rights group like the New Jersey Second Amendment Society, Arizona Citizens Defense League, Gun Owners of California, Commonwealth Second Amendment,  Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Florida Carry, Georgia Carry, Georgia Gun Owners, Grass Roots North Carolina, Illinois Carry, Maryland Shall Issue,  Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry, and  Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.

 

There are Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance,  Nebraska Firearms Owners Association,   Citizens for a Safer New Jersey, New York State Rifle & Pistol Association,  Palmetto Concealed Carry, Open Carry Texas, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Virginia Open Carry,  West Virginia Citizens Defense League, wisconsingunowners.org, and Wyoming Gun Owners.

 

For our Canadian listeners, and their supporters, join the Canadian Shooting Sports Association and the Canadian National Firearms Association.  If YOUR state or local organization isn’t read each episode, then send us an email and we’ll add them!

 

(DO NOT READ)The Polite Society download app is out on Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.

 

Episode 347 – How Cold?

Full Episode Download: http://traffic.libsyn.com/politicsandguns/347.mp3

Open and Personal News Segment:

News Segment 1:

News Segment 2:

News Segment 3:

Interview Segment: Guest Matt Martin of Geeks Gadgets and Guns

DGU Segment:

Email and Show Close:

 

Introduction

“An armed society is a polite society.. and this is the Polite Society Podcast where we support and report on civilian self-defense.”

Paul: Welcome to episode 347 sponsored by the Firearms Policy Coalition recorded on September 6th 2015, I’m Paul Lathrop

Rob: I’m Rob Morse and on tonights show we will talk with Matt Martin about torture testing guns..

John: I’m John Richardson, and we’ll talk about Carlsbad California taking the first steps toward approving a shooting range.

Gary: I’m Gary Daugherty and in one of our DGU’s  a retired lobsterman may have saved his own life and lost his apartment in the process. So climb aboard.

Rob: strap in

John : and hang on!

Paul:  episode 347 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.

Show intro music.

 

Seg 1- Personal news from each participant (when you are done with your segment please ask the next person what has been up with them)

Rob- We moved 8 ton’s of our personal possessions to Louisiana.  The cardboard content in my home is dropping steadily day after day.  I’ve already fed and eaten alligator.  As to guns, I’ve only dry fired, but I did lay hands on all my guns and ammunition in the new house.  I have standard capacity magazines on order.

Gary – What training do you have coming up?

John- I registered for the SHOT Show this week. I want to thank Susan for the head’s up. Now I have to find a place to stay which seems harder this year than last. Hotels affiliated with the SHOT Show seem to have filled up much quicker this year. Hopefully, that will mean the SHOT Show will be bigger than ever! Other than that, the only gun-related thing I did this week was order a new t-shirt (like I don’t have enough already!). Rob will appreciate this – it was from Apex Tactical and it says, “Manufactured behind enemy lines in Los Ochos, CA”. What can I say? I just couldn’t resist. (throw to Matt)

Matt – Filming slow motion of many handguns from a Savage 1905 in .32 and a Mauser c96 through a Glock 42 and Walther CCP.

Paul – Started ordering equipment for GRPC. Final stages of planning, and starting the planning process for SHOT Show.

Paul- We’ve had Bob Mayne on the show before.  He is an instructor and podcaster over at the Handgun World Podcast.  He had brain cancer.  We are all relieved that his latest scans show him to be free of cancer.  We want to wish Bob the best of luck

Break

Seg 2- News

We’ll start with news from Rob’s former home in Southern California. The City Council of Carlsbad California took a small step towards permitting a recreational shooting range inside city limits.  The existing gun store was included in the revised zoning plan that would include usage such businesses as an indoor shooting range.  Congratulations to the store owners and the self-defense activists who made this possible.  They had already raised funds to put an initiative on the ballot that would have revised the zoning code.  The fight against the anti-gun bigots in Carlsbad isn’t over.  The planning commission can still prohibit any existing facility by adding a requirement the existing site doesn’t meet.  Stay vigilant and politically active out there.

===============================

 

John – Contrast this with San Francisco which is considering a new ordinance that will force the only gun store to close. The ordinance requires a log of all gun and ammo owners sent weekly to the SFPD along with video.

-What do you do when the police break down your door and point guns at you?  What do you do if you’re a retired law enforcement officer living in Los Angeles and the local cops break down your door to grab your guns.  That is exactly what happened to Wayne Wright.  Wayne is a decorated former helicopter pilot in the U.S. Air Force, a former firefighter, and police officer.  The LA gang and gun unit grabbed Wayne’s gun collection and refused to return it.  The LA police lost their case in court.  The LA police had a judge’s order to return Wayne’s firearms.. and the police destroyed Wayne’s million dollar collection anyway.  It appears the police destroyed the guns in order to receive federal funds designed to stop gang activity.

They destroyed Wayne’s collection even after a judge ruled in an earlier case that the police must return firearms to their rightful owner, and after the then chief of police entered into a binding consent decree to change police policy.  That means the police broke the law and they knew it.

So what do you do to the police who break the law?  Wayne Wright is suing the Los Angeles gang and guns police unit under the Federal Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations Act, commonly referred to as RICO.  This provides extended criminal AND civil penalties for acts performed as part of an ongoing criminal organization.  The judgment should top four million dollars including attorneys fees.

Rob- Police departments have been charged and convicted under the RICO statutes before.  It is hard to stand by police when some of the agencies are corrupt and padding their numbers with false convictions so they can get government grants.  That makes it hard to tell the good cops from the bad.

John – Tom Gresham interviewed his atty regarding this. The LAPD is sending people to gun shows to find those who have legal gun collections so they could get large numbers of guns to destroy to pad their numbers.

==========

-I wish Rachel were here for this next story.  New firearms laws went into effect in Texas this week.  Many government buildings are no longer off limits for concealed carry.  It won’t surprise any Texans, but the Austin City Hall left their old gun ban signs in place.. at least until a local human rights advocate took action.  Michael Cargill delivered a letter to the mayor and said he would sue the city if the signs stayed up.  The signs came down the next day.

Gary-  Good work, Michael Cargill.

Paul-  The new law in Texas allows carry in some government buildings.  Schools, hospitals and courthouses remain off limits to licensed concealed carriers.

rob-

=======

-Also in Texas, a new state law allows a concealed handgun license holder to avoid arrest for accidentally bringing a pistol into an airport’s secure zone…so long as the person immediately leaves the area upon being told about the weapon.  Local law enforcement now has the option to charge or not charge the traveler.  Careless passengers moving through secure airport areas with a firearm in Texas could still be slapped with a hefty fine from the TSA. Civil penalties involving unloaded guns can reach $3,000, while a similar penalty for possessing a loaded gun can run as high as $7,500.

Rob-  Only 3000?

John – TSA doesn’t have arrest powers.

John – (TSA) Thousands standing around.

http://www.pennandtellerstore.com/p-t-tsa-bill-of-rights-card/

====

-We have some good news brought to us by a human rights activists in Alabama.  The Alabama Supreme Court ruled a state law that banned the open carry of a gun on someone else’s property was unconstitutional.  The case started when Jason Tulley wore a gun into the First Educators Credit Union in 2011.  A cop acting as a security guard asked Tulley to put his gun in his car.  Tulley did so, but received a ticket and summons two days later.   The Alabama high court overturned Tulley’s conviction.  Businesses may post their property asking gun owners not to enter, but the “own premises” law is now void.

John- The city of Jacksonville, Alabama tried to use this obscure “own premises” law to gut the state’s open carry laws.  The city attorney of Jacksonville failed because someone was willing to take them to court and stop it.

======

-Also from Alabama, new state laws require probate court judges to report to law enforcement when the judge commits someone for involuntary mental health treatment.   Under federal law, a person who is involuntarily committed for treatment cannot possess a firearm.  However, people who are forced to undergo treatment are able to appeal the ruling at a state level and have their rights restored.  A second law requires Alabama state judges to report all people who are found not guilty of a crime because of mental illness or due to a mental defect.

John – Our mental health system is broken.

=====

Break

-Let’s move over to Georgia.  A baptist church in Calhoun, Georgia started an armed self-defense class for its members.  A church member had concerns about physical security.  He collected news reports of attacks and threats on churches.  He took those concerns, and the information he collected, to the church council.  The council wanted the church to protect itself rather than hire an outside security service.  When they looked, the church council found it had good trainers and candidates in its own congregation.  They started a 22 hour long safety and training course at the church for their members.  The governing board of the church also allows members of its congregation who have their license to carry concealed on church property.

All this happened because someone raised the question of security, did their homework, and asked for an answer.  That sounds like our audience.  That sounds like something you would do.

Rob- That is how we change our schools and churches.  Our audience knows things that other people don’t know.  It is our duty to raise appropriate concerns if we care about our community.  We raise our concerns and ask for an answer.  Well done.

======

-A wealthy fashion designer named Kenneth Cole put up an anti-rights billboard in New York City.  The sign said  “Over 40 million Americans suffer from mental illness.  Some can access care…all can access guns.”  The American Psychiatric Association immediately criticized the advertisement.  because it incorrectly links mental illness with gun violence and the need for gun control.

Quoting the APA president, the billboard “provides the gross misimpression that people with mental illness are violent.  The vast majority of people with mental illness are not violent and most acts of violence are not committed by people with mental illness.”

The unasked question is how do we respect individual rights and treat mental illness at the same time.  How do we respect the right of self-defense and still limit crazy people from getting guns?

Rob- Whoever put up that billboard never went through a background check?  That is a tough question and politicians want to ignore it.  Mental health treatment is expensive and the issue doesn’t have a large donor base who makes political contributions.  I notice that most of our mass murderers are on anti-anxiety drugs and I want to know what side effects are too severe to put those drugs on the market.  What should we do if a drug makes one out of 10 thousand people violent?

Gary –

John – Isn’t the thing that the gun controllers say in defense of gun laws, if it saves only one life….

=====

-Gun control isn’t about crime control.  A recent survey funded by the anti-rights Joyce Foundation  interviewed 99 inmates at Chicago’s Cook County Jail.  These inmates had illegally possessed a gun within the last six months. Almost all the criminals got their guns from people they knew and trusted.

Quoting from the Joyce study, “It is rare for offenders to buy from licensed dealers, and also rare for them to steal their guns.  The predominant sources of guns to offenders are family, acquaintances, and fellow gang members.  Criminals would only make illegal gun purchases from people they knew.  Only 3 percent of the guns used in crime were purchased directly from a gun store.  Criminals used handguns and never used modern sporting rifles.”

John- I want to emphasise that this report is from an anti-gun group who still claimed that gun control works.  The good news is that we are not the only ones reporting accurate news to the public.  You won’t see this study reported fairly on mainstream media like MSNBC or CNN, but conservative commentators are willing to talk about the success of armed self-defense.  Conservative writer Dr. Tom Sowell criticized gun control.  His article was picked up in major news outlets around the world.

Paul they are talking about straw purchases and NOTHING will stop straw purchases

John – I have read most of the study. It was a study of mostly identified gang members.

Rob-

Matt – Could we not crack down on straw purchasing by prosecuting the illegal transfer after the fact that would be far more effective than the put the guns down billboards.

Rob- Legal or not?  Abuse of “stolen” gun and

John – Milwaukee report – multiple illegal transfers to felons – guy got probation.

=====

Break

-Guy Smith at GunFacts.info put up a new page on so called “Universal Background Checks”.  Needless to say, background checks don’t stop criminals because criminals don’t buy their guns at gun shops.  This data looks at guns used by criminals over a 7 year period.  Only 10 to 12 percent of the guns used in crimes were purchased through a pawn shop or gun store.  That means anything called a universal background check law will be 89 percent ineffective.  It won’t stop crime.. and gun bigots know it.  Such a law is designed to hurt the culture of armed self-defense, not hamper criminals.

John – UBC are flypaper laws.

======

-Reason magazine had another thoughtful review on gun laws.  In particular, the Reason article took the National Journal to task for their conclusion that guns cause crime.   A thorough review would determine if gun control laws changed the rate of criminal gun deaths.. or merely continued a pre-existing trend of lower crime.  Reason concluded that the right to own and carry a personal firearm for self-defense does not lead to more criminal homicide.

Rob- We hear lots of bad statistics thrown around, statements like “guns cause gun deaths.”  Yes, that is true in a narrow sense.. and lightning cases electrocution deaths.  I’ve seen studies that deliberately put justifiable self-defense in the same category as criminals who use guns.  Before I trust a study I have to see the precise question they asked and how they collected their information.  We’ve seen studies funded by anti-rights foundations that hide the truth rather than reveal it.

John – Gary, What year did Illinois get CCW? 2014

John- Most injuries or deaths with a firearm are from suicide.  Then comes gang shootings.  You or I discharging a firearm in self-defense happens much less often, though we use a firearm for self-defense more often that criminals use guns for crimes.

Gary- The man on the street in New York City doesn’t know that.  I doubt they would believe it if we told them.

Rob-

Paul-  So we need to take our friends in New York City shooting.

-Detroit police chief James Craig said this about trends in crime.  “We’ve had a 1 percent uptick in homicides this year, ..but if you look at what’s happened since 2013, when I got here, (homicides are) down 14 percent.”  close quote.

Reductions in robberies and carjackings have been even steeper, with each dropping 38 percent over the past two years.  Craig credits the decreases to several factors, including citizens who legally carry guns.  Again quoting chief Craig “Detroiters are fed up.  You’ve seen the stories: A woman shoots a home invader, a man shoots an armed robber.. I believe suspects know Detroiters will protect themselves when faced with an imminent threat, and that’s had an effect on crime.”

Paul- We are lucky to have Chief James Craig in Detroit.

-Starting next year, residents of Albany, New York have to keep their guns locked up or risk up to a year in jail.  The Albany Common Council voted for a city ordinance requiring that all firearms, including rifles and shotguns, must be secured inside a locking container or box.  Penalties start at a $250 fine and grow to a year in jail.

Paul- Wasn’t the Heller case in Washington, DC about storing your guns so you couldn’t get to them?

John- It was, but after the Heller case, federal judges have refused to hear similar cases.. like the ones coming from California and New Jersey.  I guess decisions like Heller and McDonald don’t apply in those states.  It must be nice to be above the law.

Rob- The Albany City Council is not trying to control crime.  They are writing laws for anti-rights activists who promise campaign donations.  They want to drive out the self-defense culture in Albany.  That makes it easier for these politicians to retain office.

John- NY is two states – NYC and the rest of the state.

Gary –

John – you are running into the issue of Federalism.

Rob- Who pays?  Head, I get campaign cash,  Tail- the taxpayers pay

Gun Quote – From Dr. Thomas Sowell: “The key fallacy of so-called gun control laws is that such laws do not in fact control guns. They simply disarm law-abiding citizens, while people bent on violence find firearms readily available.” The quote is from one of his oldie-but-goodie columns. The link to the article is in the show notes.   

Hang on everybody, we’ll be back with our interview segment.

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Segment 3 Interviews

Matt Martin of Geeks, Gadgets, and Guns Podcast.   

#1 the first few questions are focused around the title of your show.

  1. Star Wars, Star Trek, or Firefly?
  2. Apple, Android, or Windows?
  3. AR or AK?
  4. 1911 or Striker fired?

Rob-

#2 You have been doing some torture tests on YouTube, Tell us a little bit about what you have been doing.

http://geeksgadgetsandguns.com/

http://LFDResearch.com

Segment 4 DGUs

-Here is our first story of defensive gun use.  24 year old Joe Lanier has a concealed carry permit.  Joe’s mom is also a firearms instructor, and she taught all her children to defend themselves.  They need to, because Joe lives in Detroit.  Joe was working as an exterminator last week.  He stopped in traffic when a 17 year old boy tried to rob him at gunpoint.  The 17 year old demanded Joe’s sunglasses.  You can guess what happened next.  Quote “The boy tried to rob me, and I shot him. That’s what happened.  That’s why he’s in the hospital and not me.” close quote.

Firearms instructor Rick Ector runs the firearms academy of Detroit.  He writes at Legally Armed In Detroit.  Rick said “If you are old enough to (commit robbery) then you are old enough to get shot.”

Joe Lanier wasn’t hurt, but he needed to replace the windows on his car.

Woman Defends Herself and Child Against Home-Invader
Somehow, the 911 call to police didn’t work instantly, so a young mother was forced to defend herself and her child from a determined home-invader. Just after 10 am, Williams Evans finally broke into the house. The woman dropped the phone, picked up her gun, and shot the intruder. He was pronounced dead at the scene. The homeowner said she did not know Evans.

Evans’ mother said her son was at the house because the man who lives there was speaking negatively about the mother of his child. “My son was a good boy,”

Retired Lobsterman Shoots Violent Felon – May Lose His Apartment

A retired Maine lobsterman shot a man who had broken into his apartment in search of prescription drugs and money. Police arrested the wounded Christopher Wildhaber, 45, in the nearby woods after a struggle. Once treated for his shoulder wound, the criminal was jailed. Wildhaber is a violent felon with a record of domestic violence arrests. His intended victim, Harvey Lembo, 67, uses a wheelchair to get around his cramped rooms. He had just recently purchased the WWII era Russian revolver to protect himself after two prior home robberies.   

Police are still investigating, but it is unlikely the lobsterman will face any charges. However, the apartment house owner is demanding that Lembo do away with the firearm that may have saved his life – or be thrown out of his home. Firearms are prohibited in the lease agreement for – wait for it – safety reasons. We all know that Gun-Free Zones are sooooo much safer.

John – Wow! A 1895 Nagant revolver in 7.62 Nagant. A curio & relic for the win.

MM- An interesting if inefficient design.

John – And the worst trigger pull to boot.

CF – So ugly, that only a despotic regime could have made it. Kinda like Obamacare.  

John – Sorry – original design is from the Czarist days and done by a Belgian. (CF – I stand – and sit – corrected!)

Taxi Driver

A taxicab driver and a Florida couple traded “four, ten … about five, six rounds” in heavy midday Miami traffic. The driver’s customers put a gun to his head and grabbed some money. The driver pulled over and chased the couple, who opened fire. The taxi driver then went all Robert De Niro on them. The couple was taken into custody, along with two others, after an hours-long standoff outside their motel room.

Fortunately, none of the stray bullets injured anyone on the busy street.  It looks like Murphy may have had a hand in that.  Police recovered a pistol with what was described as a nasty double feed failure. Another pistol was found hidden outside the suspect’s hotel. As Miggy Gonzalez would say: Eh, it’s Miami.

Rob- A double feed occurs when a case fails to extract and a second cartridge is forced partially out of the magazine on top of the already occupied chamber. I’ve had double feeds for two reasons.  The first was from shooting cheap range reloads that were improperly sized.  The second was during an endurance tests when I refused to clean my gun.  If you want to trust your firearm then you must look after your equipment.

John – To paraphrase DeNiro, “You pointing that thing at me?”

Paul -Had training where we intentionally had a double feed and tried to clear it.

11-Year-Old Defends Himself and His 4-Year-Old Sibling

This next story was sent in by several listeners.  St Louis County Police say that an 11-year-old was forced to defend himself and his 4-year-old sister from a home-invader. The 16-year-old suspect was found in the home’s foyer, dead from a single gunshot wound to the head. The handgun used by the child had recently been purchased by his mother because of several similar robbery attempts. The children had already endured two attempted breakins earlier that morning. The parents were not home at the time.

The dead man’s 22-year-old male companion was arrested for attempted robbery. Police say evidence shows that the deceased was shot inside the home. However, some neighbors are telling the media the suspect was lured closer and hit outside the home. Other say that the child was seen waving a gun around the neighborhood earlier in the week. Police are continuing to investigate, but are standing by their initial determination.  

We certainly believe firearms should be safely secured when there are young children in the house. However, having a firearm available may have made the difference in this critical situation. It’s tricky when making the transition from child to trusted son or daughter. We’ve known 10-year-olds mature enough to be trusted with a firearm – and 40-year-olds that shouldn’t have water in their squirt-guns. The parents must decide.

Thanks for the tip, Anthony and Scott.

John- To offer some perspective, there are about 30 million children under the age of 15 living with firearms in the home.  The Centers for Disease Control reports that 69 children in that age group died from firearms accidents last year.  These children are a thousand times more likely to face a criminal invasion than be injured with a firearm.

Gary- We can cut the number of accidents even farther if we teach our children to be gun safe.

Rob- https://everytownforgunsafety.wordpress.com/

We post each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com  Please take a minute and share them with a friend.

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Segment 5 Show close

Listener e-mail discussion

Peter sent us a message on our Facebook site,

Listening to episode 346 as I type this.  Gary was asking about training barrels for revolvers.  I don’t believe anybody makes anything that will not permanently alter the weapon.  I do have two ideas that might work.  As long as the gun is going to be used as a “non-firing” trainer, he could remove the firing pin, thus allowing load/unload and dry fire.  Another suggestion would be contacting the manufacturer and see about obtaining a separate cylinder that has not had the chambers cut.

Gary –

matt

John –

========

Paul- Rob, do you have any new posts from your SlowFacts blog you want to mention?

Rob- I wrote an article called Get on the Right List.

We all have friends who say they don’t want to become involved because their activity could get them on a government list.  Tom Gresham asked a great question.  “What would you pay to make a SWAT team go away once they were at your front door to take your guns.”  Would you pay a thousand dollars?  It costs less than a hundred dollars a year to join the NRA, SAF, GOA, JPFO  and the Crime Prevention Research Center.  You’ll have money left over to join your state firearms group and the local political party.  Those are the groups who can constrain our government.  It is better to be on their mailing list than on the government’s list.

That article is up at Ammoland.  I also write at Clash Daily and on my blog, slow facts dot wordpress dot com.

John tell us what is new at your blog, Only Guns and Money.

A Charlotte TV station did a report on how guns from North and South Carolina are appearing in traces for crime guns in New York. The head of the ATF’s Charlotte Field Division, Wayne Dixie, said “we are the supplier of those firearms that end up in northern cities” and blamed this on “lax gun laws” in NC and SC. I disagreed. WE are not the suppliers. Thieves and criminal gangs are the suppliers of stolen guns that end up in NY. Moreover, there were 5 times as many traced guns from New York itself than either of the Carolinas.  I also noted that I saw more people prosecuted by his office in the last two years for cigarette smuggling than gun trafficking.

Rob- Dixie is a political hack.

You can find this and other posts at onlygunsandmoney DOT blogspot DOT com.

We would like to thank Charlie Foxtrot for writing up show notes for us. Even though you don’t hear him on the air he is a big part of what you get to hear. Look his blog up at not one more gun law dot blogspot dot com.  His latest article is called “Two Journalists Killed On-Air – Who’s Really to Blame?”

Paul – Before we go I want to remind everyone that this is the last episode before the anniversary of 9/11. Radical Islamists have a history of trying (and in at least one case succeeding) terrorism on the anniversary of their initial attack on the US.  Please stay vigilant out there.

Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast.  I’d like to thank Matt Martin of the Geeks, Gadgets and Guns podcast for sitting in with us today.  co-hosts, will you be with us next time?  I’m looking forward to it.  Until the next time…

Gary: stay safe,

Rob: be aware,

John: and we’ll see you down the road.

Mention advertisers, Concealment Solutions, Crusader Weaponry and NJ2AS. Firearm Safety Institute

(after show close) How could we have made this episode better?

(DO NOT READ)Look at the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.  Subscribing from the link in our show notes helps Bob and Ben as well as helps us here at the Polite Society Podcast.

(DO NOT READ)Join your local civil rights group like the New Jersey Second Amendment Society, Arizona Citizens Defense League, Gun Owners of California, Commonwealth Second Amendment,  Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Florida Carry, Georgia Carry, Georgia Gun Owners, Grass Roots North Carolina, Illinois Carry, Maryland Shall Issue,  Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry, and  Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.

There are Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance,  Nebraska Firearms Owners Association,   Citizens for a Safer New Jersey, New York State Rifle & Pistol Association,  Palmetto Concealed Carry, Open Carry Texas, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Virginia Open Carry,  West Virginia Citizens Defense League, wisconsingunowners.org, and Wyoming Gun Owners.

For our Canadian listeners, and their supporters, join the Canadian Shooting Sports Association and the Canadian National Firearms Association.  If YOUR state or local organization isn’t read each episode, then send us an email and we’ll add them!

(DO NOT READ)The Polite Society download app is out on Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.

Episode 346 – Bloomberg for President?

Please check out Armed Citizens Network and New Shooter Canada!

Full Episode Download: http://traffic.libsyn.com/politicsandguns/346.mp3

Open and Personal News Segment:

News Segment 1:

News Segment 2:

 

Cornered Cat Quick Tips Segment: 

DGU Segment:

Email and Show Close:

 

Introduction

“An armed society is a polite society.. and this is the Polite Society Podcast where we support and report on civilian self-defense.”

Paul: Welcome to the polite society podcast presented by the Firearms Policy Coalition recorded Sunday August 30th 2015, I’m Paul Lathrop

Kelly : I’m Kelly Lynn from the New Shooter Canada Podcast, and since Rob is still working on his move this week I am stepping in to help co-host..

Rachel: I’m Rachel Malone, and we have good news about carrying knives in Texas.

John: I’m John Richardson, and we’ll talk about the Virginia on air killings

Gary: I’m Gary Daugherty and in one of our DGU’s a fast food worker defends himself while working the drive thru, so climb aboard

Kelly: strap in

John : and hang on!

Paul:  episode 346 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.

Show intro music.

 

Seg 1- Personal news from each participant (when you are done with your segment please ask the next person what has been up with them)

Rachel- Went to my local A Girl & A Gun chapter girl’s night out – shot my Glock, gave new shooter instructional, and coached shooters. Signed up for GRPC range day. Running and working out to get ready for the Pecos Run N Gun.

 

John – I spent yesterday morning and part of the afternoon at the Greensboro, NC gun show. It was the biggest gun show I’ve been to unless you count the SHOT Show or NRA Annual Meeting. When we got there the line for time had about 35-50 people in it! The show itself was a good mixture of the old and the new with some junk thrown in. For every 2 ARs, I saw one Colt Python. I also – and please don’t tell Mike Bloomberg this – engaged in a private transaction that was in full compliance with NC law. A nice Ruger Security-Six – the predecessor of the GP-100 revolver – came home with me. I think it probably spent most of its life in a holster. The barrel was clean except for some cobwebs!

 

Throw to Kelly here

John – Kelly, I have a question re Appleseed

Gary – What training do you have coming up?

 

Paul says-  Rob made it to Louisiana, and a big moving truck is in front of his house right now.  He got to visit with friends on his drive east.  He had dinner with Charles Heller in Tucson, Arizona.  He also visited with Ben Branam and John Edeen in San Antonio, Texas.  Anyone who thinks the US is crowded has not driven US Highway 10 from Tucson to San Antonio.  Rob is writing about gun owners who “don’t want to be on a list”.  He has an internet connection in his new house, so he should be on next week’s podcast.

 

I am going to insert a live promo about upcoming training classes here.

Break

 

Seg 2- News

 

Two Journalists Killed On-Air

Two Roanoke, Virginia TV journalists were killed on-air by a deeply disturbed former coworker. The killer then posted his own video of the shooting to Twitter and Facebook and faxed a 23 page rant to ABC News before killing himself several hours later.  Per our longstanding principles, we will not broadcast the killer’s name, nor sensationalize his so-called reasons. We do express our sincere condolences to the friends and families of the victims of this senseless attack.  

The killer was still at large when politicians and activists elbowed their way onto the airwaves and social media. Candidates Clinton and O’Malley were quick to focus on the gun, as was the White House. Without even a significant fraction of the facts, they recited the usual half-truths, spin and nonsensical “common-sense” demands. Of course, Bloomberg’s minions were not far behind. Many remarked on how extraordinarily quick the anti-gun response was. Universally, the gun was the thing demonized.  

 

However, it’s the chattering class and the media that are very likely the real reason for this tragedy. This attack was the direct spawn of the media’s obsessive fascination with mass killings and the killers. The attack was designed from the start to get the attention the killer longed for. He wanted to ensure a stage for his beliefs, his perceived wrongs and himself. The killer brought his own body camera, stalked the news team, waited until they were on-air, then delayed his attack until the perfect moment when the news camera returned to the reporter. It is the stuff of cold, calculated madness — and showmanship. The killer – and the media – got what they wanted.  

 

Now, the pro-rights community must once again defend itself and it’s Constitutional Rights. It’s again time to stand up, to refute the lies and half-truths, and to actively support those that support them.  The law-abiding, the rational, the sane, will be facing a flood of the usual, emotion-driven, nonsensical attempts to limit their freedoms with a host of ultimately ineffective laws.  

 

Related to this story, Milwaukee County Sheriff David Clarke was on the Fox news Hannity show the day after the shooting, after President Obama renewed his calls for more gun control. Sheriff Clarke had the following quote. “Here’s my challenge to the president of the United States, You think this is so easy? Forego your Secret Service protection for you, for the first lady and your children, and see what it’s like to have to defend yourself, And then we’ll sit down and have a conversation so you know what we here at ground level have to deal with on a daily base in terms of self-defense.”

 

[Our commentators may want to remark that the media is having a rough time – as the shooter was a black, gay, progressive, anti-gun, disaffected, Obama supporting racist – leading them to focus almost  exclusively on the gun and anti-gunners. He passed the background check. He apparently would not have used all the rounds in a limited 10 round magazine. Most of the anti’s demands would have made ZERO change to this atrocity.

 

This is an extremely important story – if anyone has any suggestions how the article or the one beneath can be improved – please sing out! ]   

John – The reason we didn’t hear about the killer as much as the gun was that he didn’t fit the usual constructs. He was a gay African-American man which meant he was sacrosanct.

Rachel

John – It got a lot of press because of two facts- video and they were journalists.

 

Paroled Violent Repeat Felon Kills 9 Year Old

Just how effective gun laws can – or can’t – be is shown in the tragic death of Jamyla Bolden. The precocious 9 year-old was killed in her mother’s Ferguson, Missouri bedroom while doing homework. The murderer that fired into Jamyla’s house had a significant felony record, including weapons violations. Despite his prior arrests and convictions, he was free to roam the streets. Months before, he had been convicted of an armed drug robbery and was sentenced to 10 years in prison. But the judge commuted his sentence to just 5 years of probation, sending him back into the public once more. And a beautiful, intelligent, vibrant little girl was laid to rest this Saturday as a direct result.  

The Pro-Rights community often points out that gun laws only affect the law-abiding; criminals naturally operate outside those laws. However, laws are especially ineffective when the authorities choose not to enforce those laws. For reasons of ease, expense, misguided compassion or the desire to hide uncomfortable demographic truths, the prevalent “Catch and Release” philosophy is tearing at our society’s perception of justice. And it’s  just one more reason why we must stay armed and alert.  We. Are. On. Our. Own.  (Michael Bane)

 

Break

 

Texas Knife Law Preemption Goes Into Effect Sept 1

 

We on the podcast have often criticized the knife laws and policies of certain Texas cities such as San Antonio. That all changes on September 1st when Texas HB 905 goes into effect. It is legislated state knife law preemption such that no county or municipality can have a knife law more restrictive than state law.

 

The immediate impact is that it invalidates the knife ordinances in Corpus Christi and San Antonio. These two cities made Knife Rights Worst 10 list for the knife ordinances. Moreover, the 2013 Texas law change allowing automatic or switchblade knives will now be effective throughout the state. Knife Rights and its volunteers are combing city and county ordinances searching for locales whose ordinances are now invalid.

 

John – Knife law preemption like state gun law preemption should be the rule in all states. Unfortunately, it isn’t.

Gary – Illinois State Senator Tim Bevins has introduced legislation, SB 711, that would legalize switchblade (automatic) knives for anyone who holds an Illinois concealed carry license, as well as for peace officers. It includes legalization to manufacture and sell to these individuals. – See more at: http://www.kniferights.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=304#sthash.AHvJhTgs.dpuf

Rachel- believe it or not, it took multiple sessions to get this passed

John – I’d like to say this about switchblade bans – it was the result of politicians seeing West Side Story.

^^^YES!!!!

Seattle gets hit with lawsuit

 

A hat tip to Bob Owens over at bearingarms.com, it’s not like no one warned Seattle that this would happen. Before Seattle Mayor Ed Murray signed the seattle gun and ammo tax into law, The National Shooting Sports Foundation warned him that they would sue the city should he actually sign the ordinance. Well he did, and they did. Actually the NSSF teamed up with the NRA, the SAF, and 2 local gun stores as well as 2 private citizens to file the lawsuit. The attorneys that are representing the plaintiffs are the same ones that won a 2009 suit that required Seattle to follow state preemption law.  

 

Paul – I don’t know about anyone else, but I really would not want to fight the SAF, the NRA, the NSSF and others all rolled into one. There is a LOT of legal muscle coming to bear here.

 

John – I’d like to also note the historical significance of this. This lawsuit marks the FIRST time that the SAF, NRA, and NSSF have all been party to the same lawsuit.

 

Mike Bloomberg for President?

 

Media mogul Rupert Murdoch seeing the success of Donald Trump is trying to start a Draft Bloomberg for President movement. He made this suggestion in a tweet after the large stock market decline on Monday. He said it was time for Bloomberg to step into the ring and referred to him as the “greatest mayor.”

 

John – As I titled my blog post on this, Not only no but hell no.

 

comment – Can you imagine what this nasty little fascist as Michael Bane calls him would do to not only gun rights but all rights?

 

Gun Quotes

Rifles, muskets, long-bows and hand-grenades are inherently democratic weapons. A complex weapon makes the strong stronger, while a simple weapon — so long as there is no answer to it — gives claws to the weak. — George Orwell

 

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Segment 3 Kathy Jackson’s Cornered Cat Quick Tips

 

Segment 4 DGUs

Domestic Violence Victim Shoots Attacker
We’ve covered the tragedy of New Jersey resident Carol Bowne, who died waiting for permission to buy a handgun to defend her life. In this story, we see the difference a gun can make in a domestic violence case.   

Early in the morning, a domestic dispute degraded into violence. Police received a 911 call involving a domestic dispute with the suspect armed with a gun. During the domestic incident the man choked the victim. As the victim escaped, two gunshots were fired striking the man twice. Enterprise police arrived to hear multiple gunshots from inside the home.

A police spokesman said the victim suffered minor injuries. He said the alleged assailant remained hospitalized as of mid Thursday morning. He will be officially arrested when released from the hospital.

Armed Robber Approaches Two Men, Demands Wallets, Gets Killed
After watching a Tennessee Titans football game, two men were standing outside a Nashville house when a SUV stopped in front. Several armed men got out and demanding the friend’s belongings.

While one thief was taking the keys and getting into to a victim’s car, he saw the homeowner drawing his own gun. The thief opened fire and the homeowner shot back, hitting the criminal.  22-year-old Clarence Goins went to his reward in the Nashville street. HIs accomplices fled in the white Jeep Cherokee. Nashville Metro Police said that both victims waited at the scene and cooperated with officers when they arrived.

Our takeaway: even when you’ve just enjoyed watching your team beat the hapless St Louis Rams, criminals can attack. Stay armed – stay aware.  

 

Home Invasion Lands A Criminal in the Hospital
Another Tennessee homeowner answered a 2:10 am knock on his door. He naturally found three armed men on his stoop. In that touching tablou, everyone began shooting.

The three suspects fled on foot. A short time later, a Mr. Dre’An Whitherspoon entered an Emergency Room with a bullet wound. Dre’An remains in the hospital in stable condition.  Springfield Police Chief David Thompson, believes Whitherspoon was one of the three men involved in the robbery and since they have retrieved the bullet, a ballistics test should confirm he was shot by the victim.

Five people (including a 7-year-old child) were in the home during the robbery but no one in the home was injured. Police believe there is a ring targeting local Hispanics. It is not likely that the victim will face any charges,

Paul – Please, dear listeners, NEVER open the door to someone you do not know or expect. But at 2:10 in the morning — JUST DON’T!

 

Rachel

 

John – This also shows that criminals are targeting communities that they don’t think will fight back.

 

Fast Food Worker Uses Gun To Ask If There’ll Be Anything More?
In Canton, Ohio, a drive thru worker pulled his own gun when threatened by two armed suspects. The two drove off quickly with the clerk’s response to their order. The suspects, who police did not provide a description for, are wanted for attempted aggravated robbery. The police report did not indicate if they got fries with that.  

Kelly – Canadian perspective re: Home Defence

Gary –

 

We post each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com  Please take a minute and share them with a friend.

 

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Segment 5 Show close

 

Listener e-mail discussion

The 1st email is from Peter in Virginia

 

Hi folks,  When/how do you transition from teaching kids Stop, don’t touch, tell an adult and leave the area to the four rules?

My oldest, who turns 5 on Monday, has recently shown a big interest in guns. She got the Eddie Eagle spiel at preschool this past year (I think it was when they had a fireman come in and talk to her class) and we’ve been reinforcing it constantly, whenever she brings up guns.

I finally showed her my collection tonight, after another Eddie Eagle reinforcement, and another couple in the middle and end. I just showed her what each of them was, a little about how they worked, and how to hold/shoulder them. I don’t have a cricket or anything, so she couldn’t really hold any of them, but I let her look through the scope of my Ruger 77-22, which was my first rifle around 30 years ago. She already has a thing for “spotting scopes”, brought on, I think, from cartoons, so she was fascinated. Then Mommy walked in the room and she said, “I want to look at Mommy through the spotting scope”.

Well, that’s pretty much the impetus for the email. We told her, basically, Rule 2, then reinforced the Eddie Eagle thing again, and told her not to tell her friends (which won’t happen, but at least she’s not in school yet, so she may have time to forget before then, and certainly can’t say “I played with Daddy’s guns last night”.)

My current thoughts are:

  1.      Reinforce Eddie Eagle every time she brings up guns.
  2.      Make her tell me the Eddie Eagle rules, without prompting, before getting to see them again.
  3.      When I show her, teach her Rule 2, and reinforce beforehand, and if necessary during.
  4.      She doesn’t get the mechanisms yet, so rule 1 and 3 are over her head, but once she gets what the trigger does, I’ll add 3.

Ya’ll have any thoughts on how to handle it better? I know there’s a video out there on Kkds and guns that got brought up on the podcast a while back, that I’m going to find and watch soon, but anything else?

Thanks,

Peter in Virginia.

 

Rachel

Paul

**********************************************

Next we got another email from Clayton in Minnesota

 

Alright grumblers here is some gosh darn Minnesota nice for you!

Minnesota does give out non resident permits that can be applied for at any sheriff office in the state.
If you come within a couple hours of me during a visit to the great white north here, I’ll give you a “name your price” class and accept as little as a penny to show my appreciation for all your time and effort to the Polite Society Podcast. I have lots of guns and ammo we can qualify with if you don’t bring your own!

Thanks for revisiting my email, I really enjoyed the way Susan could really bring out the meaning of my words onto the air.

Best regards from the North Star State,
Clayton

 

John do you want to mention anything from No Lawyers – Only Guns and Money  you would like to talk about?

 

I have a couple and they are related. You know how the anti-gunners and their progressive kin believe in never letting a tragedy go to waste? They are now using the heroics of the Americans on that train in France as an example of how “you don’t need a gun to stop a bad guy.” They say that this validates some anti-gun research coming from Harvard’s David Hemenway. They conveniently forget to add that the train was a “gun free zone”.

 

The second was about a bulk email I got from Virginia Delegate Patrick Hope (D-Arlington) asking me to sign a Change.org petition for universal background checks. It was sent approximately 15 hours after the murders of the journalists. I pointed out the Hope seems to be the kind of guy who will surrender all principle if it gets him ahead. Hope is originally from Texas, attended a Christian high school, and then Catholic colleges for his undergraduate and graduate degrees. Despite this background, he is proudly proclaiming he won a major award from NARAL for protecting abortion funding. Pardon me if I am suffering from a little cognitive dissonance.

 

Gary – Rob is moving this week so he hasn’t had time to post anything on his SlowFacts blog. He is prolific though, now is a good time to get caught up. Also I have good news for Paul, Pmags for the Glock. Wrong, Gary there was a problem with the 9mm so .40 S&W is delayed.

 

We would like to thank Charlie Foxtrot for writing up show notes for us. Even though you don’t hear him on the air he is a big part of what you get to hear. look his blog up at not one more gun law dot blogspot dot com

 

Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast.  I’d like to thank (Guests) for joining us today.  co-hosts, will you be with us next time?  I’m looking forward to it.  Until the next time…

Gary: stay safe,

Rachel: be aware,

John: and we’ll see you down the road.

 

Mention advertisers, Concealment Solutions, Crusader Weaponry and NJ2AS. Firearm Safety Institute

 

(after show close) How could we have made this episode better?

 

(DO NOT READ)Look at the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.  Subscribing from the link in our show notes helps Bob and Ben as well as helps us here at the Polite Society Podcast.

 

(DO NOT READ)Join your local civil rights group like the New Jersey Second Amendment Society, Arizona Citizens Defense League, Gun Owners of California, Commonwealth Second Amendment,  Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Florida Carry, Georgia Carry, Georgia Gun Owners, Grass Roots North Carolina, Illinois Carry, Maryland Shall Issue,  Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry, and  Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.

 

There are Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance,  Nebraska Firearms Owners Association,   Citizens for a Safer New Jersey, New York State Rifle & Pistol Association,  Palmetto Concealed Carry, Open Carry Texas, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Virginia Open Carry,  West Virginia Citizens Defense League, wisconsingunowners.org, and Wyoming Gun Owners.

 

For our Canadian listeners, and their supporters, join the Canadian Shooting Sports Association and the Canadian National Firearms Association.  If YOUR state or local organization isn’t read each episode, then send us an email and we’ll add them!

 

(DO NOT READ)The Polite Society download app is out on Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.

 

Episode 277 – Frank Fiamingo and Ebola Prepping

Paul: Welcome to the polite society podcast recorded live on Sunday October 19, 2014. I’m Paul Lathrop

John: I’m John Richardson, and we’ll talk with Frank Fiamingo of NJ2AS

Gary D: I’m Gary Daugherty and I think Cook County, IL is trying to create a gun registry

Gary: I’m Gary Harpster and we have a discussion about gas masks and surgical masks

Gary D: so climb aboard

John: strap in

Gary H: and hang on!

Paul: Episode 277 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.

Show intro music.

Seg 1- Personal news from each participant

John – I spent yesterday morning at a gun auction. It was the auction of a guy’s accumulated gun collection. It was mostly hunting guns. The thing I found most interesting is what people would bid up. For example, a Chinese SKS that reputedly was a Vietnam War bring-back with no proof or documentation went for $900. I could see this with proof but otherwise it is just another Norinco SKS that should have sold for $3-400.

Paul – Not much gun related. No recent donations to our GoFundMe page to get equipment for streaming GRPC 2015, but we still have about 11 months to go. I want to say a public thank you to both John and Gary D for making contributions. Lots of planning for next year. confirmed final plans for Citizen First Response with Chaz Murray, Ken Kowalski and Jon Hodoway. Also going to have Beyond Concealed Carry Enhanced and Cornered Cat classes next summer.  Add that to doing Shot Show this winter and GRPC next fall and trying to arrange going up to the great white north to do the Slam Fire Radio Charity shoot in June and it is looking to be a REALLY busy year next year.

Gary D. – I got to shoot the new guns, both very nice. Because they will eventually be PDFs I will shoot some PD ammo through them before the get put into service in that capacity. I wanted to do a quick follow up from the end of the last show. Rob and Rachel were talking about situational awareness and coincidently at around the same time I was talking to a student about exactly the same thing. This student has his permit but chooses not to carry, and I was explaining Jeff Cooper’s levels of awareness and how if we walk around in condition white we aren’t able to control the escalation of our awareness. We just get surprised by a bad guy and are thrown into condition black. If you are unfamiliar check out the link in the show notes, and be aware whether you are carrying or not.

Break

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Seg 2- News

John –Politico is reporting that in true Rahm Emanuel fashion a group of Democrats are using the current Ebola scare to try and push for confirmation of Dr. Vivek Murthy as Surgeon General. You may recall that Murthy has been held up in the past because of his rather extreme anti-gun views. The Democrats making the most noise about this are members of the house, and since the Senate confirms appointees we don’t have a lot to worry about on this subject right now, but we will keep an eye on it.

Paul comment – a surgeon general has recently been a cheerleader with no real power and as such wouldn’t help much with Ebola, and if the position ever got real power we definitely would have issues with someone like Murthy.

Paul – Shocking as it may sound, CNN actually ran a story illustrating a young shooter in a positive light. They profiled Shyanne Roberts, age 10, of Franklinville, NJ who is a 3-Gun and USPSA competitor. Last year, she was second highest woman in the New Jersey Ruger Rimfire Challenge. Shyanne started learning the rules of gun safety at age 5 from her dad Dan and began shooting at age 6. She says, “”I want to be an inspiration to other kids and be a leader. Kids and guns don’t always mean bad things happen.”

Gary D – Cook County, IL started a gun registry and I missed it.

BREAK

Paul  -A few episodes back we mentioned that GOA hadn’t yet released their 2014 voter guide. Well it is out now. It seems to us  that it is a little late in the game for this to come out with the elections being just a few weeks out, and early voting already started in several states, but better late than never.

John – Comment – While I generally agree with the grades, it could be better organized. For example, in South Carolina which has both US Senate seats up for grabs, all the candidates are lumped together instead of by each contest.

Gary -We are mostly pro law enforcement here, and actively look for places to promote positive police stories, and it could be said that when speaking of the rank and file officers of the Asheville NC police department that that is the case here. wlos.com is reporting that 44 of the rank and file officers have signed a petition that states they believe that their chief should step down immediately. There are allegations of corruption as well as complaints about short staffing and mandatory overtime.

John – I live in the Asheville area. Chief William Anderson doesn’t take responsibility for when things go wrong. An example recently was a number of radar guns having outdated certification which led to dismissal of a number of speeding tickets. Anderson denied knowing about it which is either a failure of communication or a failure of management.

John -While the last story was about average cops doing the right thing, the next story comes right out of the you have got to be kidding me department. A 5 year old in Alabama was kicked out of class and was forced to sign a contract stating that she will tell an adult before she commits suicide or murders someone. Her offense – holding a crayon and stating “pew pew.” The girl’s mother was understandably outraged and infuriated when the 5 year old was forced to sign the contract without her parent’s knowledge or consent.

Paul comment – in most states a contract signed by someone under 18 years old is unenforceable. In a few instances the person requiring the signature can face criminal penalties.

Gary –MyFoxDC is reporting that DC police chief Cathy Lanier thinks that people who have a carry permit should be able to be arrested without warning if they are carrying in the area of a Presidential motorcade. She thinks that a policemen giving a warning and asking the person to leave the area is too large a burden. “The fact that the event is a gun-free event and is both posted and advertised should be sufficient notice,” she said. She also stated that it was difficult to provide advance notice of motorcades carrying dignitaries through city streets and said it was reasonable for gun owners in the vicinity of such events to be personally warned.

John -Miguel over at the Gun Free Zone Blog had a post this week discussing the story that South Carolina prosecutors are no longer allowing the victims of domestic violence to use the “stand your ground” defense.  Here is a quote from that post from a South Carolina prosecutor. “(The Legislature’s) intent … was to provide law-abiding citizens greater protections from external threats in the form of intruders and attackers,” prosecutor Culver Kidd told the Post and Courier. “We believe that applying the statute so that its reach into our homes and personal relationships is inconsistent with (its) wording and intent.”  So now you have a law that protects you in your home… except when it doesn’t.  Also you can defend yourself… except when you can’t.

Paul (I REALLY want to do this story) – long time listeners to the show know that I have had my issues with Robert Farago and The Truth About Guns. However the story that he posted Thursday has a lot  of people up in arms. The police chief of Watervliet NY (water FLEET) is asking for Facebook usernames AND PASSWORDS in pistol permit applications. Robert called the police department and had a conversation with Chief Ron Boisvert. The following is directly from the post

The Chief told TTAG that the sheet shouldn’t have been in the application packet – and won’t be in future. “It’s for internal use only,” he said.

Yes, well, the Chief said he uses the form to gather the applicant’s Facebook deets during a face-to-face interview. Why make note of the password? “We don’t,” he insisted. “We ask the applicant to log on to Facebook in front of us.” So the Chief scrolls through the applicant’s Facebook page searching for . . . ?

“Pages they’re looked at, friends – anything that reflects on the character of the applicant.” I pointed out that there’s a big difference [in terms of privacy] between viewing a Facebook page as a friend and viewing it as the owner. The Chief wasn’t bothered by the distinction.

When I pointed out that checking someone’s Facebook page (in front of them no less) was unnecessary, unfair and unconstitutional, the Chief said “I’m just the middleman here” and “it is what it is.” He said the information gets sent to a Superior Court judge who makes the final decision. The Facebook search is, in fact, the judiciary’s idea. I mean, requirement.

I asked the Chief what would happen if someone refused to log on to their Facebook account. “I’d just note the fact and send it to the Judges.”

Gun Quotes

Paul – We put out a post asking for gun quotes this morning on our Facebook page and we got a LOT of them. So many of them are good so we will be using them over the next several shows. Today’s quote was submitted by Kathy Jackson, (yes THAT Kathy Jackson)  “The way you get shot by a concealed weapons permit holder is you point a gun at him.” – Spartanburg County Sheriff Chuck Wright

Hang on everybody, Our interview with Frank Fiamingo is up right after this.

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Segment 3 Interviews

Frank Fiamingo – President NJ2AS

Segment 4 DGUs

Paul – Our first DGU comes from a Montana newspaper and we just LOVE the headline: Failed fumbler fears fleeing

Quoting directly from the article

ROLLINS – It appears alleged burglar Cole J. Johnson was more afraid of the neighbor holding a loaded gun on him than he was of the four cops who showed up to arrest him.

Under the barrel of his neighbor, Johnson, 20, of Lake County, remained still, caught in the act of burglarizing a Rollins-area home in North County. But when the police arrived, Lake County Undersheriff Dan Yonkin said Johnson tried to run.

The incident started about 10 p.m., Oct. 9, when a woman called 9-1-1 to report that her husband and two sons went to her neighbor’s house with a loaded gun, interrupted an attempted burglary and were holding the suspect at gunpoint.

While three Lake County Sheriff’s deputies and a Montana Highway Patrol trooper responded to the scene, another neighbor called dispatch to report they heard gunfire. The first 911 caller suspected Johnson was highly intoxicated, according to the call.

Johnson hid in a dark place inside the house where the gun-toting neighbor could not see him, emergency dispatchers said. But the gun-toting neighbor already saw the broken window and knew he was hiding.

“Don’t move or I’ll shoot,” the neighbor said. According to Yonkin, the gun-holding neighbor was just trying to scare the failed burglar, shot a warning into the air and held him at gunpoint until cops arrived.

When officers arrived on scene they noted that Johnson was “very drunk,” and had an active warrant out for his arrest and he tried to flee when taken into custody, Yonkin said.

Johnson was cited for attempted burglary and felony criminal mischief and taken to CSKT Tribal Jail.

John -Two armed home invaders in Shawnee, Oklahoma ignored the security system sign, the motion sensors, and the alarm system when they broke into Frances and Cardell Banks’ home around 2:30am Wednesday morning. The elderly couple had lived there for 40 year. When one of the armed home invaders broke into their bedroom, pointed his shotgun at the couple, and told them to get on the floor, Mr. Banks responded “You get out of here.” He then shot the intruder in the chest. The intruder along with his accomplice then fled the house. Justin Ray Harjo, age 26,  was later found under a truck and taken to the OU Medical Center for emergency surgery. He is in the ICU is serious condition.

There is more to this story. According to Mr. Banks, he didn’t have any experience with firearms. “No! That’s my first time shooting a gun,” he said. His wife Frances said they bought the gun hoping to never need it, but now she’s glad it was there. Mr. Banks also said his gun jammed after the first shot.

Comment – The Banks were lucky.

Gary -A strange DGU came out of Lakeland Florida on Saturday. According to theledger.com Michael Thomas White trespassed on 2 properties on Saturday morning. At the second he encountered the homeowner. When she asked him to leave he brandished a 12 ½ inch double edged dagger. The homeowner then got her husband and his Mossberg 12ga shotgun.  When the husband asked him to leave White stated that his sister was a witch and had been burned at the stake on that property and therefore the property was his. He then threw the dagger, at which point the husband shot white in the arm. According to the article White started dancing around and flailing his arms, then exited the property.  He was found in a grocery store parking lot a few blocks away and was arrested and taken to the hospital with non life threatening injuries.

We have the links to each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com if you want to share them with a friend.

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Segment 5 Show close

Listener e-mail discussion

Jacob sent in our first email

Last podcast you all had a wonderful debate about the trainer refusing to train Muslims.  I enjoyed listening to the responses, and like so many other times when listening to intelligent debate, I could appreciate the opinions expressed, even if I didn’t always agree.  I found myself often bringing up counterpoints in my head, only to hear someone bring the very same point up on-air, which was satisfying, to say the least.  One point was not brought up, so I felt I should say something about it.

It is definitely a reality that if you soak a crucifix in urine and try and call it “art,” you’ll get a “tsk-tsk” from the Christian community, whereas if you draw an image of Muhammed with a bomb under his turban you may very well have a firebombing at your house.  That said, someone (I don’t recall who) said that while it was only an extremist minority committing violence or terrorism, the rest of the Muslim world wasn’t protesting or condemning them publicly, which makes them complicit.  This would be true, if the media chose the very condemnations we’re looking for.  I remember recently reading a pretty cool point-by-point condemnation of ISIS in an open letter from over 100 Muslim clerics.  I’ve included a link to both the text, and a news article discussing it.

http://lettertobaghdadi.com/index.php

http://www.thefiscaltimes.com/Articles/2014/09/24/More-100-Muslim-Clerics-Sign-Letter-Condemning-ISIS

A few gems:

“10. It is forbidden in Islam to harm or mistreat in any way Christians or any ‘People of the Scripture’”

“13. It is forbidden in Islam to force people to convert”

“16. It is forbidden in Islam to enact legal punishments (hudud) without following the correct procedures that ensure justice and mercy.”

“17. It is forbidden in Islam to torture people”

About 9/11 – On the very day of the attack (or so this article indicates), American Muslims spoke out and condemned the attacks.

http://www.islamicity.com/articles/Articles.asp?ref=AM0109-335

“American Muslims utterly condemn what are apparently vicious and cowardly acts of terrorism against innocent civilians. We join with all Americans in calling for the swift apprehension and punishment of the perpetrators. No political cause could ever be assisted by such immoral acts.”

It happens, but it appears it gets the same coverage in the American media that is given for attempted mass shootings stopped by CCW holders.  That is to say, not very much

 

Paul – Mike in NJ wrote in a brief email stating that Ah-Ha’s Take On Me was the best music video ever made, not Robert Palmer’s Addicted to Love. I emailed him back and stated that while Take On Me was likely in the top 10 it was not even close to the best ever… Must be something in New Jersey’s water. Bad gun laws and bad taste in music’ videos.

=========================================

Greg in Bremerton emailed this in.

Paul,

Your opinion, is this worthwhile?  You can answer in an Email or cover it on your next show.

Thanks for your time.

Greg, Bremerton

http://concealedcarryloophole.com/classroom/

(DO NOT READ)The Polite Society download app is out on Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.

John do you want to mention anything off of your blog you would like to talk about? – NOTHING from ME.

(DO NOT READ)Look at the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.  Subscribing from the link in our show notes helps Bob and Ben as well as helps us here at the Polite Society Podcast.

(DO NOT READ)Join your local civil rights group like the New Jersey Second Amendment Society, Arizona Citizens Defense League, Gun Owners of California, Commonwealth Second Amendment,  Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Florida Carry, Georgia Carry, Georgia Gun Owners, Grass Roots North Carolina, Illinois Carry, Maryland Shall Issue,  Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry, and  Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.

There are Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance,  Nebraska Firearms Owners Association,   Citizens for a Safer New Jersey, New York State Rifle & Pistol Association,  Palmetto Concealed Carry, Open Carry Texas, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Virginia Open Carry,  West Virginia Citizens Defense League, wisconsingunowners.org, and Wyoming Gun Owners.

For our Canadian listeners, and their supporters, join the Canadian Shooting Sports Association and the Canadian National Firearms Association.  If YOUR state or local organization isn’t read each episode, then send us an email and we’ll add them!

Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast.  I’d like to thank (Guests) for joining us today.  co-hosts, will you be with us next time?  I’m looking forward to it.  Until the next time…

Paul : stay safe,

Gary D. : be aware,

John: and we’ll see you down the road.

Mention advertisers, ABN, Concealment Solutions, Crusader Weaponry and NJ2AS. Firearm Safety Institute

Episode 274 – Vikram Khanna at GRPC 2014

Rachel: Welcome to the polite society podcast recorded live on Wednesday, October 8th, 2014. I’m Rachel Malone.
John: I’m John Richardson, and we have a recorded interview with Vik Khanna from the gun rights policy conference.

Rob: I’m Rob Morse and we have our weekly news and stories of defensive gun use.. so climb aboard.
John: strap in!
Rachel: and hang on!  Episode 274 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.
Show intro music.
Seg 1- Personal news from each participant

Rachel- I had a girls’ shopping date with a friend of mine today…..a holster and ammo shopping date, that is. We found her a great holster at GT Distributors that allows her to carry a Glock 23 concealed. For a girl with a smaller frame, that’s pretty sweet.

John – Nothing really to report since Sunday afternoon. I’m waiting for my invitation to Media Day at SHOT Show. I understand that Paul and Susan have gotten their invitations. I hope they will put in a good word for me!

Rob- Dry practice and work.
Rachel- Break
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Seg 2- News

John -The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms has a long history.  Recently it is a history of corruption and incompetence.  There is a website called “clean up ATF” where the field agents complain about their management.  Unfortunately, the management retaliates if anyone complains too loudly.  They tried to make an example of ATF field agent Vincent Cefalu.  Agent Cefalu went to court in his wrongful termination case last week.  This week the judge dismissed ATF’s attempt to fire Cefalu. The judge ruled that unfounded charges must be removed from his personnel record, the ATF owes Cefalu for his legal costs, the agency must restore Cefalu’s retirement funds by the end of the month, and they must pay an undisclosed settlement award.  After the verdict, agent Cefalu made an open post addressed to ATF Director B. Todd Jones and Deputy Director Thomas E. Brandon.

“You allowed the agency to abuse me and my family for eight years only to admit you were wrong. Nothing in the case changed over the last two years, yet you refused to settle, continued wasting taxpayers’ dollars and precious court time only to do what you should have done years ago..  You still have to reconcile not only keeping the managers responsible for this on your payroll, but promot[ing] them.  You have been aware of the perjury, false statements … gross mismanagement and waste, fraud and abuse by members of your executive staff and field managers and have done nothing. In fact you went to heroic measures to defend them.

“My true win comes from the knowledge that the field does not and will not accept your reckless leadership and [is] not afraid to call you out anymore.”

With bad managment like this, no wonder there is a morale problem at the ATF.  Yeah, and their agency lawyers are spending time fighting internal lawsuits rather than prosecuting violent criminal behavior.

Rob- There are similar problems at the Federal Bureau of Investigation.  Senator Chuck Grassley of Iowa said eleven whistleblowers in the FBI say the bureau is targeting them for termination in retaliation for their revelations about FBI wrongdoing.  Senator Grassley is the ranking Republican on the Senate Committee on the Judiciary.  The FBI set out to punish whistleblowers in a way the whistleblowers could not oppose.  They were served with Loss of Effectiveness orders and warned that their performance is suffering and that they could soon be fired.  These letters bypass the FBI’s Office of Professional Responsibility, so the whistleblowers would never have a chance to protest their evaluation.  Quoting Senator Grassley, “It’s stereotypical treatment of whistleblowers by the executive branch.”  These letters sent to the FBI employees mark the first major case showing how newly appointed FBI Director James B. Comey may react to internal whistleblowers.  If these allegations are true, the FBI’s treatment of whistleblowers stands in stark contrast with how it treats agents who have been found by [internal investigators] to have committed actual, disciplinable offenses,”  The senator cited the case of an FBI agent who was having a relationship with a foreign citizen and had divulged sensitive information. The agent was never sent a Loss of Effectiveness (LOE) letter, and the agent’s case was handled through the Office of Professional Responsibility, he said.

Rachel- The Indianapolis Star researched violent crimes committed with a firearm during the last five years.  They found three thousand of examples where prosecutors bargained away the firearms charges for a guilty plea to a lesser offense.  The plea bargains make life easier for prosecutors.  The plea bargains also cost lives when violent criminals are returned to the streets to kill again.  One such criminal was Leandrew Beasley.  Beasley was a drug dealer who shot several people while he should have been serving time in jail for his prior convictions.  Many of the criminals studied had a long list of prior arrests.  This was particularly true of murderers.  Evidently murder takes practice.  The report concluded that prosecuting repeat felons under existing laws would save lives.

Rob -Indianapolis is not alone in costing innocent lives.  Los Angeles is stuck on stupid and passes more gun restrictions while their crime rate goes up. The LA City Council voted to ban the possession of “high capacity” magazines within city limits. While the Ninth U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals ruled that restrictions on concealed carry had to be eased, the LA County Sheriffs Department refused to comply with the judges’ ruling. The LA City Council lobbied the state legislature to ban “single shot” handguns, a ban which was implemented on the state level. At the state level, California restricted lead ammo, expanding criminal firearm storage rules, requiring safety certificates for owners of long guns, and expanding background checks.  All the while, crime rose in Los Angeles.  According to the Los Angeles Times, LA’s “overall violent crime rate is up 7.6 percent year to year.  Aggravated assaults increased by nearly 20 percent. and the incidence of rape was up 7 percent.

rachel comment- Insanity is doing the same thing and expecting different results.

john comment- the politicians will keep selling gun control as long as the voters will buy it.

Rachel- Pro-Mag is a magazine and gun component manufacturer with a considerable share of the market.   They moved their business from anti-gun California to pro-gun and pro-business Arizona.  General manager Mike Kurvink said that the move was sparked by California’s gun and business laws that made it nearly impossible to do business.  They took 200 employees and 40 truck loads of equipment with them as they moved to Phoenix.
comment- well done, Pro-Mag

John -Here is a story of progress for Alabama gun owners.  The use of sound suppressors for hunting became legal as of October first.  Federal tax stamps are still required.  Until earlier this year, the Alabama Department of Conservation and Natural Resources prohibited the use of suppressors/silencers.  Now Alabama joins thirty other states who allow hunters to use suppressors while hunting.

Several countries consider hunting without a suppressor to be rude since the noise bothers the neighbors.  Those countries didn’t have alcohol prohibition in the 1930s and didn’t have our firearms laws that were supposed to control the organized crime that grew out of prohibition.
comment- using a suppressor makes you a good neighbor.
comment- John, are you going to get a suppressor for your pig gun?

Rob -A lie can travel halfway around the world before the truth pulls on its pants.  Anti-gun activist Mark Kelly lied on national television about how firearms transactions occur without a background check.  Kelly said only 60 percent of all gun sales occur with a background check.  The statistic is false and misleading.  The data comes from a few hundred phone interviews conducted 20 years ago.  The limited data includes sales made before background checks were required by law.  That is a fact you won’t hear on CNN.

comment-John – And THAT is why we have listeners to the Polite Society Podcast

Rachel -The intolerance of anti-gunners has reached a new high. Nino Ferlaino, a seasonal landscaping employee of the Crown Point, Indiana Lakes of the Four Seasons gated community was fired on July 2nd for merely owning a gun. His supervisor asked him if it was true he carried a firearm to which Mr. Ferlaino replied that he owned a firearm but did not carry it at work. Ferlaino was fired because the gated community had a “no tolerance policy”. Mr. Ferlaino is now suing the Lakes of the Four Seasons Property Owners Association Inc. for actual and punitive damages, attorney’s fees, and an injunction preventing them from taking similar actions against other employees. The homeowner’s association’s are in violation of an Indiana law passed in 2011 which forbids employers from asking if their employees own guns.  Moreover, most employees have the right to store their firearm in their vehicles while at work.

john Comment – I hope this group of anti-gunners has deep pockets
rob Comment – and that Mr. Ferlaino takes a lot of their money.

John – With Election Day less than a month away, it is important for gun owners and gun right supporters to know who our friends are, who only pays lip service to the Second Amendment, and who really is after our guns. To find who who is pro-gun, we suggest checking out the NRA Political Victory Fund site as well as those from the many state-level organizations. To make it easier to figure out who  pays lip service or hates us, Everytown Moms for Illegal Mayors have released their own endorsements. As Bob Owens of BearingArms points out, Bloomberg didn’t want to be seen doing the endorsements himself. You will find such anti-gun luminaries as Cal AG Kamala Harris, CT Gov Dan Malloy, and NY Gov Andrew Cuomo on the list along with others who pretend to support the Second Amendment like Senators Kay Hagan, Mark Udall, and Mary Landrieu.

John – The Durham County (NC) Sheriffs Department finally has destroyed a handgun registry that had been in existence since 1935. While the county repealed the law authorizing the registry as mandated by the General Assembly, they were unwilling to actually destroy the records claiming they had historical relevance. It was only after Grass Roots North Carolina threatened to sue the Sheriffs Department and the county that steps were taken to shred the record cards. Clerk of Court Archie Smith and Sheriff Mike Andrews filmed the destruction of the records which can be seen on YouTube.

Rob -Connecticut got this one wrong. Scott Lazure was a security guard.  He had a concealed carry permit in Connecticut.  You may not know that Connecticut allows open carry with a concealed carry license, and Scott was open carrying.  The police certainly forgot that open carry is allowed.  In Connecticut, there is also no requirement to inform the police that you have a concealed carry permit.  Police approached Scott, and asked to see his identification.  He refused, since a citizen is not required to produce identification unless they are charged with a crime.  This went to court and Scott won.  The judge told the police to return Scott’s firearm.  That is when the issuing authority, the state Board of Firearms Permit Examiners, revoked Scott’s permit to carry.  Now that decision is headed to court.  It seems likely that Michael Lawlor, the undersecretary for criminal justice policy and planning for Governor Dannel Malloy, sent down word to deny Scott Lazure’s permit.  Governor Malloy is in a heated race for Governor against the pro-gun candidate Tom Foley.  The police need guidance and leadership.  That starts from the top, and Connecticut gun owners should be involved in this race for governor.

Comment – Mike Vanderboegh wrote about Lawlor in the past speculating that he was a KGB plant.

Rachel- This officer has his internal compass set and it guides his actions.  Officer Ben Hall was going to cite a woman for driving her 5 year old without a car seat.  The woman agreed that she needed a car seat, but said her family had fallen on some hard times recently.  Her car had been repossessed along with her daughter’s car seat.  Now they didn’t have the money for a new car seat.  The officer could have fined her and given her a ticket.  He’s done exactly that before, but not this time.  Officer Hall bought her a car seat instead.  Hall said “..what she was going through.. was something anyone could have been going through.  Giving her a ticket.. doesn’t solve the problem..  I talked to the mother about different organizations that give out car seats but it was Friday night.. and we needed something right now.”

They found a 55 dollar car seat at Walmart and Officer Hall paid for it.  I hope the rest of the officers in Emmett Township, Michigan are that thoughtful.  He has helped us all with his example.

john comment- Why talk about this on the Polite Society Podcast?

rob comment- because if we criticize the police when they get it wrong then we have to recognize them when they get it right.

John -Law enforcement understands violence, but the politicians are playing games with people’s lives in New York,  Tony Oliva writes at his blog “Bullets First”.  He documented a one man crime spree by a convicted rapist in New York.  The criminal attempted one abduction in a gun-free zone of a shopping center parking lot.  He later kidnapped and raped a second woman at gunpoint.  The criminal kidnapped a second man and made him drop him off at a college campus.  Another gun free zone. In short, a violent rapist gets released from jail, quickly gets a gun despite the New York SAFE Act, chooses gun free zones to attack victims and is finally caught on a gun free zone college campus about to repeat his crimes all over again.  This is as close to proof as we will ever find that firearms restrictions disarm honest citizens and not criminals.

Rob- Gun Quotes- “We shall have lost something vital and beyond price on the day when the state denies us the right to resort to force…” – Justice Louis Brandeis in The Brandeis Guide to the Modern World, 1941.

Rachel- Hang on everybody, we’ll be back after this

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Segment 3 Interview
Vic Kahana
Segment 4 DGUs

Rachel -This DGU was sent in by Scott who lives in Texas.  Three intruders broke into a home just west of Houston in Katy, Texas.  One of the homeowners was jumped and tackled by two masked intruders who taped his arms and feet.  They tried to get into his safe.  The homeowner played dead when the thieves tried to choke him. Quote “All I could think about was my daughter.”  The thieves ransacked the two-story home.  At one point the homeowner raised his head and the the thieves said, quote “if you look up again, we’ll kill you.”  The homeowner opened his gun safe and waited for the thieves.

Two of the thieves were airlifted to the hospital for emergency surgery because of multiple gunshot wounds.  The third suspect is being sought by police.

John -Despite its western reputation, Texas has some work to do on its firearms laws.  Four armed men entered a bar in Northwest Harris County.  Most of the crowd had gone home.  It was after closing time as the staff cleaned up EJ’s Place.  A few customers lingered.  One was a regular who routinely walked the female staff to their cars after closing.  The four criminals ordered everyone to lie face down on the ground.  That is when one of the regular customers shot and killed two of the armed thieves.  The other two criminals fled.  Under Texas law, even licensed carriers can’t have guns in bars. That could explain why the armed customer who saved lives left the bar before police arrived.

Rob -The police are minutes away when you need them.  A Lake Elsinore, California couple called police when an intruder tried to enter their house just before 11 pm Sunday night.  The male homeowner retrieved his handgun and shouted to the intruder that he was armed.  The intruder smashed in a window anyway.  The homeowner fired and the intruder fled.  Paramedics took the intruder to a local medical center where he died of his injuries.  The police do not expect to press charges against the homeowner.

rachel comment- There is some justice even in California.
john comment- I wonder if the criminal was stupid, or intoxicated.

rachel -A domestic dispute escalated and ended in a self-defense shooting.  An unmarried couple in Lima, Ohio argued in front of the woman’s parents.  First the man was asked to leave, and then the man was forced to leave.  The homeowners called police.  The man returned later after the police had left..  That is when the man and a friend, Markquis Hall and Ja’Taven Dukes began shooting at the house.  The family called police again and the pregnant woman hid with her 9 month old baby in a hall closet.  The woman is recorded on the 911 call saying, ““He’s shooting. He has a gun and he’s shooting on the inside and there’s an infant in here.  Can you all please hurry up.”  Hall and Dukes, both in their mid 20s, were shot as they broke through a window to enter the home.  Dukes died and Hall was arrested by police at St. Rita’s Medical Center seeking treatment for a gunshot wound.

comment- Thank god someone had a gun.

Rob- We have the links to each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com if you want to share them with a friend.
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Segment 5 Show close
Listener e-mail discussion

(DO NOT READ)The Polite Society download app is out on Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.

Rachel- Rob, do you have any new posts from your SlowFacts blog you want to mention?

Rachel, that article about armed women I promised you was picked up by Ammoland and Keep and Bear Arms.

Rob John do you want to mention anything off of your blog you would like to talk about?

John- Go fund me for Paul.  Here is the link- http://www.gofundme.com/fg2dhw

(DO NOT READ)Look at the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.  Subscribing from the link in our show notes helps Bob and Ben as well as helps us here at the Polite Society Podcast.

(DO NOT READ)Join your local civil rights group like the New Jersey Second Amendment Society, Arizona Citizens Defense League, Gun Owners of California, Commonwealth Second Amendment,  Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Florida Carry, Georgia Carry, Georgia Gun Owners, Grass Roots North Carolina, Illinois Carry, Maryland Shall Issue,  Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry, and  Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.

There are Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance,  Nebraska Firearms Owners Association,   Citizens for a Safer New Jersey, New York State Rifle & Pistol Association,  Palmetto Concealed Carry, Open Carry Texas, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Virginia Open Carry,  West Virginia Citizens Defense League, wisconsingunowners.org, and Wyoming Gun Owners.

For our Canadian listeners, and their supporters, join the Canadian Shooting Sports Association and the Canadian National Firearms Association.  If YOUR state or local organization isn’t read each episode, then send us an email and we’ll add them!

Rachel: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast.  I’d like to thank (Guests) for joining us today.  co-hosts, will you be with us next time?  I’m looking forward to it.  Until the next time…

John: stay safe,
Rob: be aware,
Rachel: and we’ll see you down the road.

Episode 273 – Massad Ayoob at GRPC

“An armed society is a polite society.. and this is the Polite Society Podcast where we support and report on civilian self-defense.”
Paul: Welcome to the polite society podcast recorded live on Sunday, October 5th, 2014. I’m Paul Lathrop.
Rachel: I’m Rachel Malone and on tonights show we have some audio from the Gun Rights Policy Conference featuring Massad Ayoob talking about gun-free zones.
John: I’m John Richardson, and we’ll talk about some anti-gun laws that got signed into law in California this week
Gary: I’m Gary Daugherty and we have 2 gun quotes for you today.
Rob: I’m Rob Morse and in our DGU segment we talk about a young woman in Las Vegas whose stalker wasn’t stopped by a protection order.
Gary: I’m Gary Harpster and we have a discussion about Bug out Bags
Rachel: so climb aboard
John: strap in
Rob: and hang on!
Paul: Episode 273 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.
Show intro music.

Seg 1- Personal news from each participant

Paul – 1)Holy cow! GRPC was AMAZING! Talked to a lot of people, got to get to know a little bit some people that I have considered my heroes for a long time.
2)We are partnering with Ammoland (thanks Fredy Reihl) and NJ2AS (thanks Frank Fiamingo) to live stream next year’s GRPC. I have a little bit of equipment to acquire before that happens.
3)Susan got her gun
4)Truck issues AGAIN!
5)Greg in Bremmerton
6)Chaz
7)We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone.

Rob- Dry practice. I wrote an article defending a woman’s right to self-defense.
GRPC, Tom Gresham (70 hours is easy), NRA board member Maria Heil, Dr. John Edeen, Vik Khanna, Charles Heller, Gary Daugherty and Sherry, Kimberly Morin from Woman’s Defense League of New Hampshire. John Fund from National Review. Chris Bird. Chris Knox. (Jeff didn’t make it.) Eddie Fulmer from ‘Bama Carry, and Paul Valone from Grass Roots North Carolina, Larry Pratt.. oh, and Dr. John Lott. We’ll have them on our show. I also met Rhonda Ezell from the Ezell vs Chicago lawsuit. We almost got to meet Shaneen Allen from New Jersey.

John- Thanks to a suicidal pyromaniac at the FAA’s Chicago radar facility, I didn’t make it to this year’s GRPC but not for lack of trying. My first flight was canceled, I got rebooked on another flight at an airport an hour’s drive away, and then that flight was canceled after I sat at the airport for 3 hours. Next year Phoenix! And in better news, my daughter and her husband announced yesterday at their “gender reveal party” that it will be a girl – Olivia Grace. I need to start shopping for a Cricket rifle in either pink or pink camo!

Rachel- Not nearly anything as exciting or dramatic as everything y’all experienced at GRPC! However, I did sight in my EOTech for the Zombie Run and even got to do some shooting at the rifle marksmanship clinic I helped to instruct last weekend while y’all were in Chicago. It was the first rifle fundamentals training course at Battle Road USA, and it’s designed to help prepare shooters for the more advanced courses we offer (Combat Carbine, Precision Rifle, Camouflage and Stalking, etc.). We pushed shooters hard but they responded well and showed good improvement. One of my favorite parts was the long distance segment on Sunday afternoon – some of the group took centerfires out to the long distance range; I stayed with the rimfire shooters and we took .22’s out to 100 yards. Everyone learned a lot about trajectory, wind, and the importance of being solid in fundamentals.

Gary H- busy week, ebola scare = long term food sales, real mask details, coming up events.

Gary D – Possible suicide attempt at one of my training ranges.

Break
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Seg 2- News

Rachel- Speaking of Rhonda Ezell, who we met at the Gun Rights Policy Conference; the case of Ezell v. City of Chicago challenged the city’s code by asserting that the regulations involving installation and operation of gun ranges inside city limits are burdensome. This week U.S. District Court Judge Virginia Kendall agreed with the Second Amendment Foundation.  The judge found the city’s zoning and requirements regarding hours of operation were unfounded.  Judge Kendall quoted Chicago police officials who “admitted that they had no data or empirical evidence that any criminal impact would occur due to the presence of a firing range, or that (the impact) would be lessened by placing ranges in manufacturing districts.”  SAF executive vice president Alan Gottlieb said, “our persistence in this issue.. caused the city to actually repeal many of the rules we challenged, even before the court could address them. That’s an indication the city knows there were problems with the code as written, and it demonstrates that when an in-depth analysis of gun laws is undertaken that requires proponents to prove those laws would be effective, they can’t.”  SAF attorney Alan Gura added, “Every day on which Chicago loses some of its unconstitutional laws is a better day than the one before. This latest decision brings Chicago that much closer to the rest of America, where responsible, law-abiding people can practically access gun ranges for safety training and recreation.”

Rob comment- we saw Alan Gura at GRPC too.

Rob- I have a lot to apologize for.  I’m from California, so let me apologize for my crazy California Senator, Dianne Feinstein.  She was one of the original authors of the 1994 “assault weapons ban”.  The ban outlawed modern firearms with “military style features” such as pistol grips, bayonet mounts, adjustable stocks, flash hiders or a standard capacity magazine.  The senator put out a press release this month that claims her ban reduced crime.  Experts who study the use of firearms in crimes say the exactly the opposite.  Duke University public policy experts Philip Cook and Kristin Goss wrote that “There is no compelling evidence that (the ban) saved lives.”  A report from the United States Department of Justice said, “We cannot clearly credit the weapons ban with any of the nation’s recent drop in gun violence.  Should (the ban) be renewed, the ban’s effects on gun violence are likely to be small at best and perhaps too small for reliable measurement.”  Those facts don’t matter when you’re crazy like my Senator.

Rachel comment- crazy is right. I tried to explain a few of California’s regulations to my new shooter’s class last summer and the girls thought I was making it up.

John -Guns and Ammo magazine released their list of the best states for firearms owners, and for concealed carry holders in particular.  The ranking is based on several factors.  They recorded the the issuing scheme for permits, the extent of reciprocity, the amount of training required to obtain the license, the required fees and the use of force in self-defense like stand-your-ground laws.

Arizona ranked first, Utah ranked second and Alaska ranked third.  The Washington DC ranked last.  I had to list the states where we live, so Rachel, Texas ranked 12th, Paul and Susan, South Dakota ranks 19th, North Carolina ranked 30th, Gary, Illinois ranked 42nd, and Rob, California ranked 50th.

Paul- comment- Arizona won this comparison last year as well.  Arizona Citizens Defense league deserves credit.  Their hard work year after year pays off.

Rob- At least California is better than DC.   (boos)  I’m packing already.

John – NC got marked down because they don’t issue non-resident licenses. Given we accept all other state’s permits including non-resident ones, what’s the big deal.

Paul- California added to its list of firearms restrictions.  California Governor Jerry Brown signed two bills into law.  One law allows the police to seize firearms from any legal gun owner with the request of a family member, judge or law enforcement officer.  Wait until the divorce lawyers get their hands on this one.  The Governor signed a bill requiring all toy guns to be painted bright colors.  The bill could make some of our “red” guns illegal.  Also, some criminals have started painting their real firearms in bright colors.

Rob comment- California, where your right of armed self-defense goes to die.

Rachel comment- Just wait until the politicians start using the firearms restraining order on each other.

Break

Rachel -New Jersey maintained its reputation for being hostile to a culture of self-defense.  The Atlantic City Council passed two measures this week.  One outlawed the sale, possession or use of any imitation firearms unless they are colored in bright, fluorescent colors or transparent. Pistols that use metal caps are banned from being sold to minors.  The other bill would eliminate the city’s liability for the actions of police when they are working off duty as security guards.

John -Grass Roots North Carolina pays a clipping service to search the media sources for firearms use in the state.  It was a year ago that North Carolina allowed concealed carry holders to enter restaurants that served alcohol.  The anti gun politicians predicted blood flowing out of the bars and into the streets.  It didn’t happen.  Not once.  They tried to sell a horror show.. and history delivered a yawn instead.  This isn’t the first time that politicians and the media said the sky would fall.  They told us a chicken little story about carrying concealed in state parks.  That was another yawn.  Now it is North Carolina Agriculture Commissioner Steve Troxler’s turn to cry wolf. The Commissioner says he will post the North Carolina State Fair against concealed carry even though state law prohibits him from doing so.

Rob comment- politicians sure show their crazy during an election year.

Rachel comment- when is halloween?  Could that be the excuse?

Paul comment – Troxler is a Republican proving that gun control is not just the province of Democrats.

Rob -It looks like there is some dirty money at play in Connecticut politics. Democratic Gov. Dannel Malloy and Republican Tom Foley will face each other in a close general election in November.  Malloy campaigned on gun control, and Foley opposed it.  Civil rights groups like the Connecticut Citizens Defense League support Foley.  Someone funded a third party candidate to run with a pro-gun position.  Joe Visconti says he is a tea party candidate and his advertisements show him holding firearms.  Until he ran for governor, Visconti was not active in gun-rights activism.

They elected the anti-gun Democrat in Virginia when the libertarian candidate siphoned a few percent of the vote from the pro-gun attorney general Ken Cuccinelli.  It later turns out that the libertarian was funded by liberal democrats.

Paul- Anthony sent a story link to us in email. Fox news is reporting that the NRA is being outspent in Washington by 7 to 1 on the coming November elections. As we have talked about here before there are 2 competing initiatives in Washington state and it looks like BOTH might pass. Millions are being dumped into the race by people who are certainly rich enough to buy their own armed security, and sometimes their own operational tanks.

Rachel -The California legislature is working to outlaw lead ammunition, and poor academic studies of lead is one of ways they are doing it.  That is why honest research is important.  A study, out of Iowa State University looked at eagles in the wild.  The authors tested fecal samples from nest areas for lead levels. They found detectable lead levels in most samples, but in the majority of samples, the levels were low and within the range of birds in lead-free sites, and within background environmental lead levels. There was no statistically significant difference in samples collected in the winter versus the spring or in those collected near a river (meaning plenty of food sources) or far from a river (hypothesized to be more likely to scavenge gut piles and thus exposed to lead ammunition). There was also no correlation between lead exposure and the number of deer harvested in an area.

John comment- Ah, but will the facts stop the environmentalists and the anti-gun politicians?

Rob- what did you do today, Dad?  Son, I tested eagle poop for lead.

Rob-The Second Amendment Foundation has been bringing lawsuits against cities in Utah.  These cities violated Utah’s pre-emption laws.  For example, up until Wednesday night, it was illegal to possess a firearm or knife with a blade more than 3 inches long in a city-owned park in Santa Clara, Utah.  Councilman David Whitehead said, “We’ve used a knife longer than 3 inches to cut cake while having church parties in the park.”  The city council said they didn’t know the regulations were on the books.

John –New York City is at it again, and it seems that they are borrowing from the California legislatures playbook this time. New York City Assemblyman Brian Kavanagh has introduced legislation that would allow gun confiscation by just bringing an allegation. This quote is directly from the Assemblyman. “So this is a bill that would permit family members or friends or medical professionals or law enforcement or really anyone who’s concerned that somebody having to access to guns poses a serious danger to go to a court and present evidence of that, and if the court were persuaded, they would be able to issue a temporary order preventing the person from acquiring or possessing guns,” Kavanagh explains. “The person who is the subject of the order would then have an opportunity to appeal that decision.”

Rob- can we get the gun rights removed from these politicians?

Paul -The FBI twists statistics to please their political masters.  The latest evidence is in an FBi report released last week.  The report claims that active shooters became more common from 2000 to 2013.  That claim contradicts the statistic that mass shooters are becoming less common.  Note carefully that “Active shooter” and “mass shooting” do not mean the same thing.  The FBI statistics include events that no one would call a mass shooting.

The FBI also deliberately excluded killings connected to gang rivalries or the drug trade.  Rather than basing its definition on how many people were killed, the FBI report focuses on homicidal intent. If the perp only wounds his victims, or if he doesn’t even manage to do that, he still gets counted. Fewer than half of the incidents in the FBI report qualify as mass shootings.

Dr. John Lott will have a report out soon that untangles the FBI claims.  In the mean time, note which networks cite the FBI statistics.  Those networks are revealing more about their bias than they reveal about the changing habits of violent criminals.

BREAK

Rachel -In what should be called “News of the Weird”, MSNBC is blaming the NRA for making the ebola crisis worse. Honestly, we are not making this up. In a column published on Thursday, Krystal Ball and Anne Thompson say that the NRA’s opposition to President Obama’s anti-gun nominee for Surgeon General, Dr. Vivek Murthy, has made the situation worse because the US doesn’t have a Surgeon General. They say that Dr. Murthy could help ease people’s fears about the disease.

John Comment – This may be why re-runs of The Shark Tank have better Nielsen ratings than does MSNBC.

Rob- We got to hear Vic Kahanna talk about Dr Murthy at GRPC

Rob – With all the attention being paid to restaurant chains that are kow-towing to Bloomberg’s Moms, it is great to read about a restaurant that rewards customers for taking their self-protection seriously.  Bergeron’s Restaurant in Port Allen, Louisiana gives a 10% discount to customers who are carrying their firearms. Owner Kevin Cox says, “Target Department stores banned guns and these people are banning guns. Don’t they realize that that’s where people with guns are going to go? I want to take the opposite approach. How can I make my place safer?  When we have a gun, we’re all the same size.” Mr. Cox reports giving out 10-20 discounts daily.  The discount at Bergeron’s Restaurant started for law enforcement and then they expanded the discount to cover concealed carry holders.

John -Being a police officer isn’t easy.  Sometimes the police get it right, and sometimes they get it wrong.  Last year, police arrested Sung-Ho Hwang after he entered a movie theater in New Haven, Connecticut.  Hwang is an immigration attorney and president of the New Haven County Bar Association.  Hwang was originally detained after 20 policemen responded to a call of a man with a gun.  Hwang is also a licensed concealed carry holder.  The theater was not posted a as a no-gun area.  Police were going to let him go until the New Haven police Chief Dean Esserman, demanded Hwang be arrested.  Hwang was initially charged with second-degree breach of peace and interfering with police.  All charges were dropped.

Now, Hwang is suing the City of New Haven and the police chief Dean Esserman. Hwang asserts officers made a false arrest and acted without probable cause, ordered by a police chief who is not himself a certified police officer.

Hwang said “We can’t live in a society where somebody decided that he has a personal objection to something even though it’s lawful.  It’s not right for the Chief of Police to inject his personal opinions when he pursues a case. He needs to abide by the laws.”

Gary D comment- A city in Colorado settled a similar lawsuit this year.

Paul -In the United States, there is a quirk in the law for showing racial discrimination.  A plaintiff only has to show there is a discriminatory outcome, not a discriminatory intent.  That means Chicago has some explaining to do.  The legal restrictions imposed on Chicago residents has resulted in a racially discriminatory selection against black concealed carry holders.  Blacks and Hispanics are far less likely than whites to meet the many requirements to legally carry a firearm if they live in Cook county in general, and if they live in Chicago in particular.

We are not talking about a license to practice medicine; we are talking about armed self-defense which is recognized in the bill of rights as a universal human right.  This means a judge could ask the politicians to defend every aspect of their restrictions.. and ask if the city and state’s fees and regulations placed a discriminatory and unwarranted burden on the black citizens of Chicago.  To quote one of our favorite academics, Dr. John Lott said, “You really need to ask whether or not politicians are consciously trying to disarm certain groups of people.”

John -If you’ve bought a firearm recently, then you know the ATF requires us to disclose our race and ethnicity before we can buy a gun.  The ATF says this this data is required by the Office of Management and Budget.  OMB says they never required the data.  Entering the wrong data or refusing to divulge the information is sufficient reason for the ATF to revoke a gun dealer’s Federal Firearms License.  US Representative Diane Black from Tennessee sponsored a bill to remove the race and ethnicity data, or at least make it voluntary.  The bill states- “The federal government may not require any person to disclose the race or ethnicity of the person in connection with the transfer of a firearm to the person.”  Congressman Ted Poe of Texas said  “This ATF requirement is intrusive and unnecessary. As long as the gun is purchased lawfully, race or ethnicity should be irrelevant.”

Gun Quotes
Rob- #1) If you have 10,000 regulations, you destroy all respect for the law. —Winston Churchill

Rachel #2) “You can spout all the anti-gun noise you want. You can tell me guns are ‘macho’ and ‘masculine’, and accuse me of trying to be like the ‘big boys’ if I carry one. I don’t care. I’ve been raped, and I’ve decided that I would much rather defend myself “than sit back quietly and be ‘ladylike’.” – Julie Batson (Found on the Cornered Cat Facebook Page)

Paul- Hang on everybody, we’ll be right back after this
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Segment 3 Interviews

Audio of Massad Ayoob from GRPC 2014 “Targeting Gun Free Zones”

Segment 4 DGUs

John – Brandy Moreno took out a restraining order against Leo Henry.  Henry was her ex-boyfriend.  Brandy Moreno was so frightened for her safety and the safety of her children that she also got a handgun.  She showed her 11 year old daughter how to use the firearm.  That turns out to have been a very good decision.  Before 4 AM Tuesday morning, Leo Henry broke into the home where he used to live.  He broke into the home despite a restraining order.  He stabbed Brandy Moreno several times.  The attack continued until the 11 year old shot Mister Henry.  Both Mister Henry and Ms Moreno were taken to Oklahoma University medical center for treatment.  Court records show that Henry was charged in 2013 in Oklahoma County District Court with a misdemeanor count of domestic abuse assault and battery. The case was dismissed.

Gary commment- what if the young woman had been taught to call 911 instead of protecting herself with a firearm?

John comment- then the news story would probably be about a murder rather than a defensive use of a handgun.

Paul – (I REALLY want to do this one) Grand Rapids Michigan police are investigating a shooting at a bankruptcy court…. Well they are calling it an “accidental” shooting. What most of us would call it is a negligent discharge. a court security officer was “cleaning” his gun when he pointed the gun at his hand and pulled the trigger on a live round. Pulling the trigger is required to disassemble some guns for cleaning, but when I bought my Glock I was told of this by the sales rep ( and of course it is in the instruction book that you get with your gun). You might be asking “why the heck is this in with the DGU’s? Well I think that it is news in that this was someone who is around guns all the time and is paid to work with them. It only takes a second of distraction to ruin your day when working with a firearm. There are more models than just the Glock that require a trigger press to disassemble please take your time and whenever you are placing a gun in your hands to what my friend Charlie Foxtrot once said on the old GRRN forums. think to yourself “ok this is for reals”

Rob – A DGU that has REALLY been making the rounds on the internet.  It is the story of a young Las Vegas woman who had a problem with a stalker. The young woman, who doesn’t want to be named, had enough problems that she got a restraining order.  Luckily she didn’t stop there.  She also got a gun. She was awakened at 1:15 am on Friday to the sound of her door being kicked in. The following quote is directly from her Imgur post  “I’m writing this staring at the mess the police left for me, in a bit of a fog.  After 6 months of stalking and threats against my life my stalker finally snapped and decided to kick my door in and make good on his promise.

“Out of fear, the past month I had begun sleeping with a chair propped against my front door, to give myself a few extra precious seconds in case of emergency.  I shudder to think how differently things might’ve turned out had I  not barricaded the door.

“I awoke around 1:15 am to the sound of the door giving way after one kick followed by the sounds of my stalker struggling to dislodge the chair while forcing his way inside. I jumped up and grabbed the gun I’ve learned to do everything even shower with.

“I stood at the top of my stairs and fired twice. Hitting him in the chest, I hear his scream, his disbelief that I’d stood up for myself.. 0 to 100 in milliseconds. I’ve never been so afraid in my life. I do not know if he is living, but I do know the police have him and that’s what helps the most.

“For months of him evading the police I began to question whether he was unstoppable. Untraceable. Houdini, he would murder me and get away with it. As of now I’m in a haze of  guilt, surprise, relief  and disbelief. I shook as the canines drag him out from his hiding place under a bush. I survived, where so many people do not. Holy shit, I survived.”

John comments-  Stalking and rape are about power and control.  I’m glad this young woman decided to protect herself.

Rachel – At 4:30 in the morning, a Houston area grandmother was cooking breakfast with her three granddaughters.  That is when three armed men broke into her home.  Fortunately, an adult son heard the disturbance.  The son heard grandma say “please don’t hurt the girls” and grabbed his handgun.  He shot two of the intruders.  One of the criminals died on the scene and two escaped.  The eight family members living in the home were unhurt.

The family runs a construction business, and police are investigating why they were targeted for the break in.

John – A Knoxville, Tennessee home invader found out the hard way that kicking in a man’s door will get you shot. Jeffrey Minor shot the home invader with his shotgun as his door was breached. According to Knoxville police, the suspect then fled on foot but not before shooting at Minor’s house with a handgun and then dropping it. He was arrested when he appeared at a local hospital for treatment for the gunshot wound to his arm. Police say that Minor was in fear of his life but are still investigating.

Rachel – Mark Vaughan recently sold Vaughan’s foods that he started.  Mister Vaughan stayed on to help run the place in Moore, Oklahoma.  That morning they’d fired an employee.  The employee returned and stabbed a female employee working in the office.  The attacker then cut off her head.  The employee then attacked a second woman before Vaughan shot him.  Vaughan was a reserve sheriff’s deputy.

We have the links to each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com if you want to share them with a friend.

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Segment 5 Show close

John Listener e-mail discussion

Email from Ken in AZ,

I heard you need more emails so, here we go.
How do we ensure the security of a Free State? The 2nd Amendment says by keeping and bearing arms, right?

Therefore, doesn’t it logically follow that 2A is saying it’s the duty of the citizen to keep and bear, as well as his right? I mean, if we aren’t keeping and bearing arms, we can’t ensure the security of anything! So, to be a good American, we have to.

It’s a pretty nifty system. The 2nd Amendment protects our right to keep and bear, and in turn, we protect it by keeping and bearing. And ’round and ’round and ’round it goes, each part supporting the other part. It’s an infinite feedback loop of freedom, to coin a phrase.

Ken S.
Phoenix, AZ
Free States of America

PS Thoughts and prayers for Bob Mayne of Handgun World Podcast as he is fighting cancer.

Paul- William emailed this one in.

A short one, plan on other topics later. You mentioned the Ruger LCR in 9mm. Moon clips are very fast for reloading wheel guns. That’s great for competition but don’t forget that moon clips are thin metal plates and therefore fairly easily bent. Carrying reloads that way may be great for speed but if the clip gets bent then you are dead in the water so to speak. I’d rather sacrifice a bit of speed than chance not being able to reload at all. Just my opinion.

Rob -A listener from South Carolina who asked that we don’t identify him on the air emailed this in.

Several episodes back there was some discussion about carry in your own home.
When I am home, I am in the place that should be the most secure. Consequently, I always have a Charter Arms Undercover .38 special in a pocket holster. I have other, heavy duty firearms in the home but the CA .38 is always handy and even when I take shower it is in a pants pocket in the bathroom with me.
Please take a look at this link and see if we qualify as a South Carolina Second Amendment group for your listing.
http://palmettocc.us/
Thanks for all you and crew do to help us stay informed and alert.

Rachel- Marc in Ohio emailed about a DGU we talked about on the last episode that we recorded.

Hello,
I’m sending you a link to a news story about a shooting in a town I work in. I have talked to officers on scene. The store clerk was open carrying a 1911. The thieves were so focused on the robbery they went right past the clerk. The clerk was shooting and walking backwards to a door. The clerk did not know there was a third thief watching outside the doorway. When this thug and the clerk met it scared the lookout and his shot at point blank was at the clerk’s hip. I’m told the clerk did an outstanding job shooting. The clerk even continued to shoot after being shot high in the hip with a hollow point .45 The thief that shot the clerk is the one still at large.
Capacity matters and the clerk emptied his 1911. Open carry did not alter the thieves plan. They had hoodies tied tight around their faces. Maybe the hoodies kept them from seeing the openly carried firearm.
The officer started his story to me by saying, “Did you hear the story about gun owners doing it right?”. No charges are expected to be filed on the clerk.  http://gunssavelives.net/self-defense/video-store-clerk-shoots-and-kills-2-of-3-armed-robbers-in-gunfight/

Marc from Ohio

(DO NOT READ)The Polite Society download app is out on Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.

Rob, do you have any new posts from your SlowFacts blog you want to mention?

Rob- I posted two articles since our last show.   I live in San Diego County, California.  My sheriff prefers disarmed civilians.  He says law enforcement will keep us safe.  He is wrong.  I wrote about the recent victims of violent crime in San Diego County.

I also wrote about some crazy feminists who said women promote rape by protecting themselves.  More precisely, women promote rape culture on campus when they advocate awareness, avoidance and self-defense. That hit a nerve since I’ve asked my wife and daughter to practice awareness, avoidance and self-defense.  Both articles are up at Clash Daily.. and they will be up at my blog and at Ammoland.

Paul Comment – Love the comment about seatbelts

John do you want to mention anything off of your blog you would like to talk about?

I did an article on Friday regarding an attorney running for the NC Ct of Appeals. Mark Davis was the lead attorney for the state defending NC’s emergency powers act that prohibited firearm possession off premises during a declared emergency. That case, Bateman v Perdue, was brought by GRNC and SAF and which was won by Alan Gura. My point was that even in non partisan elections we need to check out the candidates because, even with all their endorsements, they could really be anti-gun.

(DO NOT READ)Look at the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.  Subscribing from the link in our show notes helps Bob and Ben as well as helps us here at the Polite Society Podcast.

(DO NOT READ)Join your local civil rights group like the New Jersey Second Amendment Society, Arizona Citizens Defense League, Gun Owners of California, Commonwealth Second Amendment,  Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Florida Carry, Georgia Carry, Georgia Gun Owners, Grass Roots North Carolina, Illinois Carry, Maryland Shall Issue,  Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry, and  Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.

There are Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance,  Nebraska Firearms Owners Association,   Citizens for a Safer New Jersey, New York State Rifle & Pistol Association,  Open Carry Texas, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Virginia Open Carry,  West Virginia Citizens Defense League, wisconsingunowners.org, and Wyoming Gun Owners.

For our Canadian listeners, and their supporters, join the Canadian Shooting Sports Association and the Canadian National Firearms Association.  If YOUR state or local organization isn’t read each episode, then send us an email and we’ll add them!

Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast.  I’d like to thank (Guests) for joining us today.  co-hosts, will you be with us next time?  I’m looking forward to it.  Until the next time…
Rob: stay safe,
Rachel: be aware,
John: and we’ll see you down the road.

Episode 168 – Frank Fiamingo and the Government Shutdown

Stinger (Gail Predator)
Grrn liner
Open: Show read and intro music.

Seg 1:Catch up and GRPC
You go to the SHOT show for Hardware, you go to the Gun Rights Policy Conference for Software; go for the people.  The first time you go to hear the speakers.  The next time you go to learn what your fellow activists have been doing for the last year.
My best finds?  I met Brian Aitken who was arrested and convicted in NJ, and Beverly Zaslow who is the producer at Politichicks.  I also brought Sticks the phone number of another cute female shooter.

The movie “Assaulted: civil rights under fire” is now released onto compact disk.
http://www.examiner.com/article/federal-judge-says-fast-furious-lawsuit-may-proceed
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Seg 2 Ask Gundoc 2 and Frank 1
Ad – Slipstream

Seg 3 Frank 2
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Seg 4 Frank 3
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Seg 5 – Government shutdown
Contact Governor Jerry Brown and ask him to veto the California anti-gun bills.
Governor Jerry Brown, c/o State Capitol, Suite 1173, Sacramento, CA 95814, Phone: 916) 445- 2841, Fax: 916) 558- 3160

http://www.northwestohio.com/news/story.aspx?id=953619#.UkxCVoZwrC7

My (Paul) personal theory,  Dump the Departments of Energy, Federal Aviation Administration, Labor, Education,and Commerce. While we are at it, how about trashing the EPA, OSHA and the FMCSA. (←that is the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration for us stationary types.)  Turn the TSA over to private companies at the airports and pass 2 constitutional amendments, 1) the congress MUST spend less than the combined tax receipts for the previous year and 2) all laws passed by congress apply equally to congress.
These things will never happen, but it would fix the problem.
Will the French Republicans support this?  I doubt it!

Sarah Palin on Facebook,Sarah Palin
It’s beyond shameful to see Barack Obama disrespect and mistreat our World War II veterans so blatantly. Obama’s political stunt to “shut down” their memorial by barricade is to elicit an angry response to generate bad publicity for people the president uses in his continual blame game.

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Roadgunner podcast mag 40 May 16th through 19th of next year.