Episode 407 – Shelley Hill and Kevin Davis

Full Episode Download: http://traffic.libsyn.com/politicsandguns/407.mp3

1- Open and Personal News Segment

2- News Segment 

3- Interview Segment 1: Shelley Hill

4- Interview Segment 2: Kevin Davis

5- DGU Segment:

6- Email and Show Close:

 

1- Introduction

Paul: Welcome to the polite society podcast sponsored by the Firearms Policy Coalition recorded on Thursday, the 20th of April, I’m Paul Lathrop

Rob: I’m Rob Morse and on tonight’s show we talk with Kevin Davis about when Police officers should use force, and when you should.

John: I’m John Richardson, and we’ll talk about bad things happening to good people.

Gary: I’m Gary Daugherty and in one of our DGU’s we talk about two criminals that failed in the victim selection process by breaking into a retired Marine’s home …so climb aboard

Rob: strap in

John : and hang on!

Paul:  episode 407 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.

Show intro music.

 

Personal news from each participant (when you are done with your segment please ask the next person what has been up with them)

 

Rob, Live fire at the range, dry fired a couple times at home.  I finished Dustin Solomon’s book, “Building Shooters”.  I recommend it.  It changed how I train and how I teach.   I booked a hotel room for a beginning firearms class I’m taking.  I have to buy ammo.  I met my first legal texas 30.06 sign.  I recorded a few episodes of Self-Defense Gun Stories.  I got my car ready for a trip.. And that is firearms related because.. NRAAM.

 

John – Like Rob, we are getting ready to leave for Atlanta for the NRA Annual Meeting. We’ve been checking out the MARTA rail system which, by the way, allows concealed carry on its trains. I’ve been pocket carrying my Ruger LCP II a lot and it is really convenient. I also just bought a shoulder holster from Ken Null which I hope to use with a revolver. I will have to practice with it a good deal before I decide to carry with it. That’s about it for me.

Rob

 

Gary

Paul/Susan: New AR – patreon

John – Patches – I’ll have them up on the Facebook page. $10 for 1, $18 for 2.

Promo about upcoming training classes here.

(June 9-11 2017). MAG-30. Georgetown, TX

(June 24, 25th 2017).  Beyond Concealed Carry Enhanced.  9am -5pm both days. Richmond, IL

(July 8, 2017) Defensive Rifle Skills for the Armed Citizen https://squareup.com/store/concealedcarryassociates

(August 10-13, 2017). MAG-40. Sioux Falls, SD

(August 26 & 27, 2017). Beyond Concealed Carry Enhanced. Sioux Falls, SD

(Saturday, February 3, 2018) Law of Self Defense LEVEL 1 Class: South Dakota

(Saturday, February 4, 2018) Law of Self Defense LEVEL 2 Class: South Dakota

Break

 

2- News 1

 

Bad Things Happen No Matter Where You Are

The world endured a harsh wake-up call this last week to the fact that evil things still happen despite the daily hope that nothing bad will happen as one carries out normal errands like visiting family and grocery shopping. According to his uploaded facebook video, Steve Stephens manipulated his tool to murder 74-year-old Robert Godwin. Excusing himself from personal responsibility, he blamed it on his failed courting relationship with Joy Lane. Instead of sympathy for his pain from his gambling debt and other problems, the nation banded together to bring this killer to justice by actively helping the police with their manhunt. The suspect ended his own life after being cornered by the police chase, leaving the nation to ask, ‘what else could go wrong?’

http://abcnews.go.com/US/cleveland-facebook-murder-suspect-shot-killed-pursuit-police/story?id=46863880

http://www.cnn.com/2017/04/18/us/cleveland-facebook-killing-video/index.html

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2017/04/18/inside-mind-facebook-killer.html

The question was semi-answered in a state known for its numerous laws limiting citizens, but not convicted criminals from packing illegal weapons and murdering on a whim. Conflicting motives of the once outgoing down to earth and health advocate security guard, Kori Ali “Black Jesus” Muhammad are unclear. He encouraged followers with hashtags such as “#LetBlackPeopleGo” and “black warriors” need to “mount up” against the “white devils”, but he shouted “Allahu Akbar” or “God is great” in Arabic when police tackled the suspect to the ground ending in his arrest. His random shooting spree had been at 4 locations with 3 Caucasian fatalities ranging from 34 -58. Whether it was his religious beliefs, gang affiliations, or hate crimes, he is claiming insanity and the possibility that the justice system is conspiring against him. The nation is torn about guns and personal safety once again.

 

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/fresno-shooting-suspect-kori-ali-muhammad-custody/

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/04/18/fresno-shooting-rampage-suspect-who-shot-dead-3-wanted-to-kill-as-many-people-as-possible-police-say.html

 

Paul – POGO if you can

John – I despise the term “hate crime” – aren’t all crimes based upon a measure of hate? Violence is violence – does the reason really matter?

 

Rob- John, all crimes are not hate crimes.  Some people didn’t get a permit to open a lemonade stand.  There is evil in the world.  Laws won’t stop these murderers.  You will.  Thank you for taking care of the people you love.

 

Peruta to be heard by the Supremes?

An infamous case from the infamous Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals appears to be first in line to find out what newly confirmed Justice Gorsuch is all about.  Justice Gorsuch is scheduled to participate in a hearing as to whether the Peruta v. County of San Diego case will be heard by the nation’s highest court.  

 

The Peruta case revolves around California’s “good cause” requirement for law abiding citizens to be issued a carry permit.  This case was originally found in Mr. Peruta’s favor by a three judge panel of the Circuit.  The infamous Kamala Harris, then California Attorney General, pushed to have the case heard en banc.  In June 2016 the court reversed the panel’s ruling, thus supporting the “good cause” requirement and ignoring the precedent set in the Heller case.

 

The hearing of this case by a Supreme Court that actually follows the Constitution should provide an excellent starting point for a new era of rights restoration.  Do you think the District and Circuit courts will listen?

 

John- This week they  refused to hear a case out of New Jersey – Stephens v Jerejian. That case, however, was a pro se or serving as his own attorney. Those kind of cases are dangerous in that the pro se plaintiff doesn’t really know the law and a bad case can then end up as a precedent.

 

Gary-

 

Rob- The SCOTUS rules on how court decisions were made, not on the decision.  They would remand the case back to the lower court and describe the proper standards of review.

 

Paul- I read a story today that there are rumors flying about another resignation in SCOTUS

John- That would be Charles Grassley of Iowa. He is chairman of the Senate Judiciary Comm.

John- Justice Kennedy is most senior followed by Clarence Thomas.

 

Show me how gun free zones help people

Lawmakers in Missouri are busy fighting the good fight.  Representative Jered Taylor has sponsored legislation that would eliminate many “gun-free zones” throughout the state.  The criminal hunting grounds include child care facilities, universities and churches.  Of course, a Kansas City representative, Jon Carpenter seemed shocked.  He asked, “Is this for show or is this for real?”  Kudos to Rep. Taylor for stating that he wants, “individuals to be able to choose…”  He realizes that signs do not stop criminals.  Another voice speaking the truth is always helpful.

 

Missouri Rep. Nick Schroer is sponsoring another bill that would hold those who post “gun-free” signs in their businesses liable for harm suffered by disarmed patrons.  As he so eloquently said, “These killers are not stopped by a sign on the front door.”  

 

Way to go Missouri!

Rob- I want to make the politicians show us the plastic signs stop crime.

John- Missouri is a strange state. Conservative state with liberal bookends.

 

College employees Volunteer to Carry

Approximately 500 public university employees in Tennessee are carrying concealed firearms on college campuses.  The current law only allows full-time employees to carry on campus.  The University of Tennessee police chief, Troy Lane, is concerned.  He is, “unaware of how or why adding part-time employees would make [the] campus safer.”  His concern is that they do not know the part-time people as well as the real co-workers.  Perhaps he is unaware that these people must be vetted through the permitting system in place for the State.  

 

These people who know better than the rest of us continue to fight any measure that would result in more people being able to defend themselves or others from violent attacks.  They grudgingly admit that they are unaware of any problems that have arisen from good people carrying firearms on the State’s campuses.  

 

Rob- Guest lecturers, police chiefs are appointed, not elected.

John- You mean like I used to be. I knew most of the business faculty.

 

Gun Quotes- An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it . Col Jeff Cooper

More: http://www.catb.org/esr/fortunes/rkba.html

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1KZaH8_eP_ofJXMetPAgoe6wwJ9MeUWcDtvqPE3xUQ08/edit

 

Hang on everybody, we’ll be back with our guest (Name).

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3- Interview 1

 

4 – Interview 2

 

Kevin Davis trains civilians and law enforcement on the use of force.  He wrote the book Citizen’s Guide to Armed Defense..and he recently spoke at the recent Rangemaster Tactical Conference.

Welcome Kevin.  His book is “Citizen’s Guide to Armed Defense”

https://www.amazon.com/Citizens-Guide-Armed-Defense-Kevin/dp/1440243638

 

Compare and contrast when police officers should use force vs when civilians should.

So, as a graduate question, help our listeners.  Suppose your adult daughter hears someone banging on her door in the middle of the night.  How should she answer it so she will be safe from an attacker, and from a policeman who is at the wrong house looking for a known criminal.

Kevin R. Davis blog. http://www.kevinrdavisblog.com

 

5- DGUs (at beginning) These discussions are NOT legal advice. Some of us are trainers, but this is not formal training and YOU NEED formal training. The Defensive Gun Use segment is intended as information, NOT as training. As always the opinions of the hosts are only their own opinions and not those of any sponsors or other affiliations.

 

Best Defense

Paul and Kristin Sadler retired to their bedroom one evening last month and their Doberman pinscher, G,  followed.  As they fell asleep, G ran out of the room barking.  They called him back thinking he was aroused by the neighborhood coyotes.  After 15 minutes, G was off again.  This time they heard a man saying “Whoa…whoa.”

 

A home invasion.  The Sadlers had prepared after watching an episode of “The Best Defense” on the Outdoor Channel.  They had felt safe in the country in rural Iowa but after watching the show, they started discussing their plans on what to happen if someone invaded their home.  

 

Plan A. Paul grabs his firearm, but that plan was thwarted when he left his gun in the kitchen.  Fortunately, Kristin Sadler had hers.

 

Plan B. Kristin called 911 and Paul went for his gun.  He snuck into the kitchen, located his gun in the dark and then flicked on the lights.

 

A “clean-cut young man” stood in the kitchen.  Paul pointed his gun at someone for the first time and asked what he was doing.  The man was lost, ran out of gas and clearly confused.  It took authorities 20 minutes to arrive during which time, Paul continued to hold up his gun and they talked.  He said he was a veteran of the recent wars.  They never found out if he was armed.

 

Not every DGU ends with the trigger being pulled.  Like we say you need formal training.  These DGUs are not formal training but they will give you some ideas for situational awareness.  What am I or are we going to do if…..  For preventing a home invasion, lock all ground floor doors and windows.  Have a plan.  Get firearm training for home defense.  Consider a safe room.  Be aware of a your surroundings.  Use these DGUs to consider what can happen and develop a plan in your head on how will you react.  Plan for alone and with your family.

(End of Story)

 

John

Rob- Having a plan kept this intruder alive.  The couple trained to recognize a threat.

Paul – Have you practiced holding at gunpoint? It is NOT easy.

 

Vets like guns

Two career criminals picked the wrong apartment to break into.  That apartment belonged to a Marine vet and his 29 year old son.  The two thugs were  dressed in black, one was holding a 2 foot pipe.  Brian Sant, the veteran was still up at 3 AM after working the late shift when the pair kicked in the door.  He began to fight with the two which woke up this son.  He stepped out of the bedroom and fired at both intruders.  Scorecard 1 dead and 1 in serious condition.

The room temperature thug, Danny Tupu had dozens of convictions ranging from misdemeanors to felonies and was wanted on a warrant for his arrest.  The police immediately ruled the shooting self-defense but later changed their statement saying that the case had been turned over to homicide investigators.  

 

Sant commented “You got veterans living around in these apartments.  You don’t know who has got a gun.”  He stated that he did not know the men or why they picked his apartment to invade. After the last eight years of brilliant salesmanship by Mr. Obama, I think the same could be said of any home.  With Utah lowering the age to 18, even outside the home, you don’t know who will be armed.  (end of story)

 

Uber Crime Encouragement Zones

Uber has a policy prohibiting drivers and riders from carrying firearms.  A 44 year old driver is lucky he ignored that policy.  Just after dropping off a passenger in the early morning hours, two men jumped in his car and one point a gun at him and told him to drive.  He drove to a location on Bienville in New Orleans where he was ordered out of the car.  He got out but fought back and fired on the two, wounding one.  The pair left his car and fled the area.  

Nine days later, NOPD arrested one suspect in the incident who had gotten a private ride to the hospital where he was treated for a gunshot wound to the chest and also confessed to the botched robbery.  When the thug and his “friend” fled, they crossed the Mississippi and his friend dumped him at a gas station and “left him there to die.”  His accomplice is still on the loose.

The governments and companies insist on creating crime encouragement zones.  Uber has a No Guns policy for both drivers and riders.  For the driver, it could mean losing his Uber job.  For a passenger it would mean loss of the use of the service.  If they were caught.  Like was stated in an story from a previous similar incident, “If only criminals obeyed the laws, this rule would make sense.”  Sometimes what they don’t know, won’t hurt them.  For this driver, ignoring company policy may have saved his life.  Uber drivers, or Lyft drivers for that matter, should not forfeit their Second Amendment right to defend themselves when they turn on that available switch in the app. Paul can talk to trucking companies doing the same and has many times. (end of story)

Rob- Some companies ban employees from being armed, yet the company will take out a life insurance policy on the employee, and the company gets paid if the employee dies.

Don’t go in there

While we are on the subject of young thugs, this time in Greenville, NC.  In the middle of the afternoon, the homeowner was notified by his alarm system of a break-in.  He notified police during his drive home.  He found 4 inside when he arrived home.  They ran and he fired after them.  He did manage to wound one in an arm.

 

The five 17 and 18 year olds were caught that same day.  One spent time in the hospital while the others were spending time in the local jail.

 

Why did the homeowner enter his house before the police arrived?  Why did he fire while they were running away?  He didn’t know if they were armed.  He could have been walking into an ambush of sort.  And if they were running away from him, he was not in any danger.  Luckily for him, he is not being charged. (end of story)

 

Rob- Gary, what is best practice in this situation.

John – He is lucky because under NC law what he did was illegal. A guy in Western NC was recently convicted of manslaughter for shooting at a fleeing robber.

Rob- I saw two signs on the ceiling of a DoJo.  They said Breathe, and Keep Working.

 

We post each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com  Please take a minute and share them with a friend.

 

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6- E-mail, blog notes, and show close

(605) 215 – 1438

onair@politicsandguns.com

Listener voicemail

 

An on body concealed gun collection- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTrXpDK_EYE

 

Paul: Rob, do you have any new posts from your SlowFacts blog you want to mention?

 

Thank you, Paul.  I wrote “Disarming the Victim- The Latest Shots in the Democrat’s War on Women”  We had a murderer shoot his wife on a “gun free” campus in “gun free” California.  We had a domestic abuse victim murdered while she waited for permission to buy a gun in New Jersey. And we had Virginia Governor Terry McAuliffe say that domestic abuse victims should not have guns.  If that isn’t a war on women, then I don’t know what is.

 

I also wrote about having guns on campus, but to know more about that article, you’ll have to look for it at Clash Daily, at Ammoland and on my blog, slow facts dot wordpress dot com.

 

John, tell us what’s new at your blog no lawyers only guns and money?

 

John- I have a number of new posts up since we last recorded. Judicial Watch is suing BATFE for documents related to the proposed ban on green tip 5.56 ammo. President Donald Trump is coming to speak at the NRA Leadership Forum. Trump will be the first president since Reagan to speak to the NRA meeting. Finally, a group of anti-gun law professors – but I repeat myself – have weighed in on the lawsuit pending before the Connecticut Supreme Ct trying to say Bushmaster was at fault for selling “military grade assault weapons” to civilians that was then used to kill school children in Newtown. They say nothing about how the killer obtained the firearm – he killed his own mother!

 

That and more is at only guns and money dot blogspot dot com.

 

We would like to thank Charlie Foxtrot for writing up show notes for us. Even though you don’t hear him on the air he is certainly part of what you do hear. Look at his blog at not one more gun law dot blogspot dot com

 

Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast.  I’d like to thank Kevin Davis and ??for joining us today.  So for Charlie Foxtrot, Dana, Jae, Gary, John, Rachel, Susan, Craig, and Rob,  until next time

(Paul, stop talking now)

 

Gary: stay safe,

Rob: be aware,

John: and we’ll see you down the road.

 

HANG OUT FOR 2 MINUTES

 

(after show close) How could we have made this episode better?

 

(DO NOT READ)Look at the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.  Subscribing from the link in our show notes helps Bob and Ben as well as helps us here at the Polite Society Podcast.

 

(DO NOT READ)Join your local civil rights group like the New Jersey Second Amendment Society, Arizona Citizens Defense League, Gun Owners of California, Commonwealth Second Amendment,  Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Florida Carry, Georgia Carry, Georgia Gun Owners, Grass Roots North Carolina, Illinois Carry, Maryland Shall Issue,  Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry, and  Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.

 

There are Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance,  Nebraska Firearms Owners Association,   Citizens for a Safer New Jersey, New York State Rifle & Pistol Association,  Palmetto Concealed Carry, Open Carry Texas, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Virginia Open Carry,  West Virginia Citizens Defense League, wisconsingunowners.org, and Wyoming Gun Owners.

 

For our Canadian listeners, and their supporters, join the Canadian Shooting Sports Association and the Canadian National Firearms Association.  If YOUR state or local organization isn’t read each episode, then send us an email and we’ll add them!

 

(DO NOT READ)The Polite Society download app is out on Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.

 

Episode 406 – Andrew Branca

Full Episode Download: http://traffic.libsyn.com/politicsandguns/406.mp3

1- Open and Personal News Segment

2- News Segment

3- Interview Segment 1: Andrew Branca

www.lawofselfdefense.com

4- Interview Segment 2: Andrew Branca

www.lawofselfdefense.com

5- DGU Segment:

6- Email and Show Close:

 

1- Introduction

Paul: Welcome to episode 406 of the polite society podcast sponsored by the Firearms Policy Coalition, I’m Paul Lathrop

Rob: I’m Rob Morse and on tonight’s show we will talk with Andrew Branca about defending yourself legally after you’ve defended yourself physically.

John: I’m John Richardson, and we’ll talk about a California man who is forcing the state to give him his guns back

Amanda: I’m Amanda Suffecool and Delta Airlines may be violating Federal law with their new policy on check firearms.

Gary: I’m Gary Daugherty and in one of out DGU’s an Oklahoman with an AR15 defends himself against 3 thugs! .. so climb aboard

Amanda: strap in

John : and hang on!

Paul:  episode 406 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.

Show intro music.

 

Personal news from each participant (when you are done with your segment please ask the next person what has been up with them)

 

Rob, Bill Frady was moving last Thursday and Friday.  He asked us to guest host, and Paul was on the road.  I had Cheryl and Dan Todd, Dr. John Edeen and Amanda Suffecool to help me as guest hosts.  It is great to have friends who have their own radio show so I can call them to help me.

 

John – Since we last recorded I have become a NRA Certified Instructor in Basic Pistol. I took the instructor class locally and passed both the written and shooting portions of the class. Dry fire practice really helped me prep for the class. Our class had a range of people ranging from a youth pastor to a retired NY hospital administrator to a metallurgist. We had a total of 9 in the class. There are two groups I hope to teach in Basic Pistol – the newbies who bought firearms in the last couple of years and school teachers. I’d like to run a class for teachers showing them how to safely handle a firearm if a kid should bring one to school.

 

Rob- Thank you, John.  That is a great idea.

 

Amanda – this week I am practicing quick drawing for a movie audition in cleveland.  Who knows if they will pick me,  but this is definitely outside of my comfort zone.  And in the gun toys area… can I tell you about a new toy that I just got?  MantisX

 

Gary

 

Paul/Susan very busy few weeks. Arkansas run (BEAUTIFUL Southwestern Missouri) Run to PA and gave away Ice Cream!  New classes booked, get to that in the training segment. Local woman murdered – offering free training.

 

Vicki Kawelmacher is an instructor who did the same thing in Reno, Nevada. https://www.facebook.com/womensshootingacademy

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2017/04/04/stalking-victim-protective-orders-not-enough-women-need-handguns/

 

Promo about upcoming training classes here.

(June 9-11 2017). MAG-30. Georgetown, TX

(June 24, 25th 2017).  Beyond Concealed Carry Enhanced.  9am -5pm both days. Richmond, IL

(July 8, 2017) Defensive Rifle Skills for the Armed Citizen

(August 10-13, 2017). MAG-40. Sioux Falls, SD

(August 26 & 27, 2017). Beyond Concealed Carry Enhanced. Sioux Falls, SD

(Saturday, February 3, 2018)Law of Self Defense LEVEL 1 Class: South Dakota

(Saturday, February 4, 2018)Law of Self Defense LEVEL 2 Class: South Dakota

 

Break

2- News 1

Rob- A Clovis California family forces the state to return 500 guns

Albert Shaklee, the former budget director of a hospital in the Fresno area sought some psychological help in 2014. We don’t know and it doesn’t matter what for. What matters is that seeking that help caused the FFL holder to come under the attention of Kamala Harris, the California attorney general who wanted to run for Senate.  Harris was looking to make some headlines, and she proceeded to do just that.

 

Harris ordered the raid of Shaklee’s home and then widely publicised the seizure of 209 handguns, 88 shotguns, 234 rifles, 181 standard capacity magazines, 10 high capacity magazines, 100,521 rounds of various ammunition, and 10 firearms registered with the DOJ as “assault weapons” including a .50 caliber rifle.

 

The problem is that Shaklee had committed no crimes. He wasn’t accused of any crimes. , all he had done was seek mental health help. That mattered nothing to Harris who had a campaign to run.

 

The raid found the guns in a locked and alarmed safe and all of the weapons that required registration in California were registered. As of last July the district attorney for Fresno county declared the situation resolved and that there would be no charges against Shaklee, yet they kept the guns.  

 

This week some justice has prevailed. A court has ordered the guns be turned over to a FFL so they can be returned to Shaklee. (end of story)

 

Paul – This is horrifying. A case where gun owners can reasonably fear if they seek mental health care that their rights will be taken from them thereby insuring that they do not seek the care they may need.

John – I read some of the comments on the story. One question asked why anyone needs 500 firearms.

Amanda – was he a FFL himself? Did they take his livelihood?  And hold it for more than a year

Gary –

Rob-

 

JohnDoes Delta Airlines New Policy to Zip Tie Luggage Containing Firearms Violate Federal Law?

Guns.com is reporting that Delta Airlines has quietly changed its policy related to passengers who are flying with guns. According to the NBC Affiliate in Fort Lauderdale. This policy was apparently implemented after the shooting that occurred in the Fort Lauderdale airport, after the criminal retrieved his luggage, went to the bathroom to load his firearm and then proceeded to murder five people and injured six others. The airline will now have special tags to alert ground handlers to not put bags carrying weapons on the general carousel.

The baggage will go directly to a baggage service agent who is required to perform an ID check on the passenger who picks up the luggage, sources told NBC 6. The agent must then use zip ties to secure the bag.

 

Interestingly enough, it appears that Delta may be in violation of federal law by implementing such a policy.

John – The law that this may very well violate is none other than the Brady Bill!

Rob- https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/922

18 U.S. Code § 922 – Unlawful acts section e-  …No common or contract carrier shall require or cause any label, tag, or other written notice to be placed on the outside of any package, luggage, or other container … contains a firearm.”

 

Amanda –  Rob and I are flying DELTA to go train at the AG&AG conference in two weeks.   What can I expect?  

 

Paul – this is a great identifier for thieves that work for the airlines.

Gary –

 

Rob- How can I carry wire cutter to cut the airlines cable ties?

Amanda – perhaps I just don’t fly with my FAVORITE gun.  

 

Gary- New Nevada Bill Allows Home Invaders to Sue You if You Shoot Them

 

A man’s home is his castle, or so the saying goes. And people should be able to protect their homes – including our most precious asset, our families – against intruders without fear of a lawsuit.

 

Some Nevada politicians are trying to change that. They think that you should be financially liable for any injuries they sustain when you defend yourself — even in your home.

 

Does that sound convoluted? It is. And, it’s ridiculous. If someone is invading your home, the last thing you should be thinking about is being sued if you use force to defend yourself or your family.

 

Senate Bill 254 removes the provision in Nevada law protecting people from civil liability when they justifiably use potentially deadly force against a person who is injured or killed while invading their home.

 

Rob- I will bet you odds that this bill was sponsored by the Nevada state bar association.

 

Rob- Both Nevada houses have Democrat majorities.

John – Civil immunity was part of NC’s Castle Doctrine adopted in 2011.

 

Gun Quotes: Every time something really bad happens, people cry out for safety, and the government answers by taking rights away from good people.   Penn Jillette

 

Hang on everybody, we’ll be back with our guest Andrew Branca.

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3- Interview 1

Andrew Branca.  Law of Self-Defense.

CLE credit.

Say very little unless you’ve studied what to say.  Don’t blather.

 

Innocent by reason of..

Do prepaid services cover your costs?  Andrew works with all of them.

Gary- Have any of your students been involved in self-defense cases?

Andrew- Students get angry at me when I explain the law.  Don’t get angry at me if you don’t like the law.  Change it.

 

John – You did great work on Legal Insurrection educating people on the issues in the Trayvon Martin case. What or how can the media be educated on the difference between Stand Your Ground and the Castle Doctrine?

Andrew- The media often needs to inflame more than they want to inform.

Rob- Our listeners are the good guys.  Most self-defense claims in court are brought by criminals.

 

4- Interview 2

Andrew Branca.  Law of Self-Defense. (Part 2)

http://www.time.gov/

 

5- DGUs (at beginning) These discussions are NOT legal advice. Some of us are trainers, but this is not formal training and YOU NEED formal training. The Defensive Gun Use segment is intended as information, NOT as training. As always the opinions of the hosts are only their own opinions and not those of any sponsors or other affiliations.

 

Three Against One AR-15

Early in the morning, five criminals quietly approached a Broken Arrow, Oklahoma home. They had previously burglarized the house’s detached apartment, now they returned to rob the main house, seeking more expensive goods and cash. The three experienced home-invaders were outfitted for their crime; dressed all in black, masked, gloved and armed. One or two waited outside in the car as planned. The team moved silently to the back of the house, then smashed the back glass door and rushed inside.  

The crash startled Zachary Peters, 23, awake. He ran to investigate and to protect his father, who was also in residence.  On the way out of his bedroom, he grabbed a firearm, a wise move. Peters found three black garbed men in the home’s kitchen and faced with those overwhelming odds he feared for his life and fired. Peters then retreated, barricaded himself in his bedroom and called 911. Given the events, he described the situation in a remarkably controlled manner and pleaded for the 911 operator to quickly send medical help for his assailants.       

 

Arriving deputies found all three intruders dead from single gunshot wounds; one was in the driveway, two were still inside the house. The home’s two residents were uninjured. There was no sign of a getaway car.


Up to this point, this was a somewhat unremarkable home-invasion. It was just another example of this type of crime – a crime that is becoming increasingly prevalent. Perhaps it was a bit unusual, as the intrusion was actually thwarted. However, with the successful use of a civilian firearm, there would have been little notice given by the mainstream media. The story would have been largely forgotten; except for one fact: the firearm used was the left’s despised boogieman: the AR-15.  

The publicized hand-wringing was immediate and intense. Many media reports questioned the “fairness” of using an AR-15, even in a fight for life. Some fixated on the young age of the criminals, ignoring that two were actually adults and their ages were masked by their garb. Very few reports mentioned the potentially deadly nature of the three-on-one assault. In a sympathetic jailhouse interview, the getaway driver, ironically called “the mastermind”, admitted to the home-invasion and other robberies, but wouldn’t take responsibility for the “murders.” The grandfather of a deceased claimed that his grandson shouldn’t have died for a “bad decision.” The cameras were tightly focused when the grieving man said; “There’s got to be a limit to that law.” Other mass media reports hoped that this case would somehow test the Stand Your Ground laws and all but called for the homeowner’s son’s arrest.

Perhaps one of the more over-the-top examples was ABC Good Morning America’s legal analyst, Nancy Grace. In a rambling, error-filled, tour de farce pulled directly from her ample behind, Grace first incorrectly tied Stand Your Ground to the George Zimmerman case, then defamed it as the “Make My Day” law. To her, AR-15s were “considered bad” and “just like a M-16 military rifle… a semi-automatic weapon.” She further smeared Oklahoma’s laws as an homage to Dirty Harry. No less an elite than ABC’s World News Tonight anchor David Muir reported on the Broken Arrow shootings during the GMA segment. From beneath his trademark deeply furrowed, concerned brow, Muir described Grace as one who “always cuts to the chase.” Our listeners are invited to determine for themselves just what Grace was cutting.

 

In Andrew Branca’s excellent National Review piece; “Mainstream Media Gets ‘Stand Your Ground’ Laws Wrong — Again”, Oklahoma’s Castle Doctrine is identified as the controlling law. The state’s legislation holds that while in their home, it is presumed the defender has a reasonable fear of death or bodily harm and that the intruders intend to commit violence. With those presumptions, a finding of self-defense is very likely. The police are in apparent agreement; while the event is still being investigated, the Wagoner County Sheriff has officially stated that Zachary Peters’ use of force was justified.

 

There is little to celebrate in this sad affair, except that the victim is alive and will not be victimized a second time by a criminal and civil legal system unjustly concerned with “fairness” and the choice of life-saving equipment. Unfortunately, the mass media will not be as principled.  
What this tragic event amply illustrates is the media’s obvious biases and proud and willful lack of firearm and self-defense knowledge — as well as their overwhelming desire to inflict their biases on the American public.

 

For The Polite Society Podcast
“The Swan Song”

CF

 

(end of story)

 

Gary – Also listening to the 911 recording the, victim said one of the criminals was still in the house and talking and she proceeded to tell him to unload the gun.

John – Nancy Grace is a disgrace to the legal profession and has skirted legal ethics more than once.

Rob- Five on One.  One of the fleeing criminals died on the driveway as the getaway car drove off without them.  The victim had presence of mind to tell the police that the family had dogs and that the dogs were not a threat to the police.

Amanda – 5 on 1,  3 on 1.  that was my first thought – they had brass knuckles and Knives, and 3 on 1.  Yet they- the anti gun agenda folks were singing –  Its not fair.

Paul – I cannot remember who said it, but it’s true… “If you are in a fair fight your tactics suck”

 

Don’t piss off the old guy

When you have had your home broken into 13 times since last summer, you tend to prepare for the next time.  Granted most of the 13 were while you were away.  The 79 year old homeowner was asleep in his home when he was jolted awake by loud noises coming from his basement. The 3 home invaders moved to the floor where his bedroom was and entered his bedroom.  By the time they entered his room he had armed himself with his .38 revolver.  “It was just POW POW POW.”  He got off 5 shots.  1 thug was killed and 2 of the thugs ran and the homeowner chased them.  There were shots returned in the homeowners direction and he was hit in the ankle with a through and through wound.  “I never felt it.  I fell twice.”

 

The shooting was ruled justifiable.  Although POGO applies to waking hours, it is wise to have a firearm within easy reach while in bed.(end of story)

 

Paul – I would like to discuss

Gary –

John – No kids in the house but will be getting a easy-open bedside safe for when my granddaughter comes to visit.

Amanda –  even if you have kids –   you can get into good a

quality safe in less than 4 seconds.

Rob- I had a young man ask about guns.. But he said he needed a safe before he brought guns into his home.  One of my instructors said she is very good at opening her safe.. Because she does it every morning.

Look at Hornady bedside safes, or a simplex lock.

We post each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com  Please take a minute and share them with a friend.

 

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6- E-mail, blog notes, and show close

Listener e-mail discussion

 

Voicemails… 2 of them!

 

Amanda – DIck Durbin story.   Dc project

 

Text Message #1 Have to step aside for a second. Please continue

 

Can we acknowledge how awful it is to wear flip flops in public? Call me overly tactical but those are terribly unprepared for dangerous circumstances. -CB

 

Rob- Police investigators mentioned criminals looking for girls wearing flip flops or wearing high heels.  

John – I just think of 9-11 and those who had to evacuate the Twin Towers ran into problems with their office heels.

 

Text message #2

Just listened to 405 subj: deep conceal. I work a University with a required dress code. I’ve tried the smart carry rig, the belly band rig, but now am sold on the bugbite ankle rig it is amazing. i carry the g-42 8-10 hrs a day no one notices and it is extremely comfortable/thanks for the show

 

Mr Anonymous asks about deep concealment pocket holsters

Hi, Paul & crew

I sent a brief text while traveling but felt the need to elaborate on the subject of deep carry options.

First, thank you for your labor of love and the service you provide through your podcast. I especially enjoy hearing different perspectives from your round table discussions.

I work at a University and have a uniform provided. I can somewhat relate to the nurse who raised a question about carry options as well as the practice. Rachel’s answer was spot on. Each person must decide based on what they consider an acceptable risk.

 

I wish to address the secondary issue of how to carry. Over the years I have tried a variety of options which are all compromises but nonetheless, “better to have it and not need it” has been my mantra.

 

I’ve used the following: Ruger LCP in a nemesis pocket holster; the same in a galco bellyband; a J-frame in a smart carry; but I’ve settled on the G-42 in a new product called the bugbite ankle holster; It is the most comfortable rig I have ever worn. Honestly, after a one day wear/break in period you don’t even know you are wearing it. The first week I committed the mistake of touching the area just to make sure it was there. It feels tight for the first few minutes of putting it on but after that, the material conforms to your calf/ankle and you are on your way.

This is not a quick draw option but it is a comforting one. I just wanted to pass it on for what it’s worth.

Sent in by Mr Anonymous

 

A Michigander writes in

 

Hello All –

Just finished listening to Episode 405.

Gary mentioned he was going to have the opportunity to hear Mr. David Keene, one of the authors of the book Shall Not Be Infringed, the New Assaults on Your Second Amendment, speak.

So, Gary… did Mr. Keene speak about the United Nations “Arms Trade Treaty?” I finished the book recently and was surprised how much of the book was dedicated to explaining the Arms Trade Treaty and how the United Nationals works (or doesn’t work). I know the book’s perspective is one-sided considering one of the authors is a former NRA President; nevertheless, the facts are the facts. I think the authors intended the book to be read before the election and in preparation for a Hillary Presidency.

It was really disturbing to hear how an American President (Obama) orchestrated and planned a complete end-around on the 2nd Amendment and the delivery of the American people as in… “We the People” … to the will of the U.N.

So, do you guys think the US Senate would ever ratify a U.N. treaty that would so flagrantly violate the Bill of Rights?

Clearly that was the game plan if Hillary got the Presidency and the far-Left did better in the Senate last November.

I don’t remember…did anybody bring up President Obama’s failure to up hold the Constitution and his Oath of Office when he asked the U.N. to put the Arms Trade Treaty up for approval shortly after he won his second term.

Regards,

Your Faithful Anonymous Michigan Listener

 

John – Only if they can get 67 votes to ratify the treaty.

Amanda – we want it pulled up to vote and KILL it

 

A listener offers Rob some advice

Another good podcast.  Early on, one gentleman said he was coming to Austin for a MAG20 class.  I trust that he is a responsible adult and purchased a round trip ticket.  Also, once back home, I encourage him to tell everyone what a wonderful place Lubbock is.

— Matt

Rob-  Dear Matt.  I’ll drive.  They have lanes that lead in, and lanes that lead out of Austin.

 

Finally Clayton chimes in

Okay so every decent trainer knows the value of dry fire. But I have never heard anyone address the incorrect “muscle memory” neurological pathway training of giving your Glock/Smith and Wesson/etc. a quick slide rack between every single trigger pull. Anybody with a reeeeally high dry to live fire ratio might be affecting their performance under adrenaline. Thoughts?

 

Rob- I get it.  Clayton is …

If you are doing a lot of dry fire, then get a SIRT pistol.

 

Amanda – my walther does not require it..

Gary-

John – I love my SIRT but I’d also suggest a revolver. If you can smoothly pull the trigger in a double action revolver, it will help all the rest.

have a

 

-Clayton Some More

 

Paul: Rob, do you have any new posts from your SlowFacts blog you want to mention?

 

Rob-

https://slowfacts.wordpress.com/2017/03/27/violence-and-utopia-realism-and-idealism-in-the-age-of-gun-control/

 

Clash Daily.  Ammoland.  Slowfacts. That is at slow facts dot wordpress dot com.  John, tell us what’s new at your blog no lawyers only guns and money.

 

There are a couple of post I’d like to point out. First, I have updated Every Picture Tells A Story to include the newest Constitutional Carry states. When Rob Vance and I started this series, Illinois still didn’t have concealed carry and only 3-4 states had permitless carry. The other post illustrates the battle between science and ideologues over suppressors and the Hearing Protection Act. The post has a link to the recent white paper put out by Doctors for Responsible Gun Ownership endorsing suppressors on public health grounds.

 

That and more is at only guns and money dot blogspot dot com.

Ask Amanda what has been going on at Eye on the Target Radio

 

We would like to thank Charlie Foxtrot for writing up show notes for us. Even though you don’t hear him on the air he is certainly part of what you do hear. Look at his blog at not one more gun law dot blogspot dot com

 

Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast.  I’d like to thank Andrew Branca for joining us today.  So for Charlie Foxtrot, Gary, John, Rachel, Susan, Dana, Jae, Amanda, Craig, and Rob,

(Paul, stop talking now)

 

Rob: Until the next time…

Gary: stay safe,

Amanda: be aware,

John: and we’ll see you down the road.

 

(after show close) How could we have made this episode better?

 

(DO NOT READ)Look at the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.  Subscribing from the link in our show notes helps Bob and Ben as well as helps us here at the Polite Society Podcast.

 

(DO NOT READ)Join your local civil rights group like the New Jersey Second Amendment Society, Arizona Citizens Defense League, Gun Owners of California, Commonwealth Second Amendment,  Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Florida Carry, Georgia Carry, Georgia Gun Owners, Grass Roots North Carolina, Illinois Carry, Maryland Shall Issue,  Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry, and  Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.

 

There are Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance,  Nebraska Firearms Owners Association,   Citizens for a Safer New Jersey, New York State Rifle & Pistol Association,  Palmetto Concealed Carry, Open Carry Texas, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Virginia Open Carry,  West Virginia Citizens Defense League, wisconsingunowners.org, and Wyoming Gun Owners.

 

For our Canadian listeners, and their supporters, join the Canadian Shooting Sports Association and the Canadian National Firearms Association.  If YOUR state or local organization isn’t read each episode, then send us an email and we’ll add them!

 

(DO NOT READ)The Polite Society download app is out on Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.

 

Episode 405- Victoria Taft, Brian Hill, and Melissa Sutton

Full Episode Download: http://traffic.libsyn.com/politicsandguns/405.mp3

1- Open and Personal News Segment

2- News Segment 1

3- Interview Segment 1: Guest Melissa Sutton

Links- http://toesinthesandtravel.agentstudio.com/

4- Interview Segment 2: Guest  Brian Hill

Links – http://rachealsrest.org/

http://www.thecompletecombatant.com/

5- Interview Segment 3-  Victoria Taft

6- DGU Segment:

7- Email and Show Close pt 1:

8- Email/Blog Posts and Show Close 2

1- Introduction

Paul: Welcome to the polite society podcast sponsored by the Firearms Policy Coalition recorded on Tuesday, March 21st, 2017, I’m Paul Lathrop

Rob: I’m Rob Morse and on tonight’s show we have a personal protection story where a thug brought an ax to a gunfight.

John: I’m John Richardson, and we’ll talk about the far side of the gun counter.

Rachel: I’m Rachel Malone, and I’m excited to announce a hearing for constitutional carry in Texas!

Gary: I’m Gary Daugherty and in one of our DGUs we talk about husband and wife teamwork .. so climb aboard

Rachel: strap in

John : and hang on!

Paul:  episode 405  of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.

Show intro music.

 

Personal news from each participant (when you are done with your segment please ask the next person what has been up with them)

 

Rob-  I put out another episode of the Self-Defense Gun Stories podcast just before I went to the Rangemaster Tactical Conference in Little Rock, Arkansas.  I got to talk with some friends from Texas while I was there.  They are Bob Mayne, Ben Branam, Dr. John Edeen.  I talked with Jeff and Robyn Street from Florida.  We got to visit with Tom and Toby from the Armed Squirrels Project.  I also saw Paul Carlson, Marty Hayes and Massad Ayoob.  There were certainly some fascinating lectures and demonstrations.  Paul, I saw a very vivid demonstration on the flaws of competition shooting.

 

I signed up for a MAG20 in Austin, Texas.

 

John – I have been taking the NRA’s online basic pistol class in preparation for Basic Pistol Instructor Training this coming weekend. As part of that training, you have to take the online portion of Basic Pistol. I will say this – it is comprehensive! In other gun news, we have finally have our Form 4 for a suppressor approved by the ATF. It only took 9 months, 6 days or 279 days from start to finish. I am waiting for the dealer to ship it to me. As to my Form 1’s, I’m guessing 12 months because they were filed in July. Maybe the Hearing Protection Act will be passed in the meantime!

 

Rachel

  • Texas GOLD was a success!
  • ALL HANDS ON DECK for a committee hearing for Constitutional Carry in Texas. It will be Tuesday, March 28. We are asking everyone who possibly can to come to the Capitol sometime that day before the hearing is over and simply register your position in SUPPORT of the bill. More info here: http://www.texasfirearmsfreedom.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/SupportConstitutionalCarryinTexas.pdf
  • Shooting / teaching news: I did a 3-day run n gun – it was a little long. I taught a mother-daughter MAG-20 – it was lovely. I scheduled my next public MAG-20 for May 20-21 – I am excited.
  • Activist tip of the day: Google is your friend.

 

Gary

 

Paul/Susan Going out to eat. Constitutional carry vetoed in SD North dakota has passed it and the governor has said he will sign

 

Promo about upcoming training classes here.

April 30th Beresford, SD new shooters day and “open” range day

(June 24, 25th 2017.  Beyond Concealed Carry Enhanced.  9am -5pm both days. Richmond, IL)

(August 10-13, 2017. MAG-40. Sioux Falls, SD)

(August 26 & 27, 2017. Beyond Concealed Carry Enhanced. Sioux Falls, SD)

Break

FSOGC – Charlie Foxtrot

 

The Far Side of the Gun Counter

 

Customers

The retail gun game is a hard one. One of the most onerous parts of the job are the obsessive fans of one particular firearm manufacturer. They’re usually easy to identify; look for the slack-jawed, glassy-eyed and drooling. When you spot that customer standing at that counter — like that uncle standing under that mistletoed doorway — your soul dies just a little – again.  But, the customer is holding their turn-ticket like a Key to the Kingdom, and likewise it’s your turn in the barrel, so you mentally sigh, force a smile, unlock the drool-stained showcase with its well-licked glass, and show the customer his preciousssss.   

These customers are drawn to the expensive, overly pretty guns, with their shiny finish, mirrored flats, flashy grips and overdone details. They reach out with grasping claws, eager to fondle their object of desire. Many exhibit psychosomatic tics, like repeatedly mouthing the sale tags out-loud, while overemphasizing the words “Ultra”, “Super”, “Pro”, “Raptor” and “Master.” They obsess over the “Custom” monicker of the mass-produced guns. Others violently shake the firearm, manipulate the safety, repeatedly rack the slide, or compulsively drop and reinsert the magazine, as if to demonstrate some mastery over the powerful icon.

 

        And they always want to talk – at length. Many parrot the advertising on the backs of most gun magazines. They’re full of outrageous tales, like 300 yard one hole groups and instantaneous pinkie knockdowns. More often than not, they claim “my gun has never jammed.” This might actually be true, as few of those guns ever leave the sock drawer after purchase. These fan boys are inhabitants of the far left of the Dunning-Kruger Opinion v Knowledge curve, given all the ignorant nonsense they continuously and confidently spout. Excessive rolling of the eyes is a leading health issue of firearm’s salesmen.  

What these customers seldom do is buy. They’re gun tourists, firearm pilgrims. They simply want to bask in the awesomeness of their icon. They’re drawn to the worship like primitives to the golden idol. Deep in their desiccated souls, they must realize they are not worthy of their god-iron. So they drool, they sigh, they wish and they use the time of the firearm sales associate very extravagantly.

        Don’t be a Kimdiot. Or failing that, poke some good-natured fun at all those Smith and Wesson fanatics while they’re laughing at the Grip-Zone crowd, who are calling the SIGophants snotty for looking down their noses at the Ruger Kids. To plagiarize the 20th Century’s leading philosopher, Rodney King, “Can’t we all get along and hate on Hi-Points?”

That was from Charlie Foxtrot, a self admitted Glock fanboy, for the Polite Society Podcast.

 

Gun Quotes (tonight we have 2 gun quotes.

  • We don’t own these skills. We lease them. And if we don’t make payments they’ll be repossessed.- Glenn Plunkett
  • “A man’s rights rest in three boxes. The ballot box, jury box and the cartridge box.” – Frederick Douglass

 

Hang on everybody, we’ll be back with our Defensive Gun Use segment.

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3- Interview 1

 

4- Interview 2

 

5- DGUs  (at beginning) These discussions are NOT legal advice. Some of us are trainers, but this is not formal training and YOU NEED formal training. The Defensive Gun Use segment is intended to spark discussion and consideration, NOT as training. As always the opinions of the hosts are only their own opinions and not those of any sponsors or other affiliations.

 

Rachel- Home Invasion Actually Attempted Murder?   

What initially looked like an all too common violent home invasion, is now looking to be something much more sinister.

A seventy-seven year old was awakened by a loud crash in the night. A man had used a pickaxe to batter down an outside door. When the intruder destroyed his bedroom door with the pickaxe, the terrified resident resorted to his own weapon, and he fired the gun at the attacker. The Foley, Alabama police arrived at the residence, which also served as the office of Elite Marine, and found Sedrick D. Jemison Jr., 20, dead from a gunshot wound.  

The case was before a grand jury to  examine the claim of self-defense when additional facts came to light. Evidence placed Adam Klifton Bond, 32, and Katlyn Renee White, 20, near the crime scene. The two were arrested, with White being identified as the getaway driver and Bond labeled as the criminal mastermind of the crime. One of them later fingered Corey Deandres Marshall, 19, as being with Jemison during the home invasion. When axeman Jemison was killed, Marshall fled. All three may be charged with Felony Murder for the death of their fellow criminal.  Additional charges are possible for other as yet unnamed participants. Marshall has also charged for a strong armed robbery where he and Jemison hit and choked a woman who had given them a ride. They rewarded her kindness by beating her and stealing her wallet.   

The Baldwin County District Attorney’s Office has not disclosed why the elderly man was targeted for assault and probable murder. The motive may have to do with cash in the Elite Marine office. What is known, it’s very likely the 77-year-old’s use of his firearm saved his life.    

 

The anti-firearm Gun Memorial website “lit a candle” for the deceased thug. No mention was made of the man he was apparently about to kill.    

 

Rob- I bet it was hard for the victim to hear the police after the victim had to shoot the thug several times while shooting inside his bedroom.

John-

Rachel-

 

Rob- Bringing a Rope to a Home Invasion

A Moncks Corner, South Carolina man was forced to defend his family when a violent criminal broke down his door. Rope found on the dead man points to darker plans in the home invasion.

  The resident, his wife and two small children were home when the doorbell rang. The wife opened the door to Juanita Marie English, 28, who was allegedly posing as a member of the homeowners association. English asked a few general questions, then waved toward a car. A masked, gloved man emerged armed with a pistol with a green laser. Seeing the approaching deadly threat, the woman alertly slammed and locked the door and screamed out a warning for her husband.

The armed man kicked open the door. However, the homeowner Justin Washington, 28, stood in his way. Fortunately for the family, the father had his own gun.   

Police arrived to find Elijah Akeem White Jr., 30, dead from four gunshot wounds. White had staggered out of the house to the walk where he died. English fled in the car, but was later pulled over for erratic driving. A search found the name badge she had used when posing as the HOA official. She could be charged with first-degree burglary and criminal conspiracy.


Don’t shed too many tears for the deceased thug, he came armed and ready to do violence. He came with rope in his pockets, showing an intent to tie up the residents. What he intended to do to the helpless man, woman and children can only be the stuff of nightmares. The Moncks Corner Chief of Police said; “There was no doubt he was there to do some serious harm to this family.” All this was in line with White’s long record as a career criminal, with convictions for burglary, weapons and drug possession and prison rioting.

 

“This homeowner had to do what was necessary to protect his family,” according to the Chief. As such, the county prosecutor will not charge the homeowner with any crime. As the coroner said; “In Berkeley County, if you kick someone’s door in and you get shot, as long as I’m coroner, that will be justifiable homicide.”

 

We will point out several important elements of this episode: First, the wife’s alertness and decisive action in slamming and locking the door, then shouting a warning to her husband. Second, the husband’s immediate and effective response to the sudden threat to his family. Third, the rapid availability of the life-saving firearm. In a household with two small children, we can certainly postulate that he had the gun on his person – he had little time for anything else. That’s the advantage of POGO. Lastly, we must reflect on what might have happened in areas with less rational laws and officials. The Washington family may have suffered grievous injury or worse by being disarmed by laws that didn’t affect the lawless in the slightest.  

 

Paul

 

Rob- You will not have time think in an emergency.  You will have time to execute a plan you prepared ahead of time.

 

We post each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com  Please take a minute and share them with a friend.

 

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6- E-mail, blog notes, and show close

 

Listener e-mail discussion

 

Email #1 with the subject line “Tacticool vs Grey Man”

 

John – Hello everyone.

 

I would first like to say I really enjoy your podcast and I have been learning a lot about many of the Second Amendment struggles across the country from you. Thank you!

 

I have had a CCW for over nineteen years.  I believe every person that decides to carry concealed has made a very personal decision and commitment to do so.  I have found peoples philosophy on concealed carry to be just as diverse as people themselves.

 

I would like to hear the groups thoughts about the pros and cons of TactiCool Vs.Gray Man carry.

 

If a bad guy sees a Sheep Dog he may rethink his plans and just leave.

But if you blend in with the sheep you have an element of surprise or possible escape and evasion.

 

Thank you for your thoughts and keep up the good work.

 

Brett from Oregon

 

Paul – this has shades of open carry vs concealed. Personally I have developed 2 “styles” around my concealed carry. #1, winter carry. Large jacket (right now my favorite is barn coat) and everything on an OWB holster (Gun/light/spare mag) with 1 spare mag in strong side coat pocket. Summer carry is a large hawaiian shirt with IWB and pants pocket for the flash.

 

I somewhat disagree with “the sheepdog gets shot first” and honestly think that when we talk criminals they aren’t the sharpest knife in the drawer anyway. If they are paying attention, you will likely be passed over BECAUSE you are paying attention, not because you are open carrying or look like you might be carrying. The criminals that we need to worry about the most are those that are high on a mind altering substance, to get courage up or whatever. Those are the ones who will act without much forethought and are not going to change tactics mid-stream when things around them change. Let’s face it the bad guy is usually looking to make a quick score and escape. The dangerous criminals are the ones with impaired cognition who will keep going after the stop command.

 

Rachel – um, are those my only choices? Because I take issue with being asked to pick either TactiCool or Gray Man. I carry both open and concealed, depending on what I’m going to be doing, what gun I want, what I’m wearing, and my mood. When I open carry in everyday life, I don’t think anyone would accuse me of looking TactiCool. I don’t dress so that everybody notices the gun first.

 

When I conceal, I almost try to make a point of looking more “tactical” (I hate that word – let’s say, prepared and ready to defend myself). My intent is not to infiltrate and attack. My goal is to AVOID harm. I feel the best way to do that is to be clear that it is not wise to pick me as a target. I don’t conceal for the element of surprise. I conceal because sometimes that’s the most practical way to carry for certain activities, or sometimes it wouldn’t be professional to have an OC gun.

 

Story of OC in downtown Austin

 

Rob- We’ve had several Open Carriers robbed in New Orleans.  I don’t OC alone.  I also don’t try to look like the police or military.

Gary-

Paul- concealed carry badges. PLEASE DEAR GOD NO!

John- No one would accuse me of looking tacticool – I look ordinary which I what I consider grey man.

Rob-

===============================

 

Gary – Today I would like to start a group discussion about carrying against an employer’s wishes and deep concealment options for men and women.

My question is inspired by meeting a pretty young woman who informed me she was disarmed for the day because she works at a local hospital I won’t name.

Here in Minnesota that policy does not hold the force of law, alike any private business that bans carry. (Excluding the scarce few state hospitals)

She told me she would be fired and shunned from the medical industry if she were found out because they all communicate with each other.

Are there any pro gun doctors or anyone in the medical field out there with some advice? I’m thinking that scrubs easily conceal a belly band and I’d rather be fired than dead if I’m forced to out myself.
Thanks in advance!

-Clayton again.

 

Paul – Dr Edeen

=============

Rachel- Each of us is responsible for our own decisions. It’s just important to think through and understand what decision we’re being made, and what the costs are, and how likely we are to have to pay the costs. (1) Legality  (2) Breach of contract  (3) Disapproval of employer  (4) Threats to my life

 

Rob- Doctors told me they carry off body in the hospital.

==================================

 

Paul – Hello Crew,

 

After listening to Episode 403, I’d like to offer a quick correction about Lefse.

Although sometimes served at the same meal, Lefse and Lutefisk are indeed quite different.

Lutefisk is the nasty, lye soaked fish that no one in their right mind actually eats.

 

Lefse, on the other hand, is a fairly tasty Norwegian style flat bread, usually a dessert or snack.

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lefse

 

This is the first time I’ve emailed, but I have had the pleasure of meeting all of you in person, with the exception of Charlie Foxtrot of course.

I love the podcast, and I’ve listened to almost every show for about the last 3 years.

Thank you to the entire crew for their time each week to provide a quality show.

 

I’m looking forward to meeting up with everyone again this year at GRPC.

 

Brent

(Not  a Norwegian, but a Minnesotan nonetheless)

===================================

 

Rachel-  Hi,

 

Do you consider dry fire drills valuable, and if so would you describe the drills that you

find most helpful? Only in the last several months have I heard about this type of practice, and when I follow some of the drills I found on YouTube for trigger control, I don’t feel they are helpful, but I must be missing something. I practice drawing from concealment and clearing malfunctions “dry”, and I know these have helped, but I’m struggling with the trigger drills.

 

Thank you very much! Love the Podcast.

 

Regards,

 

Brian

Joshua, TX

 

Rob- The dry practice drill that I enjoy is to put a small dot on a post it note.  Then I put the post it note right beyond the end of my muzzle.  Now you can REALLY see if you shake as you press the trigger.  I also hold that position for 30 seconds while giving a really strong squeeze.

 

I also use a SIRT

 

Rachel- My favorite dry fire drill is punching out from ready, or from a draw – training myself to follow the sight out to target, get on target quickly. Warning: keep your crush grip. Danger of too much dry fire and no live fire is you lose the grip you need for recoil.

==========================================

 

Rob – Hi,

I had a question about why are items like short barrel rifles and short barrel shotguns regulated by the BATFE? This seems absurd. In Texas, at least, we can buy pistols and rifles, so what’s the big deal over the size in between? Isn’t a SBR just a short rifle, or even just a long pistol? And what causes a pistol with a second vertical grip to be so dangerous that it has to be registered as a Class II weapon? When I asked a friend about an AR pistol he was interested in, he commented that it was just like a pistol, but if you put it up against your shoulder is becomes regulated, what? Sorry, I don’t have much background in the history behind BATFE and these laws, are they for real? I don’t get the logic.

 

Thank you. I love the podcast, and appreciate the time all of you put into it.

Regards,

 

Brian

Joshua, Tx

 

Rachel – it seems absurd because it is absurd. 😛

John – There is no logic. Historically the NFA meant to ban handguns but there was opposition. As I understand it they forgot to take our SBR and SBShotguns.

====================================

 

Paul: Rob, do you have any new posts from your SlowFacts blog you want to mention?

 

Rob- When it comes to the field of gun-free zones, we can’t learn everything from our own experience. We can learn from experts who’ve concentrated the experience from many thousands of lives.   

 

The experts say time is critical in an emergency.  They say we are the only solution until help arrives.  We are the only first responders who can limit the damage caused by the next violent criminal.  Read more of the article, “What the Experts say about Self-Defense and Gun-Free Zones

 

That is up at Clash Daily.  Ammoland.  Slowfacts. That is at slow facts dot wordpress dot com.  John, tell us what’s new at your blog no lawyers only guns and money

 

I haven’t been blogging as much as I’d like the past week or so. Nonetheless, I’d like to point our listeners to Judge Neil Gorsuch’s testimony regarding the Heller decision. I have it excerpted on my blog. He leaves Dianne Feinstein frustrated with her gotcha questions.

 

That and more is at only guns and money dot blogspot dot com.

Talk about CF

We would like to thank Charlie Foxtrot for writing up show notes for us. Even though you don’t hear him on the air he is certainly part of what you do hear. Look at his blog at not one more gun law dot blogspot dot com

 

Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast.  I’d like to thank (Guests) for joining us today.  So for Charlie Foxtrot, Gary, John, Rachel, Susan, Craig, and Rob,

(Paul, stop talking now)

 

Rob: Until the next time…

Gary: stay safe,

Rachel: be aware,

John: and we’ll see you down the road.

 

(after show close) How could we have made this episode better?

 

(DO NOT READ)Look at the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.  Subscribing from the link in our show notes helps Bob and Ben as well as helps us here at the Polite Society Podcast.

 

(DO NOT READ)Join your local civil rights group like the New Jersey Second Amendment Society, Arizona Citizens Defense League, Gun Owners of California, Commonwealth Second Amendment,  Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Florida Carry, Georgia Carry, Georgia Gun Owners, Grass Roots North Carolina, Illinois Carry, Maryland Shall Issue,  Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry, and  Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.

 

There are Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance,  Nebraska Firearms Owners Association,   Citizens for a Safer New Jersey, New York State Rifle & Pistol Association,  Palmetto Concealed Carry, Open Carry Texas, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Virginia Open Carry,  West Virginia Citizens Defense League, wisconsingunowners.org, and Wyoming Gun Owners.

 

For our Canadian listeners, and their supporters, join the Canadian Shooting Sports Association and the Canadian National Firearms Association.  If YOUR state or local organization isn’t read each episode, then send us an email and we’ll add them!

 

(DO NOT READ)The Polite Society download app is out on Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.

 

Episode 404 – Greg Hopkins, Kevin Sona, and Philip Journey

Rename this file to the show record date

Get g-mail names of guests.

Please try not to say “And”, “Ahh”, “So” and “Ummm”.

 

Full Episode Download: http://traffic.libsyn.com/politicsandguns/404.mp3

1- Open and Personal News Segment

2- Interview 1 Greg Hopkins Part 1

3- Interview 2 Greg Hopkins Part 2

4- Interview 3 Kevin Sona

5- Interview 4 Judge Phillip Journey

6- E-mail, blog notes, and show close pt1

7- Email Pt2

1- Introduction

Paul: Welcome to the polite society podcast sponsored by the Firearms Policy Coalition recorded on Tuesday, March 7th, 2017, I’m Paul Lathrop

Rob: I’m Rob Morse and on tonight’s show we will talk with Greg Hopkins about the death penalty

John: I’m John Richardson, and we’ll talk with Kevin Sona about a new Facebook Group and some things happening with Florida Carry

Gary: I’m Gary Daugherty and one of our emailers thinks that Rob is all that AND a bag of chips! So climb aboard!

Rob: strap in

John : and hang on!

Paul:  episode 404 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.

Show intro music.

 

Personal news from each participant (when you are done with your segment please ask the next person what has been up with them)

 

Rob-  I was on Bill Frady’s Lock and Load Radio program last Friday.  We set up that interview as I was on the road from a 10 day road trip.  I got to post an article written by Shayna Lopez-Rivas.  She was raped on a Florida College campus and she is tired of being disarmed.  Republicans, take note.  Next week I go to the Rangemaster Tactical Training conference in Little Rock.  Just when I finally got a few episodes of self-defense gun stories.

 

John – I attended the Winston-Salem gun show last weekend and will be working the Grass Roots NC booth this weekend at the Asheville Gun Show. I talked to the volunteers at the GRNC booth in Winston and they were having a very successful show getting new members and email alert signups. Just because we avoided gun-magedon by electing Trump, we will still have to fight hard for our rights. Even with supposedly pro-gun Republicans in charge in Congress and many state legislatures, even they can be obstacles as Paul well knows in South Dakota. I may be taking the NRA Basic Pistol Instructor course in about 3 weeks. Should I?

 

Rob- What is with your attorney General in North Carolina?  Yes, take the basic pistol instructor course.

Gary- Ammo order, Constitutional Carry

Paul/Susan

 

Promo about upcoming training classes here.

April 30th Sioux Falls – a free new shooters introduction

(June 24, 25th 2017.  Beyond Concealed Carry Enhanced.  9am -5pm both days. Richmond, IL)

(August 10-13, 2017. MAG-40. Sioux Falls, SD)

(August 26 & 27, 2017. Beyond Concealed Carry Enhanced. Sioux Falls, SD)

 

Gun Quotes

“Good instructors have a sufficient depth of knowledge, experience, and empathy so as to understand and sympathize with all students who come to them, not just the young, strong, and fit.” – John Farnam

 

Hang on everybody, we’ll be back with our Interview with Greg Hopkins

advertisement

 

2- Interview 1 Greg Hopkins Part 1

 

3- Interview 2 Greg Hopkins Part 2

 

4- Interview 3 Kevin Sona

 

5- Interview 4 Judge Phillip Journey

 

6- E-mail, blog notes, and show close

 

Listener e-mail discussion

 

Voice mail about tire thumpers

 

==============================

 

Text message #1

 

Bless y’all’s hearts! 😂

I’d like Gary to confirm or deny the magazine capacity limit in Illinois and let us know if that applies to travelers please!

Clayton

 

==================================

 

Text Message #2

 

Hey guys, I just couldn’t sit back and let lefse be slandered as it was, I think it is being confused with something else. Lefse is made from potatoes, flour, cream, butter and sugar, rolled out like a tortilla and cooked on a griddle. Spread with butter and sprinkle with sugar

Absolutely terrific! Lutefisk on the other had deserves every bad word spoken of it! Love the podcast guys, keep up the great work! Bryan from NW Minnesota.

=================================================

 

Email from Clayton

 

Just wanted to say thank you to Rob for everything he brings to the table. Rob single handedly shuts down 90% of my potential feedback because he thinks almost exactly the way I do and asks almost every question I want asked and reminds everyone of perspectives I would have written in to remind them of. I’m a big fan of the podcast Self Defense Gun Stories. You’re doing a great job.
-actual Clayton

 

Paul: Rob, I think that you owe Clayton $20

 

=================================================

Rob

Email from Bill Clinton (no not really)

 

Hello Everybody –

Please keep me anonymous, thanks.

Just finished listening to the 400th episode, outstanding episode!!  that was very cool, …live radio, Mas, and Gail Pepin outstanding…

Your podcast usually gets me home on my commute and ends as I pull in the drive way.

The episode was a little longer, so I ended up sitting in my car, in the garage, and listened while the show finished up.

Thanks for answering my question on MAG40 ….I will be attending class in October.

So, here’s my topic for discussion or suggestion for your listeners.

I am not a Constitution scholar or lawyer, I am just an ordinary guy, but I generally understand what the Second Amendment is all about.

During the Presidential campaign, Hillary almost convulsed when she was asked, or spoke about the “Heller Decision.”

So, I decided to do something I have never done…. I read the Supreme Court decision…the District of Columbia v Heller.

Wow!! Now I understand why Hillary became so unglued at the very mention of the Heller Decision.

It probably wasn’t the Court’s finding in favor of Heller; DC’s prohibition of the gun registration, and the required rendering of the gun as inoperable for self-defense while in Heller’s home, seemed far reaching.

Justice Scalia took the opportunity to skillfully lay down the legal precedent for others to use.

Justice Scalia articulated the right is afforded to the individual, as in the singular human being….

and the scope of the right as intended by the Founders of the Second Amendment.

The Justice even dissected, with historical reference, what is meant by “bear” when used with “keep and bear arms.”

Ya… there were sentences/paragraphs, I read three and four times that were packed with “legalese” and legal citations which were difficult to understand.

But that shouldn’t preclude anybody, or intimidate anybody from reading the Court’s decision…both sides of the argument.

There are some real “Scalia-gems” in this document that will equip you to rebut the most ardent opponent to the individual right.

I recommend reading Heller for your listeners, if nothing else it is a terrific American history lesson.

Keep up the good work, I love the show

        On to Miller and McDonald….

 

=================================

 

Gary

 

A Doctor talks POGO

 

>From the time I got involved with DRGO and introduced to your podcast by Dr. John Edeen, I have tried to listen as much as possible.  Especially since this past GRPC. I get great information from your shows and always enjoy everyone’s point of view.  

I want to thank Susan for referrring her primary care physician to DRGO, keep up the good work.

 

I really love the POGO as a general rule, but as rules go there are always exceptions.   Many times when I get up I don’t get dressed right away, (I’m not too much of a minority here am I?).  I put on my robe, eat breakfast, read, study, pray etc then get ready, and not much before I’m out the door, I put my pants on.  You have had some DGU’s where it sounded like the the person had to “get their gun” and luckily were able to do so.  Not a good idea.  So I have two ways I keep my gun on at these times even though I don’t actually have my pants on.  1) I wear a Galco under wraps belly band most days so I can put that on under my robe and still be armed.  2) sometimes I simply put my EDC in my robe pocket.  I recognize this isn’t very secure or safe so I have been looking for a pocket holster.  I think the DeSantis super fly would fit well.  Do any of you have any experience with this type of pocket holster?  Any other ideas?

 

Just finished listening to episode 401, btw congrats on the first 400.  I have one comment for Michael and the arsenal he likes to carry around.  One of you mentioned maybe he should carry a backpack with an AR with a foldable stock.  I have another idea, he could carry a murse or backpack with a KelTec sub 2000.  I just received one for my birthday and I love it.  The greatest part is it folds in half!  Making it only 16.25″ long when folded and very quick to unfold and use as a backup in those critical situations where you need one more backup. There is even a version that accepts glock mags which could be interchangeable with the glock he carries.

 

Thanks for all you do and thanks for mentioning that some of you are already signed up for GRPC this year, I’ll get my registration in today.

Looking forward to seeing all of you at GRPC this year,

Dr. Sean Brodale

From Iowa

=======================================

 

John

Good day PS,

 

Awesome, Awesome show. A wealth of information and entertaining at the same time.

 

Just a quick background, I live in the not so great state of Connecticut. Even though we are a “shall” issue state, each town has its own set of rules (no county governments in CT) before you can get your state Pistol Permit. Connecticut does not have a “conceal carry” permit/license because it is an open carry state, even though it’s somewhat discouraged. We also have the ridiculous law of limited capacity magazines (10rd) on top of the “assault weapons ban”. Now there is an attempt to raise the Permit fees on top of everything else. Enough of that – for now.

 

You, the team, have said to reach out to our representatives – on all levels. Being in a somewhat backward state; we have somewhat backwards representation at ALL levels of government. Seeing most of you have dealing with these types of issues (reciprocity, hearing protection, etc.) in the past; how does one draft a letter telling an uninformed, closed-minded individual that they should vote for the wishes of the constituents? I am not much for being overly polite or have the patients when telling someone that they are there to represent me and the others of their “district”. It’s not their personal soap box. I was wondering if you may have a template/example that can be tweaked to fit the individual, position and issue. (You can place it in the show notes and/or on the website.)

 

Regards

Chris

Torrington, CT

 

Rob- Call, one one issue.  

===============================================

 

Hi everyone!

This one is for Rob, but all information is welcome! Please chime in.

My beloved girlfriend has convinced me to move to California with her for nine months during her senior year of college. I currently live in a state with no restrictions on types of firearms we can own. I find myself realizing, I don’t think I own a single gun that California would allow me to bring there! Free American style AR’s, “high capacity” shotgun, pistols without thumb safeties or loaded chamber indicators, “high capacity” pistols.. etc. Perhaps my Henry AR7 survival rifle would be allowed? Yawn!
What kind of guns would be best suited for my home defense? I’d like to stay in 9mm but am considering something powerful like 10mm since capacity is ridiculously limited there.

I’m assuming I won’t be able to acquire a permit to carry, especially since I won’t live there long enough to be considered a resident. Nine months?

Thanks in advance for the advice!

Lots of love, Anonymous.

============================================

 

Paul: Rob, do you have any new posts from your SlowFacts blog you want to mention?

Shayna Lopez Rivas wrote an article and I got to repost it on my blog- “It’s RINO Season and it’s Time to go Hunting: An Open Letter to the Florida Republican Party”

 

As I mentioned earlier in the show, Shyna was sexually assaulted on campus.. Twice.  The republican have not held hearing necessary to advance pro-gun legislation.. Including concealed carry on campus.

 

I also wrote about carrying on college campus- What College Professors Say and What They Really Do  You see, tolerance on campus stops when academics have to be tolerant.  Liberal professors don’t like guns, so other people shouldn’t be allowed to have them.  The problem isn’t that students with carry permits are drunk on campus.  The “gun-free zone” on campus is about school administrators who are drunk on power.

 

My posts are up at Clash Daily.  Ammoland.  Slowfacts. That is at slow facts dot wordpress dot com.  John, tell us what’s new at your blog no lawyers only guns and money.

 

We found out late on Friday that the Trump Administration won’t be fighting the District Court win regarding carrying of firearms on Corps of Engineers lakes and campgrounds in Idaho. They filed a petition with the 9th Cir. Ct. of Appeals saying they were looking to codify the ruling in the District Court. They have entered into an agreement to go into mediation while the Army reconsiders the policy in question. The USACE administers about 33% of the waters open to freshwater fishing in the US. This has the potential to be a big regulatory win for the right to self-defense.

 

That and more is at only guns and money dot blogspot dot com.

 

We would like to thank Charlie Foxtrot for writing up show notes for us. Even though you don’t hear him on the air he is certainly part of what you do hear. Look at his blog at not one more gun law dot blogspot dot com

 

Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast.  I’d like to thank (Guests) for joining us today.  So for Charlie Foxtrot, Gary, John, Rachel, Susan, Craig, and Rob,

(Paul, stop talking now)

 

Rob: Until the next time…

Gary: stay safe,

Paul: be aware,

John: and we’ll see you down the road.

 

(after show close) How could we have made this episode better?

 

(DO NOT READ)Look at the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.  Subscribing from the link in our show notes helps Bob and Ben as well as helps us here at the Polite Society Podcast.

 

(DO NOT READ)Join your local civil rights group like the New Jersey Second Amendment Society, Arizona Citizens Defense League, Gun Owners of California, Commonwealth Second Amendment,  Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Florida Carry, Georgia Carry, Georgia Gun Owners, Grass Roots North Carolina, Illinois Carry, Maryland Shall Issue,  Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry, and  Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.

 

There are Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance,  Nebraska Firearms Owners Association,   Citizens for a Safer New Jersey, New York State Rifle & Pistol Association,  Palmetto Concealed Carry, Open Carry Texas, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Virginia Open Carry,  West Virginia Citizens Defense League, wisconsingunowners.org, and Wyoming Gun Owners.

 

For our Canadian listeners, and their supporters, join the Canadian Shooting Sports Association and the Canadian National Firearms Association.  If YOUR state or local organization isn’t read each episode, then send us an email and we’ll add them!

 

(DO NOT READ)The Polite Society download app is out on Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.

 

Episode 403 – Still More Interviews

Full Episode Download: http://traffic.libsyn.com/politicsandguns/403.mp3

1- Open and Personal News Segment

2- Interview Segment 1 Guest Alan Gottlieb

3- Interview Segment 2: Guest Justin Delosh

4- Interview Segment 3: Guest Lynne Disanto

5- Interview Segment 4: Guest Jeff Knox

6- Interview Segment 5: Guest Jeff Knox (part 2)

7- Email and Show Close:

 

1- Introduction

Paul: Welcome to the polite society podcast sponsored by the Firearms Policy Coalition recorded on Sunday, February 26th, 2017, I’m Paul Lathrop

John: I’m John Richardson, and tonight we will have an interview with Alan Gottlieb of the Second Amendment Foundation

Rachel: I’m Rachel Malone, and we’ll also talk with Jeff Knox about the upcoming NRA elections

Paul: And finally we will talk with South Dakota Representative Lynne DiSanto about Constitutional Carry in South Dakota, So climb aboard!

Rachel: strap in

John : and hang on!

Paul:  episode 403 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.

Show intro music.

 

Personal news from each participant (when you are done with your segment please ask the next person what has been up with them)

 

John –  I took off last Friday morning to go to the range. I got to fire my dentist’s Ruger Redhawk .44 Magnum revolver. It was a pussycat with .44 Special and not hard to control in .44 Magnum. I also worked to break in my LCP II. It’s will be a nice little carry gun when it is fully broken in. The NC Wildlife Resources Commission really upgraded the Cold Mountain range and added a full time RSO. They want to add a 25 yard pistol bay. It brings home the point that we need more funding for public ranges. The Target and Marksmanship Training Support Act of 2017 would allow more ammo excise tax money to go this. This is a bipartisan bill, HR. 788, which needs our support. Similar bills in the past two Congresses almost got to the end line. This year it should. Links in the show notes.

 

Rachel – Wow, this has been a busy week! Constitutional carry is still my priority, and I’m doing all I can to promote HB 375. Texas GOLD, our Gun Owners Lobby Day, is coming up this week. I picked up T-shirts and they look great. I’m really proud that we have 10 gun rights organizations who are participating. We’ve been promised a hearing soon, so be ready to come to Austin on short notice if at all possible. I’ve been giving a LOT of presentations for groups all over town – learn to testify trainings, briefings on all the gun & knife bills, and more. I also recorded a set of videos that is a condensed version of the Learn to Testify training. Check that out on my YouTube channel – be sure to like and subscribe! Other than that, I got to teach a short rifle clinic for the A Girl & A Gun ladies yesterday morning. It was great to smell gunpowder and I miss it when I’m not on the range – so I’m planning a MAG-20 course in May. I was given a seat at the TSRA awards banquet head table so I got to visit with keynote speaker Katie Kieffer. She gave them ideas on how to appeal to millennials. That’s important for them since our ages combined probably equaled the average age in the room.

 

Gary

Paul/Susan

 

Promo about upcoming training classes here.

(June 9-11 2017. MAG-30. Georgetown, TX

(June 24, 25th 2017.  Beyond Concealed Carry Enhanced.  9am -5pm both days. Richmond, IL)

(August 10-13, 2017. MAG-40. Sioux Falls, SD)

(August 26 & 27, 2017. Beyond Concealed Carry Enhanced. Sioux Falls, SD)

 

Break

 

6- E-mail, blog notes, and show close

 

Listener e-mail discussion

Paul

We got a text from Mike from the Reloading Podcast

 

Just wanted to say on the steel case, yes you can reload it and the laquered stuff doesn’t seem to cause as much wear as bare steel

Mike from the Reloading Podcast

 

We also got a text from someone who didn’t leave their name

 

Congratulations on 400 episodes! I enjoy the podcast so much. You keep me up to date on issues in the gun world and entertain as well.

Rachel

Clayton emailed in

 

Hi all!

I am sorry to disappoint you, Gary. But I still don’t know what it’s like to drive through Chicago disarmed. Illinois state law honors my permit from my home state as long as I stay inside my vehicle! I never took off my gun! The only thing I did was down load my magazines from their standard 17 to 15 because I figured Illinois has one of those ridiculous magazine capacity limits as if crime were actually decreased that way..

I learned of the statute that allows non residents to carry inside their vehicle when I had a heated email argument with the state police. I am certified with the USCCA and my material is approved for me to train your residents to get their permit to carry. Yet mine is invalid merely for living outside your borders. I couldn’t possibly be trusted with a gun in your state, right?!


Fingers crossed for fifty state reciprocity, I’m giddy when I imagine carrying my guns in tax slave states that previously didn’t allow it. (Looking at you, Commiefornia!)

Thanks for calling me out, I enjoy chatting with you all. Have a lovely week and congratulations on your recent episode 400.

Sincerely, Clayton.


John

Michael wanted to talk a little more about backup guns

 

Followup to the on-air discussion…

 

You probably won’t be able to use this, but this video talks about why to carry spare ammo on your gun side (Reid Henrichs of Valor Ridge).

 

https://youtu.be/Ut68yJ0IGCg

 

Also, my ankle gun becomes my primary when driving (I commute 2+ hours total per day), so having a spare mag in my cargo pocket leaves it accessible when seated, which can’t be said for the front pocket.

 

A backup isn’t always just a backup… I like to think of it more as another option, depending on the situation.

 

Michael

Paul

Matt wrote in to talk about battery life for optics

 

The manufacture stated battery life on most slide mounted red dots approaches 2-3 years. But obviously it is suggested you change them every year on a defensive weapon. The trijicon I used at mag 40 was a dual illumination model that is powered by ambient light and tritium. With the half life of tritium being 10 years. That means that after 10 years the brightness with no ambient light will be cut in half. That will have no affect on the ambient light. Meaning the theoretical plinking useful life is  unlimited. On paper this sounds fantastic but has some fairly major downsides that would lead me to suggest a battery powered optic due to the level of tint on the lens required to make the dual illumination work. You can see a demonstration of it here. https://youtu.be/MefuHqWVteY

I hope that cleared up any questions you have.

 

Matt

 

Rachel

Todd wanted to talk a bit more about National Reciprocity

 

Hey all, thanks for reading my email last week about revolvers and national reciprocity. To muddy the waters further with regard to CA, the safe handgun roster not only affects sales but also the transfer of handguns into the state. State law requires any individual moving into the state to declare their handguns to DOJ, and of course, submit the required fee. Handguns not currently on the roster are not allowed in the state. Take that back to the national reciprocity law. It’s unclear if “complying with state law” would encompass adherence to the roster as well.

 

Incidentally, I am a libertarian and more of a “states rights” guy – I think states that want to suck should be allowed to suck, and we would end up with more freedom in more places due to U-Haul than the court system. Unless we move to a national standard for concealed carry (a disaster in my opinion) the only alternative is to allow each state to demand compliance to their state laws while carrying within their borders.

 

I’m no lawyer, but instead of a “race to the bottom” as the gun control states maintain will occur with national reciprocity, I wonder if we’ll see a “race to lunacy” in the states like CA, MA, and NJ.

 

Stay safe!

 

Todd

San DIego

 

PS I grew up in Nort’ Dakota, so if you ever need to read recipes, I’m ok with lefse, walleye, tater tot hotdish, and Juneberry pie.

John

Chris wants to inflate our egos a bit

 

Paul,

 

I must say, it humbled me to listen to your 400th episode.  What you and your team have built over the last 5 years is genuinely awe inspiring.

 

Thank you ALL, both on and off the air (here’s looking at you Charlie Foxtrot) for everything you have done and endured to bring us your knowledge, insight, and wisdom each week.  As other listeners have mentioned, I too put the Polite Society Podcast at the top of my list each week.  I wait in anticipation of each release and I pause whatever else I may be listening to when your next episodes is published.  I enjoy, admire, and even envy the reasoned, intellectual, and principled discourse you share each week.  Your dedication and commitment to fighting for one of our many inalienable rights inspires me each week.

 

Humbly yours,

 

Chris in North Carolina

Paul – beg and throw to John

John – The 4th Circuit Court of Appeals released an utterly ridiculous opinion in the Maryland case of Kolbe v. Hogan. They upheld Maryland’s assault weapons and standard capacity magazine bans. The majority opinion said that AR15s were like M16s and thus not protected by the Second Amendment because they (almost) could be used by the military. The court made a mockery of the Heller decision when they used it as their rationale to allow Maryland’s ban. Sen. Ted Cruz at CPAC raked them over the coals for this ridiculous decision. The main thing this decision shows is how the packing of circuit courts by Obama is making a mockery of constitutional rights.

 

That and more is at only guns and money dot blogspot dot com.

Paul Talk about cons sol

We would like to thank Charlie Foxtrot for writing up show notes for us. Even though you don’t hear him on the air he is certainly part of what you do hear. Look at his blog at not one more gun law dot blogspot dot com

 

Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast.  I’d like to thank (Guests) for joining us today.  So for Charlie Foxtrot, Gary, John, Rachel, Susan, Craig, and Rob,

 

John: Until the next time…

Rachel: stay safe,

Paul: be aware,

John: and we’ll see y’all down the road, bless y’all’s hearts.

 

(after show close) How could we have made this episode better?

 

(DO NOT READ)Look at the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.  Subscribing from the link in our show notes helps Bob and Ben as well as helps us here at the Polite Society Podcast.

 

(DO NOT READ)Join your local civil rights group like the New Jersey Second Amendment Society, Arizona Citizens Defense League, Gun Owners of California, Commonwealth Second Amendment,  Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Florida Carry, Georgia Carry, Georgia Gun Owners, Grass Roots North Carolina, Illinois Carry, Maryland Shall Issue,  Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry, and  Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.

 

There are Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance,  Nebraska Firearms Owners Association,   Citizens for a Safer New Jersey, New York State Rifle & Pistol Association,  Palmetto Concealed Carry, Open Carry Texas, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Virginia Open Carry,  West Virginia Citizens Defense League, wisconsingunowners.org, and Wyoming Gun Owners.

 

For our Canadian listeners, and their supporters, join the Canadian Shooting Sports Association and the Canadian National Firearms Association.  If YOUR state or local organization isn’t read each episode, then send us an email and we’ll add them!

 

(DO NOT READ)The Polite Society download app is out on Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.

Episode 402 – Interviews Galore!

Full Episode Download: http://traffic.libsyn.com/politicsandguns/402.mp3

Charles Heller Part 1

Charles Heller Part 2

Shayne Lopez-Rivas

Jeff Street Part 1

Jeff Street Part 2

Texas GOLD 

Episode 401 – David Yamane

Full Episode Download: http://traffic.libsyn.com/politicsandguns/401.mp3

1- Open and Personal News Segment 

2- News Segment 

3- Interview Segment 1: Guest David Yamane: 

4- Interview Segment 2: Guest David Yamane Part 2

5- DGU Segment:

6- Email and Show Close:

1- Introduction

 

Paul: Welcome to the polite society podcast sponsored by the Firearms Policy Coalition recorded on Wednesday, February 15th, 2017. I’m Paul Lathrop

John : I’m John Richardson and on tonight’s show we will talk with David Yamane about guns and religion.

Rachel: I’m Rachel Malone, and we’ll talk about constitutional carry coming to New Hampshire.

Gary: I’m Gary Daugherty and in one of our DGU’s we talk about a CCW holder that brought a gun to a knife fight .. so climb aboard

Rachel: strap in

John : and hang on!

Paul:  episode 401 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.

Show intro music.

 

Personal news from each participant (when you are done with your segment please ask the next person what has been up with them)

 

Rob

John – I hope to get out this week and shoot the Ruger Redhawk along with a few other guns. The ammo has arrived for it – I got Fiocchi 200 grain .44 Special and .44 Magnum. It’s not cheap! As to what else I did this week in guns, let’s just say I kicked over a hornet’s nest. More on that in the blog segment.

 

Rachel – MAG-20 last weekend, Texas G.O.L.D. coming up March 2…..EVERYBODY BE THERE!!!!  We’re collaborating with the Republican Party of Texas on the lobby day they have chosen to promote the RPT priorities. We’re focusing on constitutional carry – we’ll split into teams and visit every legislator’s office. SIGN UP RIGHT NOW!!!! (and you’ll get a free t-shirt) – seriously don’t wait because I have to order them.

 

Texas GOLD info: http://www.texasfirearmsfreedom.com/txgold/

Sign up: https://goo.gl/forms/vSkSh1WrSdKK0hoz2

 

And also shoutout to our listener Jared who was doing 4-H stuff at the bay next to me last weekend and recognized my voice from the podcast and came over to say hi!

 

Gary

Paul/Susan

 

Promo about upcoming training classes here.

(June 24, 25th 2017.  Beyond Concealed Carry Enhanced.  9am -5pm both days. Richmond, IL)

(August 10-13, 2017. MAG-40. Sioux Falls, SD)

(August 26 & 27, 2017. Beyond Concealed Carry Enhanced. Sioux Falls, SD)

 

Break

2- News 1

The Constitutional Carry train is pulling into New Hampshire  

New Hampshire’s state legislature passed SB12 on February 9.  Governor Sununu has indicated that he will sign the measure.  Currently New Hampshire residents are allowed to open carry without a permit.  This law will provide the same status for concealed carry.  When passed, this will bring the total number of Constitutional Carry states to 13.  That is 26% of the country!

 

New Hampshire will then catch up with its New England neighbors:  Vermont and Maine.  Much harder battles lie ahead for the neighbors to the south.

 

Healey, again?

Just south of New Hampshire lies Massachusetts.  The Attorney General’s office of Massachusetts recently announced a new government program!  Yes, AG Maura Healey believes it is the role big government to snoop into the lives of private individuals.  This is the same Maura Healey who unilaterally reinterpreted the State’s assault weapons ban.

 

Ms. Healey worked with the Massachusetts Medical Society to, “develop informative brochures and a voluntary online training program…”  The stated goal is to make resources available for doctors, “in their efforts to prevent gun-related accidents, self-harm, and violence.”  This program will be offered to where health care providers can actually receive continuing education credit.  The program is supported by the State’s police chiefs, too.

 

This all sounds good, right?  Who could be against safety?  Ask yourself a few questions.  

 

  • If safety was the real concern, why not talk about traffic safety or storage of toxic chemicals?
  • Does a voluntary training program provide sufficient guidance?
  • Is a medical examination room really the place to talk about such things?
  • Is firearm safety really a subject you want your doctor to study with their continuing education credits?

 

Does it seem outside the realm of possibilities that this could lead to doctors reporting their findings to the government?

Paul –

Connecticut getting in on the action

Just south of Massachusetts lies Connecticut.  The State’s governor, Dannel Malloy – Democrat, has been busy working on fiscal budgets.  What better way to increase revenue than to raise the fees charged to pistol permit holders?  

 

Under his proposal, a five-year renewal will increase from $70 to $300!  First-time permits will increase from $140 to $370.  Do you really believe this is about raising revenue for the State?  The more likely scenario is that Mr. Malloy would like to price people out of their ability to legally keep and bear arms.  The governor claims the state is bringing fees in line with surrounding states.  Malloy said, “Given the amount of work that has to be done with respect to licensure we probably were not, in fact, we weren’t covering our costs.”  There is one easy way to solve the problem, Gov. Malloy:  follow the example set by Vermont, Maine and New Hampshire.  There is no cost when you do not issue permits in the first place!

 

Scott Wilson is the president of the Connecticut Citizens Defense League.  He stated,  “It’s no secret that Gov. Malloy really does not care about gun rights or Second Amendment rights or gun owners in the state of Connecticut.”  Members of the CCDL began pushing back on this increase by attending the budget hearing for the Public Safety division.  Many CCDL members are concerned that they are being priced out of their rights.

 

The ability to tax is the ability to destroy.  

Paul -The poorest will be those that suffer most.

John –

Gun Quotes– Rob- One of my readers left us this.  Frank in Florida said, “Evil people will do evil things; crazy people will do crazy things; stupid people will do stupid things. Any solution to this problem cannot involve making it impossible for good people to do good things.”

 

Hang on everybody, we’ll be back with our guest (Name).

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3- Interview 1

Professor David Yamane

 

Professor David Yamane is a sociologist at Wake Forest University, home of the Demon Deacons, and has conducted research on both organized religion and the gun culture. He blogs at the always informative Gun Culture 2.0. David has just published a paper that investigates the connections between organized religion, religiosity, and personal handgun ownership. David was previously on the Polite Society Podcast in Episode 322 where he talked about his class on the Sociology of Guns.

 

Before we get into the results of your research, what first influenced you to research the relationship between religion and gun ownership?

 

Could you tell us the results of this study? Why do you think church attendance or participation is so critical here?

 

You depend upon survey data for the measures of gun ownership. With regard to the General Social Survey, do you think respondents under-report aka lie about gun ownership?

 

Most of the sources you cite in your paper are 8-10 years old or older. In your opinion, has sociology kept up with the changes in the gun culture?

 

  1. D. Vance’s Hillbilly Elegy has brought some attention to what I call Appalachian-Americans. I wonder if there is any way to study them as a separate subset from that of the South as they seem to have an even stronger culture of violence?

 

Are there any policy implication from this research?

 

4- Interview 2

 

5- DGUs  (at beginning) These discussions are NOT legal advice. Some of us are trainers, but this is not formal training and YOU NEED formal training. The Defensive Gun Use segment is intended as information, NOT as training. As always the opinions of the hosts are only their own opinions and not those of any sponsors or other affiliations.

 

Take That From a Take Out

Once burned – twice prepared. After being robbed outside his Houston restaurant, the owner of Jeff’s Kitchen started carrying a gun. That decision served him well when he was jumped by two armed men late one Saturday night. When the men appeared from behind a garbage bin and moved to rob him, the owner drew his gun and shot.  

One man was hit in the throat and chest, the other fled the scene of the crime. The wounded man later died at a local hospital. The restaurateur was not injured. Police believe he will not be charged with any crime.

 

Paul –

CCW Carrier Brings a Gun to a Knife Fight

A CCW carrier intervened in a potentially deadly weekend fight, when two men decided that a Topeka, Kansas Wal-Mart was the place to settle their differences. Their fight was interrupted by a legally armed citizen. According to police, “He intervened, drew his firearm, and held the people to the ground basically at gun-point.”

One man was taken to the hospital for treatment of non-life threatening stab wounds. The other brawler and the armed citizen were taken to jail for questioning. The fighters have been charged with aggravated battery; the legally armed citizen was released without charges.  

While we applaud the public spirit of the citizen, we must question if he did the correct thing. Intervening in a situation where one is not directly involved is fraught with dangers, which our commentators know better than most.  Guys?   

 

Paul – we are not police however police do not carry knives for attack generally so I might have been tempted to intervene.

Rachel- when intervening in 3rd-party situation have to know the circumstances, and make the decision you know you can live with

 

Vet 2 – Thugs 0

A Vietnam vet was tested once again when two young thugs threatened him and a friend. His foes once again found that tempered steel cuts best.

 

A 70-year-old ‘Nam vet from Saint Louis was dropping off his lady-friend across the river in Venice, Illinois one fine morning (you dawg, you.) The two were saying their goodbyes when a couple of young men drove up to the car asking for directions. Predictably in that East St Louis area neighborhood, one of the men pulled a gun and demanded money. The vet pulled his own legally possessed concealed carry weapon and fired.

Police arrived to investigate the all too common call of gunshots and found Billy Dickerson, 19, dead from a head wound, and Perry Richardson, 23, suffering from bullets in his chest and arm. Richardson, no relation to our John Richardson (supposedly), was hospitalized and charged with first degree murder. Under Illinois law anyone perpetrating a felony is legally accountable for a death during the felony. Police sources disclosed Richardson and Dickerson are suspects in more than 20 armed robberies in Illinois and Missouri; one robbery occurred just an hour before the fatal encounter.

The vet and his friend were uninjured. Illinois State Attorney Tom Gibbons said that the veteran’s actions were justified based on the circumstance of the robbery and the history of the repeat offenders. “This is an example of a law-abiding citizen protecting himself, exercising his right to self-defense. This incident yesterday morning is the exact situation where the necessity for this right becomes crystal clear.”

Are you listening Chicagoland?  

 

Paul –

Drug Thief Foiled by Pharmacist With a Gun
  Finally, from John Richardson’s neck-of-the woods: An armed, masked suspect walked into the Carolina Mountain Pharmacy and demanded narcotics. “[The suspect] asked us to keep our hands where you can see them and to not handle our phones,” the pharmacist related. “And then he sort of went off on a list of what he wanted me to give him.”

 

Instead of the drugs, the suspect got a gun — pointed at him. Jared Mattson, the pharmacist/ owner, grabbed his own .40 S&W pistol, and when he racked his gun (!), the would-be thief ran off.  Mattson said he was mad at the robber, but glad the suspect chose to run. “It certainly could’ve turned out worse. You could be interviewing my wife about her dead husband just as easy.”  As of now, the suspect has not been identified.

We can hear the commentators chomping at the bit — anything you want to discuss here?  

 

Paul – NO Israeli carry!

John – It also shows the difference between a chain pharmacy and a independent pharmacy.

 

We post each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com  Please take a minute and share them with a friend.

 

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6- E-mail, blog notes, and show close

1 Voice mail

 

1 text from Clayton

 

I carry a primary, two spare mags, and a backup .380 in the pocket. Defensive knife is also mandatory to me. Pocket emergency med kit too!

-Clayton

Paul – About damn time you check back in with us! 😉

Feb 10, 3:19 PMvia Google Voice

Sorry! I’ve been busy with my new girlfriend who loves shooting. 😉

Check out our His & Her’s shooting target on FB. You’re allowed to mention that on air. Ha!

 

Listener e-mail discussion

 

Email #1 from Todd in San Diego

 

All,

 

I’ve heard several industry pundits talking about a resurgence in revolvers. I’ve always liked revolvers from an aesthetic standpoint, but I also find myself carrying and training with them more often due to a persistent wrist injury – the revolver grip simply works better for me.

 

My understanding of the bills currently being looked at for national reciprocity would require a concealed carrier to abide by all laws of that state – which might include magazine limitations, ammunition type restrictions, etc. Incidentally, it will be interesting to see if handguns not on CA’s safe gun roster would be allowed in state under a visiting permit. All that said, a revolver is probably going to be legal in nearly any jurisdiction, and the ability to shoot lead bullets like wadcutters may provide better options than FMJ in jurisdictions that restrict hollow-point bullets.

 

Manufacturers seem to be following this trend – like bullets that start with a 4? How about a five shot, 44 Special snubbie? Need more capacity? There are several eight shot 357’s on the market. Kimber and Colt are offering six shot snubbies.

 

I know there are limitations and trade-offs to any gun, but with national reciprocity looking good on the horizon, it might be of benefit to every concealed carrier to have at least one revolver in their stable.

 

Todd

 

San Diego

======================================

 

Email #2 Michael talks backups.

 

I always have two spare magazines on me… one in an IWB holder on my support side (17 rounds) and another in my front pocket on my strong side (15 rounds).

 

Also, about 40% of the time, I  carry a backup on my ankle (G43) with a two spares; one in my support-side front pocket (along with a Streamlight ProTac 2L and pepper spray) and the other in a cargo pocket (along with a spare flashlight).  The spares for the G43 have +2 extensions on them, so they each have eight rounds.

 

Oh, and I have a small IFAK (Student of the Gun Pocket Lifesaver) and a folding knife in the other cargo pocket.

 

Needless to say,  I just avoid getting close to water.   😉

 

Michael

=============================================================

 

David also writes in about backups

 

Dear PS,

You asked for ideas for back up guns and who carries one. A North American Arms Pug in a picket holster with an extra 5 rounds of 22 Mag fits just about anywhere. It gives an additional 10 rounds and while 22 Mag is not the best for stopping power, no one wants to be a test medium. Plus it provides a way to carry very discretely even in situations where caring is not encouraged. Say at a liberal relative’s house.🙂

Keep up the good work.

David
Central Ohio

==================================================

 

Chris talks carry and Trucking

 

Paul & the gang,

First off love the show, long time listener and it’s one of favorite shows I look forward to each week.  For privacy reasons, I request that you would only use my first name on air if you choose to air this email.

I drive truck for a living also, and my company has a strict no weapons policy. Because of this I can’t carry everyday. When I am home I carry a Glock 23 as a primary handgun with one spare magazine and I also carry a S&W j frame as a backup handgun. If it was possible for me legally, this would be my everyday carry as well.

I obtained my handgun carry permit at the earliest age available at 21, and have been carrying for 15+ years. I have attended some local training classes and I’m fortunate enough to be able to train on the local range at least 2-3 times each month where they allow drills drawing from holsters and from concealment cover. I budget and allot for 500 rounds each month for training. I am very excited about attending a MAG40 class, and would love to be able to attend the one in August in Sioux Falls but it being 17 hours away logistically I don’t know if that’s feasible.  I am however going to try my best to attend a MAG40 in 2017, that is my one main training goal for the year.

Thanks for the great show and for keeping my company out on the road, keep up the great work!

Thanks,
Chris

===========================

Gary ummm stepped in it with this emailer

 

Really Gary?  You’re calling me out on-air?  Well it’s too late to be the next week as it is already recorded, so we will have to make due.  The crew were talking on how much gun you folks carry so I will start there. I am currently carrying a full size P320 9mm with a reload (so 17*2+1).  I have tried carrying a B.U.G., but haven’t gotten it to work well yet.

  I have also considered not carrying a reload in lieu of a med kit with tourniquet but I still haven’t gotten to a trauma class. O.C. spray is also on my list of things that my EDC lacks.  With limited personal real estate, I am going to try a primary, bug, medical, and O.C. spray, then if possible add back a reload so as to cover the widest array.   So there is your email folks, I suppose you want one for next week too…..

See you at the townhall,

Not Clayton.

==========================================

 

Mark talks Back ups and church

 

Hi all,

I listened to episode 399 today and would agree with the guy who said your podcast is his number one.  I look forward to each episode, especially when the whole gang is there.  I like the fact that you have a reasonable discussion, regardless of the topic, even when there are differing views.  Keep up the good work!

Paul had asked for feedback regarding spare ammo and backup guns.  In NY state, we can have 10 in the magazine, plus one in the chamber. I carry a Ruger SR40 with two spare magazines.  I do POGO with the exception of work & restricted areas.  As for a backup gun,  I haven’t yet, but have been thinking about it.  The BUG will be my Ruger LCR with 38+P in an ankle holster or pocket holster in a motorcycle vest when I’m riding.

Also, you read an email about the guy leaving his church, P-USA due to their anti gun stance.  Baptist churches tend to be more pro gun.  I’m working with one of the elders at my church to develop a security team and want to look into getting team tactics training.  We already have a few that conceal carry, but I feel we should have some training and  plan for how to respond should the need arise.

Thanks again for all you do.

Mark

==========================================

 

And Matt Martin of Geeks, Gadgets and guns writes in to talk optics.

 

When it comes to red dot optics for a rifle there are many good options for under $250 as mentioned on the episode Burris and vortex make good optics in that price point. When it comes to slide mounted red dots expect to spend $400-600 while there are some good options around $250-300 they are designed for rifle use not handgun and while they work and hold zero they will be electronic optics with an automatic shut off after a few hours. At this time the main 3 I would suggest considering run in the $400-600 window and will remain always on precisely what is needed for defensive use. The main 3 that meet that requirement at this time is the luapold delta point, shield rms, or a variant of the trijicon RMR. The shield rms is quite new so reliability is still being proven but the signs are good.


Matthew

 

===========================================

A different Matt writes in…

 

So, what were the first episodes that Rachel appeared in?  I would like to hear what she was saying back then.

 

— Matt

 

EPISODE 207 as guest host!

 

===================================================================

 

Charles wants to talk training and competition

 

Polite Society Podcast,

 

Thank you for producing a high quality and enjoyable podcast.  Y’all provide a great service to the defense and firearms community, as well as the general public.  

I strongly encourage those that recommend competitions as a method of training/testing to participate in an organized force-on-force training utilizing marking rounds such as Simunitions/UTM/etc.  Every time the DGU segment comes on, think of how well a competition would have prepared the potential victim.  Then consider how much better prepared that person would be if they had gotten to work through a wide range of situations, with stress levels close to that of a critical encounter (not just a slight rise in heart rate because of a timer), and needing to work through the full process of recognizing the threat, responding to the threat, and practicing the follow through, such as simulating the call to police, providing trauma care, and maintaining situational awareness.  This type of training is second to none, and you don’t need to be military or law enforcement.  Lt. Col. Dave Grossman does a much better job at describing all of the benefits of this training than I ever could. Please find an opportunity to take a force-on-force class, and I promise the results will be exponentially more beneficial than training for shooting sports.

-Charles, East Texas

 

Rachel – the more you have trained in a specific scenario or set of skills, the more automatic that response becomes and the more your brain can focus on making decisions for this specific situation

===============================

 

And our own Craig wanted to chime in about red dots.

 

Hello Friends,

 

This is in response to JP’s inquiry regarding red dots on pistols in episode 400.  If the setup he or she is working on is for a defensive pistol, there is another important consideration.  

 

One of the reasons I decided on the Trijicon RMR was the profile of the sight.  I would have loved to run the Vortex Venom due to the lower cost and their good reputation.  However, the base of the unit is so tall that it prohibits co-witnessing even suppressor-height sights.  After trolling forums, YouTube and other internet fodder, it appeared that only the Trijicon and the Leupold were short enough to accommodate co-witnessing.

 

If the pistol is not to be used for defensive purposes, knock yourself out.  But, Murphy’s Law is clear that the moment your red dot decides to take a nap will be the time you need it the most.  Personally, if I could not co-witness I would leave the red dot off of the pistol.

 

One other thing to consider is the size of the dot.  There is no way I could shoot 1 MOA (a one inch group at 100 yards) with a pistol.  It is also more difficult to acquire a small dot depending on the ambient lighting.  See if the gun shop has different models that you can view.

 

Stay dangerous!

Craig

Houston

=============================================

 

John, tell us what’s new at your blog no lawyers only guns and money.

 

John – As I alluded to in the introduction, I kicked over a hornet’s nest and you know what, I’d do it all over again. Microtech Knives is a well-known knife maker of high end and high priced knives. They have a location near where I live. On Sunday I drove over to where it is located and noticed a sign at the front door posting against concealed carry on their premises. It both galls and saddens me that a knife company would do that given they should be on the same side. I put up a post with a picture of their front door and the sign asking is“ it too much to expect a knife company to recognize gun rights in the same manner we in the gun culture recognize knife rights?” That got picked up by many on Facebook including photographer Oleg Volk and it was off to the races. Let’s just say I got a quick response from the company which included the sign coming down. With over 10,000 pageviews, you could say it went viral.

 

That and more is at only guns and money dot blogspot dot com.

 

We would like to thank Charlie Foxtrot for writing up show notes for us. Even though you don’t hear him on the air he is certainly part of what you do hear. Look at his blog at not one more gun law dot blogspot dot com

 

Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast.  I’d like to thank Dave Yamane for joining us today.  So for Charlie Foxtrot, Gary, John, Rachel, Susan, and Rob,

 

Paul: Until the next time…

Gary: stay safe,

Rachel: be aware,

Gary: and we’ll see you down the road.

 

(after show close) How could we have made this episode better?

 

(DO NOT READ)Look at the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.  Subscribing from the link in our show notes helps Bob and Ben as well as helps us here at the Polite Society Podcast.

 

(DO NOT READ)Join your local civil rights group like the New Jersey Second Amendment Society, Arizona Citizens Defense League, Gun Owners of California, Commonwealth Second Amendment,  Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Florida Carry, Georgia Carry, Georgia Gun Owners, Grass Roots North Carolina, Illinois Carry, Maryland Shall Issue,  Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry, and  Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.

 

There are Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance,  Nebraska Firearms Owners Association,   Citizens for a Safer New Jersey, New York State Rifle & Pistol Association,  Palmetto Concealed Carry, Open Carry Texas, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Virginia Open Carry,  West Virginia Citizens Defense League, wisconsingunowners.org, and Wyoming Gun Owners.

 

For our Canadian listeners, and their supporters, join the Canadian Shooting Sports Association and the Canadian National Firearms Association.  If YOUR state or local organization isn’t read each episode, then send us an email and we’ll add them!

 

(DO NOT READ)The Polite Society download app is out on Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.

 

Episode 400 – 5 Years and Counting!

Full Episode Download: http://traffic.libsyn.com/politicsandguns/400.mp3

1- Open and Personal News Segment

2- News Segment 

3- Interview Segment 1: Guest Massad Ayoob (several segments, if you would like to follow in order click from top to bottom)

5- DGU Segment:

6- Email and Show Close:

1- Introduction

Paul: Welcome to episode 400 of the polite society podcast sponsored by the Firearms Policy Coalition recorded on Wednesday, February 1st, 2017 I’m Paul Lathrop.

Rob: I’m Rob Morse and on tonight’s show we will talk with Massad Ayoob and Gail Pepin about self-defense in the age of travel.

John: I’m John Richardson, and we’ll talk about another failed attempt by Bloomberg to impose background checks.

Rachel: I’m Rachel Malone, and we’re doing our 400th episode live on the Lock and Load Radio Show with Bill Frady.

Back Gary: I’m Gary Daugherty and in one of our DGU’s, a concealed carrier had to act when a robber put a gun in his girlfriend’s face… so climb aboard

Rachel: strap in

John : and hang on!

Paul:  episode 400 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.

Show intro music.

 

Personal news from each participant (when you are done with your segment please ask the next person what has been up with them)

 

Rob-  Rain, heat, cold.. Carried every day, in the office and in the field.  I really like my Alien Gear OWB holster.  That might change.  I bought larger pants so I can carry IWB comfortably.

 

John – I didn’t think I’ve have much gun news this week especially since most of it was spent with work and a dental appointment to get a crown for one of my teeth. Was I ever wrong. My dentist and I always chat about guns now that I know he is a gunny. We share a love for revolvers. Out of the blue he says, “I have a Ruger Redhawk in .44 Magnum. Would you like to try it out?” I’m thinking he means to meet him at the range sometime. He leaves the room and then comes back with the revolver. He set it on the counter and it was then understood it was going home with me for a try-out until my permanent crown arrives in a month.  I always thought I had a good dentist. Now I think I have the world’s best dentist!

 

Rob- That is precisely the legal activity that mandatory background checks make illegal.

 

Rachel – run n gun in Pawnee, OK, i can’t remember what else i did, look at my facebook page because it knows.  Videos here- https://www.facebook.com/rachel.malone.TX

Gary

Paul/Susan-

Rob- Flat on your back.

 

Promo about upcoming training classes here.

Rachel- MAG20 Range in Austin Feb 11 and 12!

(June 24, 25th 2017.  Beyond Concealed Carry Enhanced.  9am -5pm both days. Richmond, IL)

(August 10-13, 2017. MAG-40. Sioux Falls, SD)

(August 26 & 27, 2017. Beyond Concealed Carry Enhanced. Sioux Falls, SD)

 

Break

 

7.2000 to 7.2830

 

Neil Gorsuch-

HR38- This reciprocity bill would be a huge step forward for American gun owners, particularly those who travel.  We recognize marriage licenses, so it would be step forward to recognize firearms licenses as well.

 

2- News 1- Another Failed Attempt to Impose Universal Background Checks

Rob- In November, the voters in Nevada drank the Bloomberg Kool-Aid by passing a Universal Background check scheme.  The problem is that the ballot measure contained language making it unenforceable under existing state law.

 

The Demanding Mommies also set their sights on Missoula, Montana to carry out their nefarious plans.  Councilman Bryan von Lossberg filed a universal background check ordinance in 2015 at the behest of the anti-rights group.  He said, “The point was to save lives.”  The ordinance was passed in 2016 despite thousands of emails sent to the Mayor and City Council from pro-rights individuals.

 

Fortunately, Austin Knudsen, the Speaker of the Montana House, stepped in.  He sought an opinion from the state’s Attorney General, Tim Fox, regarding this ordinance.  It was basically a legal slam dunk since Montana’s preemption statute prohibits such regulation at the local level.  Perhaps Mr. von Lossberg should have listened a year ago when attorney general Fox warned that the ordinance, “likely violates our constitutional right to keep and bear arms.”

 

Another twist to this story centers around alleged legal advice provided to the City Council.  The Montana Shooting Sports Association filed a complaint with the Montana Office of Disciplinary Counsel.  They claim that an attorney in New York City provided legal advice on this matter without being licensed to practice in the state.  Perhaps this attorney will now seek national reciprocity of law licenses!

 

Gary-

Rob- So far the Bloomberg’s been able to buy legislation half the time.  To him it is only money.

Paul – We talked with Sean Maloney last episode and he said that New Mexico was going through this as well

John – Missoula is considered a blue island in a generally red state. Hillary carried it. In the blog segment I have more on fighting back.

 

The 4th Amendment in the 4th Circuit

John – A recent en banc ruling by the Fourth Circuit Court of Appeals appears to have implications applicable to both the Fourth and Second Amendments.  The facts of the case surround a traffic stop that took place in West Virginia.  The defendant in the case, Shaquille Robinson, was seen loading a pistol in the parking lot of a convenience store and putting the firearm in his pocket.  This parking lot is a well known hotbed of drug trafficking.  He then entered a car as a passenger.  An anonymous citizen tipped the police about this suspicious activity.  Mr. Robinson has a felony record.

 

The police stopped the car because of a seatbelt violation.  With knowledge that the passenger may be armed, the officer frisked him.  Mr. Robinson argued in the appeal that the officer violated his Fourth Amendment rights by searching him because it was possible that he may have been legally armed.  The ruling concluded by stating that Mr. Robinson’s Fourth Amendment right to be free from unreasonable searches and seizures did not apply.  The police stated that they recognized Mr. Robinson as being a convicted felon and that his responses to their inquiries regarding his identity were vague.  Also, when asked, he did not clearly answer as to whether he was armed.

 

Attorney Andrew Branca penned a Legal Insurrection article regarding this decision.  He believes we should not be too worried about its ramifications.  It is of little doubt that the set of facts in this case are not representative of the vast majority of responsible gun owners.  As Mr. Branca states, “bad cases make bad law.”  Although he does not like the finding in this case, Branca does provide some assurances that this is not the end of the Fourth Amendment for concealed carriers.    

 

The Constitution protects citizens from unreasonable searches and seizures.  Most people would be suspicious of an individual handling a firearm in a convenience store parking lot known for drug activity.  A reasonable person being asked whether they were armed would provide the police with a definitive answer.  Anyone with a felony record would know that they were a prohibited person.  

 

It is of little doubt that an individual possessing a firearm is a “substantially greater prospective threat to the officer.”  Therefore, Branca’s view is that an officer securing your firearm during a stop and returning it to you after the transaction is completed is not an outrageous burden to bear.  In other words, this is not ideal, but it could be much worse.  It is not an overt assault on the Second Amendment.

 

Chris Eger’s article on guns.com points out that this decision creates a split with a Sixth Circuit decision.  In that case police went too far while searching an individual who was legally open carrying.  This disparity makes Supreme Court review a possibility.  Given the likely makeup of the Court in the near future, this may be just one on the list of cases whereby rights are reclaimed from an overbearing government.

 

Paul- this isn’t as big of a deal as it may seem.

Gary-

John –

Gun Quotes-Rachel ? i want it

An ignorant mind is precisely not a spotless, empty vessel, but one that’s filled with the clutter of irrelevant or misleading life experiences, theories, facts, intuitions, strategies, algorithms, heuristics, metaphors, and hunches that regrettably have the look and feel of useful and accurate knowledge. Professor David Dunning

 

Hang on everybody, we’ll be back with our guest Massad Ayoob and Gail Pepin.

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3- Interview 1- 7:07  Massad Ayoob

6.0600 to 6.1530

Two minutes–  We’ve been involved in instruction, training, practice, and competition.  Gail and Massad, given the students you’ve seen, which would be the best place to spend our next hour?

 

6.2000 to 6.2830

Rachel- What advice do you have for someone teaching their first MAG 20.

RSO’s

Not just what we teach, but why we teach it. Adult education – not military or police (not “because it’s a doctrine”. Tell them why we teach it this way. We’re aware of other techniques – here are their strengths and weaknesses. Our techniques: here are their strengths and weaknesses. Students’ job to adapt techniques to work with their body, hand shape, firearm, and needs. Given their physical skill set and everything they bring, we might need to suggest a different gun, but never become dogmatic about our way. Goal: adapt their needs and tools to their particular body shape and size, habituation (?) physical abilities. Keep mind open and remember as an instructor, you’re not an oracle. You’re a guide. Give them directions to get to the goal the best way for them and their equipment.

 

Competition helps us know, “Can I run this gun under pressure?”

Shooting a match is not a gunfight. Reverse corollary: a gunfight absolutely is a shooting match. The person with the most time and experience running a gun under pressure will most likely win.

 

Gary- Is there a benefit to competition above just firearms handling and familiarization?

Competition is not training.. But you ARE testing your skills, both against expert and the person next door.  You get to experience some pressure.  That helps your encounters on the street, because a gunfight is a shooting match.

 

6.3300 to 6.4230

John – to continue on about the pressure of competition and gunfights, we hope never to be in a gun fight. That said, should we seek out instructors who actually have been in a gun fight? Is there a benefit to that?

 

Useful but not the core thing. Mas has never been in a gun fight. Jim Cirillo and Charles Askins. Here’s what I learned in my gun fights but here is what others have learned in their’s. They say, “My experience has validated that.” Instructors who have been in gun fights do bring something to the table.

 

Professionals learned from every experience they could find.  We stand to benefit from hundreds of years and thousand and thousands of encounters.  No one person we ever gain enough experience compared to all of our experience.  Good instructors often describe what they learned from others, and say that their personal experience verified what they learned on their own.

 

Question for Gail, In competition in general when men compete there is a lot of chest thumping and  “I am God’s gift to XYZ” have you seen something different in women’s competition?

 

Gail Pepin- Women against other women are supportive.  Women against men, men don’t like to lose.  Gail came in high-female in both IDPA matches in Nevada and Florida.

 

6.4700 to 6.5720 You can find where Massad Ayoob and Gail Pepin will be at the Massad Ayoob Group website, http://massadayoobgroup.com/.

http://massadayoobgroup.com/schedule/

Mass and Gail will compete at The Pin Match in Michigan, June 9 through 16.  Come see them.

7.0600 to 7.1530

Question for either, having been around competition for a while are there trends in competition that you have seen develop over time?

 

Is there anything from competition that can be brought into our practice sessions that would be beneficial?

 

Paul-  I have done a LOT of dry fire practice, a good amount of live fire practice and a good amount of training, what should I look for when I go to my first competitive match?

 

USPSA – Run and gun.  You have to solve the problems on their own.

IDPA – concealed carry, draw from concealment, use cover

Glock shooting sports- You shoot the same match each time.  You are told how many cartridges you may load at each stage. Shoot from low ready.

 

Advice: Know the rules of the match before you go in. Go with the mindset of task instead of goal (not just “how will I finish”).  Focus on basics. Front sight, smooth roll on the trigger. Firm grip and strong stance are things you will have built prior to this skill test element. Above all, safety.

 

Each is a piece of the puzzle and gets you used to running your equipment effectively

Competitors, when in a gunfight, tend to do very well since they can reflexively, without thought, get the gun out and on target. That frees them to do the thinking required to decide if/how/when to shoot in that specific situation.

Focus on the task.  Ignore the goal (how will I place).  Focus on the basics as you test your skills.  Don’t compromise safety.  You are responsible for every shot.  No lapses allowed.

 

I’ve seen people make mistakes and will be penalized during competition.  We seldom see safety violations.  They happen, like dropping a firearm, but safety is respected.

 

Responsibility and power need to always be at an exact equal balance.

Responsibility without power is futile.

Power without responsibility becomes tyranny.

 

7.3300 to 7.4230

7.4700 to 7.5720

5- DGUs  (at beginning) These discussions are NOT legal advice. Some of us are trainers, but this is not formal training and YOU NEED formal training. The Defensive Gun Use segment is intended as information, NOT as training. As always the opinions of the hosts are only their own opinions and not those of any sponsors or other affiliations.

 

Rachel- Trespasser Shot Outside Detroit Home

A Detroit area homeowner investigated noises from his detached garage. Once outside his home, he was confronted by a man claiming to have a weapon. Faced with that credible threat to his life, he pulled his own pistol and shot the intruder. The intruder died from the single gunshot wound to the back.

Police arrested the man pending completion of the investigation. The homeowner’s wife’s statements were the basis for the above description. The homeowner himself declined to talk to police on the advice of his attorney. Late today, the police announced they will not be charging the man.    

 

There’s a lot to be said about this DGU.

Guys?

 

Thoughts: 1) Wise to go outside the home to investigate?  2) Better to call the cops?  3) It is Detroit – and help is only hours – or days – away.  4) Is anything in the garage worth the homeowner’s life?  5) Better to bunker-down and wait the hours for the cops?  6) Does it matter if the sumdood was inside the fence – or outside it?  7) Seems he let his attorney do the talking for him. 8) Likely to be a civil case even though there was no criminal case.

 

John – It’s outside – leave it to the cops!

Paul – It’s RARELY a good idea to shoot

Rob- Things happen fast.  Things, and people, can turn sideways very quickly.  Plan for it.

Gary-

 

Detroit Restaurant Patron Serves Up Hot, Steaming Lead

Paul- It seems things are getting dangerous for Detroit’s thugs. An armed robber was shot by his intended victim early one night in Detroit’s mean west side. Dennis and his girlfriend, Latanya, were at E&S Carry Out Shrimp Shack when the robber walked up and demanded money. The couple and another customer immediately complied with the demands. However, when the thug threatened Latanya, Dennis acted. “It wasn’t a plan. It was just instinct. He had the gun in my girl’s face.”

 

Dennis continued, “When I saw he had the gun in her face, and I threw my wallet down and keys, he turned to look and get the money, that’s when I lit him up.” His shot hit the robber in the stomach. He then kicked the wounded thug’s gun away.  “I feel for him. I’m hurting that I had to do that, but he left me no choice.” Dennis , perhaps unwisely, further showed his compassion by giving aid to the crumpled robber.  

 

Dennis is a licensed CCW carrier. Police say that this incident is likely to be lawful self defense.   

 

Rob- The victim spoke to the media and police. Detroit prosecutors prosecuted people just like Denis. Have a plan of what to do and what to say.

Paul-

Gary-

John- http://www.activeresponsetraining.net/should-i-provide-first-aid-to-the-attacker-i-just-shot

Rachel-

Rob-

Bill-

 

7:57:20

Gary – Delivering a Lead Pizza

A southwest Philly pizza delivery man is alive today, largely because he carried a gun. Keyveat Fredericks, 36, was delivering for Chester Pizza. He got out of his car with an armload of pizzas at what turned out to be an abandoned house. The driver was immediately ambushed by a group of males. “When I turned, the gun was in my face. He came out of nowhere,” Fredericks said. The thug demanded money and pizzas.  

 

In Fredericks’ own words; “My kids. I have eight children. When I saw that gun, I said, ‘This can’t be it.’ I smacked his gun. Ran around my vehicle. I had dropped the pizzas. I heard one shot. I felt it hit me. I can tell you I felt it go through my arm. I heard it literally hit my gun that was on my side on my holster and I felt it go inside of me.”

 

The injured delivery man crouched behind his car and drew his concealed firearm.  His target was the thug who tried to kill him for just a few dollars and some food. The thug likely to try to complete what he started. “I fired once at him and he took off down the block. If it wasn’t for the gun on my hip, it would have been a lot more damage,” stated Fredericks. The rest of the robbery crew likewise made themselves scarce. Fredericks drove himself to the hospital, thinking of his family the entire time.

 

Police said Fredericks is a legal concealed carrier. They have made no arrests in the assault.  “All I was trying to do was provide for my children. It’s a job, but I don’t think I can ever do it again.” However, Fredericks is alive, possibly – probably – because he had the foresight to get trained, licensed, equipped, and finally, actually carry his weapon. He armed himself in order to protect himself and his family.

 

Paul – just because you have been hit doesn’t mean that you are out of the fight.

Rob- Being a delivery driver is one of the most dangerous occupations.  Please take care out there.

Gary –

 

Rob- Good Samaritan Tries To Stop Robbery Without a Gun

“What we have here is a robbery gone really, really bad,” according to the San Antonio, Texas police. A good Samaritan who tried to intervene is dead, another man is alive. That man was a licensed concealed carrier.

 

It started with a daylight robbery of the Kay Jewelers in the Rolling Oaks mall. In a mad-minute, a civilian attempted to stop the robbers, but was fatally gunned downed by an armed thief. Another patron, a legal concealed carrier, engaged the shooter, hitting him multiple times. The other thief fled the gunfire, thankfully removing him from the confines of the store, its customers and employees. The criminal ran from the mall, spraying bullets at shoppers as he went, hitting two.

 

Two additional mall patrons were hospitalized after complaining of chest pains or premature labor. The unidentified wounded thief was hospitalized in critical condition.

 

The running thug escaped the mall, possibly in a car driven by another accomplice. The stolen car later wrecked in downtown San Antonio, leading to the arrest of Jason Matthew Prieto, 34. Two firearms were recovered from the wreckage. Police are still searching for the third suspect. The heavily tattooed Prieto owns an extensive criminal record starting in 2001 as a 19-year-old. He’s been arrested for aggravated assault, assault, eight charges of drug possession, two charges for burglary of a vehicle, two theft charges and two charges of evading detention. Add to that impressive resume the capital murder and two counts of aggravated assault with a deadly weapon. He might finally get the jail time a violent career criminal deserves. Police believe Prieto and his partner may also  be responsible for another recent jewelry store robbery in San Antonio.

Information is very sketchy at this time, but it seems very likely that the armed citizen may have saved lives through the use of his weapon in the midst of a chaotic robbery gone really, really bad.

 

Observation: Once a trigger is pulled, criminals tend to keep shooting.  

 

John- Intervene if lives are at stake.  Don’t risk your life for property.

 

Paul- We post each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com  Please take a minute and share them with a friend.

 

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6- E-mail, blog notes, and show close

 

Listener e-mail discussion

John-

Text message from JP

 

Please God NO RECIPES!!!! I have to deal with it darn near every day since my wife watches the chew and food network every freaking day. I’ll send in a question or two every week if I have to. Lol

Since I’m almost 50 I’ve been seeing more and more older people with red dots on their pistols and rifles. What budget friendly red dots would you recommend for under 200 bucks? I have no plans to try long range shooting at this time. Thanks.

 

Rob- I have a reflex sight on one of my rifles.  Vortex and Burris are right at the 200 price point.

I don’t have any experience with them.

John – I have the Vortex Sparc and Surefire and a Bushnell TRS-25

Gary – http://www.dvor.com/s/73blon

===============

 

Paul- Our next email from Jerry

Dear People,

I enjoy your podcast immensely.  Thank you.  One constructive criticism I would offer is to remember that some of us are so new to the concealed carry gun world that some of your terms may be over our heads.  One I recall I believe is a five sixths twist which I assume has something to do with the markings (rifling) inside of the barrel.  I could be wrong.

But my question is regarding Russian manufactured ammo.  I have been told to stay away from it because it’s inferior.  Gun barrels blow up, etc.  Is there any truth to this?  Brands like TulAmmo and Silver Bear are mentioned.

Thank you!  And again I appreciate increasing my knowledge through listening to your podcast.

Blessings!

Jerry

 

Rob- I’ve used imported ammo, Some Russian.  Some is corrosive.  Watch that.  Don’t expect great accuracy, but most of us are making bigger mistakes than the small error introduced by our ammunition.  If you’re more accurate than imported ammo, I salute you.

Gary-

John –

 

Paul: Rob, do you have any new posts from your SlowFacts blog you want to mention?

 

Rob- I’m been doing a lot of politics lately.  Chicago politicians blame guns for the nightly gang-murders.  I blame the Chicago politicians.  That article is call “Why Chicago is Dying, and Other Cities Aren’t”.  Earlier I wrote that “Guns Belong on Campus, and Everywhere Else”.  Those articles are up at Clash Daily, at Ammoland and at my blog, slow facts dot wordpress dot com.

 

John, tell us what’s new at your blog no lawyers only guns and money?

 

John- Among the blog posts I put up since we last recorded is one that relates to our first story. Our opponents in the war for gun rights are generally the same people who push for open government when they aren’t in power. Alinsky’s 4th Rule says to make your opponent live up to their rules. Thus, whenever Mayor Bloomberg parachutes one of his minions into a city or state, we should file a freedom of information act request. They will have left a paper trail and it can be used against them just like the Montana Shooting Sports Association is doing in Missoula. It may lead to a complaint to the state bar association or it might just be bad publicity but we should always punch back twice as hard.

 

That and more is at only guns and money dot blogspot dot com.

 

We would like to thank Charlie Foxtrot for writing up show notes for us. Even though you don’t hear him on the air he is certainly part of what you do hear. Look at his blog at not one more gun law dot blogspot dot com

 

Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast.  I’d like to thank Massad Ayoob, Gail Pepin and Bill Frady for joining us today.  So for Charlie Foxtrot, Gary, John, Rachel, Susan, and Rob.

(Paul, stop talking now)

 

Rob: Until the next time…

Gary: stay safe,

Paul: be aware,

John: and we’ll see you down the road.

 

(after show close) How could we have made this episode better?

 

(DO NOT READ)Look at the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $77.00 a year, $7.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.  Subscribing from the link in our show notes helps Bob and Ben as well as helps us here at the Polite Society Podcast.

 

(DO NOT READ)Join your local civil rights group like the New Jersey Second Amendment Society, Arizona Citizens Defense League, Gun Owners of California, Commonwealth Second Amendment,  Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Florida Carry, Georgia Carry, Georgia Gun Owners, Grass Roots North Carolina, Illinois Carry, Maryland Shall Issue,  Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry, and  Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.

 

There are Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance,  Nebraska Firearms Owners Association,   Citizens for a Safer New Jersey, New York State Rifle & Pistol Association,  Palmetto Concealed Carry, Open Carry Texas, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Virginia Open Carry,  West Virginia Citizens Defense League, wisconsingunowners.org, and Wyoming Gun Owners.

 

For our Canadian listeners, and their supporters, join the Canadian Shooting Sports Association and the Canadian National Firearms Association.  If YOUR state or local organization isn’t read each episode, then send us an email and we’ll add them!

 

(DO NOT READ)The Polite Society download app is out on Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.

 

Episode 399 – Sean Maloney and Laura Carno

Full Episode Download: http://traffic.libsyn.com/politicsandguns/399.mp3

1- Open and Personal News Segment

2- News Segment 

3- Interview Segment 1: Sean Maloney

4- Interview Segment 2: Laura Carno

5- DGU Segment:

6- Email and Show Close:

 

1- Introduction

Paul: Welcome to the polite society podcast sponsored by the Firearms Policy Coalition recorded on Sunday January 22nd 2016, I’m Paul Lathrop.

Rob: I’m Rob Morse and on tonight’s show we will talk with Sean Maloney.  Sean started Second Call Defense, and now he is running for re-election to the NRA board of directors.

John: I’m John Richardson, and we’ll talk with Laura Carno about training first responders for Colorado Schools.

Rachel: I’m Rachel Malone, and we will talk about some of the legislation that is up before congress in the new Trump administration

Gary: I’m Gary Daugherty and yes Virginia, there is a Second Amendment even in Chicago

…so climb aboard

Rachel: strap in

John : and hang on!

Paul:  episode 399 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.

Show intro music.

 

Personal news from each participant (when you are done with your segment please ask the next person what has been up with them)

 

Rob- You know the most important thing I did in my gun-world?  I wrote down the name and contact information of my state and federal representatives.  I also started a list of the pro-gun bills we should support and I called their local office so I’m heard.

 

I bought a new Alien Gear holster.  Reducing my firearms inventory, but shopping for more classes.  David Cole and Jenna Meek joined me for Self-Defense Gun Stories.  Tony Simon is up next.  I was on Big Gunner 81’s you-tube show.  Greg Hopkins and I were together on Dan and Cheryl Todd’s Gun Freedom Radio.  I’m still looking for help with some videos.

 

John – I have not been on the last two shows and I should explain why. My mother-in-law’s health suddenly declined a little over two weeks ago and Grace passed away on Jan. 7th. It was a quiet, peaceful, and dignified passing surrounded by her two daughters and many of her grandchildren. We buried her a week ago Thursday. Barb and I had planned to be at the SHOT Show this past week but as I wrote in a blog post life caused a change in plans. The SHOT Show will be there next year.

 

I have started a new project which I hope our listeners will help go viral. I call it 2A Selfies. It is a selfie of you holding up a list of what you want in the way of pro-gun measures from Congress and the Trump Administration. All you need is a smart phone, a Twitter account, and an Instagram account. See my post on my blog for more how-to details. President Trump likes social media so we need to play to that.

 

Rachel

Taught a few classes, gave a bunch of speeches, and read a million words (98% of the Texas gun bills filed so far).  Rally at the Capitol – speech with hecklers (see video). Next time we need LOTS more of us. I co-hosted an Open Range Day today. Lots of fun – pistol and rifles, steels, and a .50 cal for everyone to try out. I also wrote a list of a bunch of things I’m not going to do.

 

Coming up:

  • Speaking at the Wichita Falls Tea Party meeting, Feb. 2, Harley Davidson, 7pm
  • Teaching MAG-20 live fire, Feb. 11-12
  • A bunch of other stuff
  • MAG-30 in the Austin area with David Maglio, June 16-18. It’s gonna be great SO SIGN UP NOW!

 

If you’re in Texas and you don’t get my emails, sign up right now ….. www.texasfirearmsfreedom.com

 

Gary

 

Paul/Susan – Went to New Jersey again. After I got home dental surgery, that is why I sound a bit funny.

 

Promo about upcoming training classes here.

(February 11 & 12, 2017 MAG20 in Austin, TX)

(June 24 & 25, 2017 Beyond Concealed Carry Enhanced. 9am-5pm both days. Richmond, IL)

(August 10-13, 2017 MAG40 in Sioux Falls, SD)

(August 26 & 27, 2017 Beyond Concealed Carry Enhanced. Sioux Falls, SD)

 

Break

2- News 1

 

There is new legislation in Congress and the Senate.

  • House Resolution 34 would allow honest gun owners to legally carry firearms within 1000 feet of a school zone.
  • HR 38 would require national reciprocity.  That means a state would be required to recognize your out-of-state carry license including recognizing people from Constitutional Carry states.
  • Senate bill 59 and  house resolution 367 would remove suppressors from the list of prohibited items in the National Firearms Act.
  • House resolution 509 would eliminate the BATFE.

Paul – We NEED to be very active right now to push on these

John – I wish we had a companion bill in the Senate on reciprocity. I have a different attitude about BATFE.

Rob- Republicans are in control.  They are out of excuses.  They have to walk the walk, or walk the plank.

 

There is a Second Ammendment.. Even in Chicago

Writing for the 7th circuit court, Judge Diane Sykes struck down Chicago’s zoning requirements for shooting ranges and struck down Chicago’s prohibition on minors entering shooting ranges.  The Second Amendment Foundation brought the lawsuit.  You might remember that SAF sued so there was a right to carry in Illinois, then Chicago said you need training, but outlawed gun ranges in the city.

 

John- That failed, and Chicago owes SAF for their court costs.

 

Paul – The great news is that Judge Sykes is also on President Trump’s short list to fill the vacancy on the US Supreme Court.  This is really good news.  We should get a great judge on the Supreme court, and then President Trump would also nominate a young conservative to the lower court to replace Judge Sykes.

 

Rob- Here is what I’m worried about.  The court said that Chicago limited gun ranges to such an extreme degree that only 2 percent of Cook County was an eligible location for a business like a gun range.  I hope the court will decide that the proof is in the result.  I’m sure that Socialists politicians can find a way to make gun ranges unprofitable.. even if they are allowed on every street corner.  Whatever the means, I want to see the result, rather than the possibility.  There should be as many gun ranges in Chicago as there are in a comparably sized city like Houston.  If there are not, then we’re seeing the results of discrimination against gun owners.

 

John – Possibility of en banc. I heard from a person in Illinois re the suit and Judge Sykes. I can’t name him but he had an issue that might come up with Sykes.

 

State Sponsored Identity Theft

Freedom of Information Act requests are generally a good thing.  However, care should be taken when the government entity responds to them.  In October of last year, the state of California responded to such a request from a reporter with Southern California Public Radio.  The subject was Firearms Safety Certifications.  

 

California “accidentally” provided sensitive information in their response.  The “dates of birth, driver’s license numbers and California identification numbers” for 3,424 firearms instructors are no longer confidential.  

 

At least the State was kind enough to inform these instructors that their personal information had been compromised.  Does it matter that it took over two months for the notifications to be made?  The Attorney General, Kamala Harris, recommended that these people place fraud alerts on their accounts, “since driver’s license numbers are appealing to identity thieves.”  

 

Jennifer Baker of the NRA-ILA said this, “is just another example of The California Department of Justice’s disregard for the rights of gun owners.”  Do you believe the personal information of Hollywood elites would be treated with such carelessness?

 

John – Kamala Harris is now Senator Harris. Her successor is just as anti-gun.

 

Another conservative state is looking at Constitutional carry.  Alabama State Senator Gerald Allen filed a bill so Alabamians could lawfully carry guns without a permit.   Constitutional carry is slowly arriving at more and more states.  We have not seen the companion bill in the Alabama House.

 

Gary- Rachel, you better hurry, or Alabama will get there first.

 

Gun Quotes– When only cops have guns, it’s called a “police state”.

— Claire Wolfe, “101 Things To Do Until The Revolution”

 

Hang on everybody, we’ll be back with our guests Sean Maloney and Laura Carno

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4- Interview 2

?Some talking points for Sean Maloney-

http://www.maloneyfornra.com/

  • Second Call Defense and what it does – a recent example to add color to your regular DGU segments
  • Sean will be teaching “Lethal Force and the Law” seminars at the Great American Outdoor Show February 4-12.
  • Why he ran for NRA board in the first place, and why running for re-election.
  • What makes Sean different than other candidates.
  • How he hopes to work with the grassroots for the NRA.
  • Follow him on Facebook and Twitter @SeanMaloneyNRA Website MaloneyForNRA.com
  • FASTER as a lead in to Laura – Ohio is at almost 800 school staff members trained.

4- Interview 2

Laura Carno

Rob- Laura Carno built the websites I am Created Equal, and Laura Carno.com.   You will find her there when she isn’t on Colorado radio or NRA news.  Laura is an author, and her recent book is titled, Government Ruins Nearly Everything.

Welcome back, Laura.

 

Laura’s latest project is Coloradans for Civil Liberties.  They want to train staff to be first responders in case of a violent attack on Colorado schools.  Tell us about that.

 

Laura-  Point of information to Rob, we are in the fundraising stage now so we haven’t had any classes yet. We are ready to go once the money is there. We are fundraising now!

 

We plan to learn from our friends in Ohio and start from there, changing if something needs changing. But they have 4 years on us, so we are happy to learn.

 

Rob- I’m thinking that many of the school staff in Colorado might also be on Ski Patrol, so they already know about emergency response.  They are already concealed carriers, so they are armed when they are away from work.  How much of the emergency responder training is new, and how much do you have to re-organize or refocus?

 

Public and private schools?

Daycare through college?

Adult education and vocational training?

 

You do this training at no charge to the schools.  What do you offer the staff?

 

Laura-  ???They bring their own guns and equipment.  We provide?  (ammo, lodging, training, medical crash kits for them to take home)  Bandaids for the class, and real supplies for the classroom.

 

Rob- That takes money for instructors, ranges, equipment.  How do you fund it so far?

Laura-

 

Rob- This a phenomenon unique to the United States.  We see a problem, and we get together and solve it.  I admire that about our character, but I have a concern.  I’ve been to those fund raisers.  Aren’t we trying to fund a culture of liberty with bake sales and overcooked chicken dinners?

 

Also feel free to mention that CCL is on FB and Twitter.

 

Please support Coloradans for civil liberties

 

5- DGUs  (at beginning) These discussions are NOT legal advice. Some of us are trainers, but this is not formal training and YOU NEED formal training. The Defensive Gun Use segment is intended as information, NOT as training. As always the opinions of the hosts are only their own opinions and not those of any sponsors or other affiliations.

 

Woman Shoots Intruder After Husband Opened the Door

Brandon Robinson opened the backdoor of his Columbus, Ohio home to an 11 PM knock. The two people outside said they had been stranded by car trouble. Robinson kindly gave them the house phone. But, when he turned to go back inside, the heavily tattooed Allen Thompson pistol whipped him.   

 

Thompson’s accomplice forced his way past the stunned owner into the home, where he demanded cash from Jessica Robinson. The thug got the one thousand dollars from the Robinson’s safe. When he demanded to go into the back bedrooms, where her two young children were sleeping, Mrs Robinson went Full Mama Bear.

 

Using her pistol hidden in the kitchen cabinets, she shot the invader in the torso. “I know there’s a damn good chance we’d be dead right now if I hadn’t grabbed my gun like I did. My immediate life was in danger, so I shot.” The wounded intruder fell down the back stairs escaping from the empowered woman. Thompson, still outside, shot back at Jessica. Return fire from Brandon Robinson drove Thomson away.

Thompson was arrested at the hospital. The unnamed accomplice, possibly a minor, was admitted and arrested. Both suspect’s conditions are unknown.

Also unknown is why Brandon Robinson would open his door to a late night knock. His well-meaning actions exposed his family to dangerous possibilities. Thankfully, his wife was able to respond with the use of her firearm. However, we must question the hiding of a firearm in a cupboard with a seven-year-old in the house. On-body carry, POGO!, would have been safer for all.   

 

Guys?

Photo courtesy of ABC6

 

Possible thoughts:
Paul – Keep the door shut and locked – offer to call 911.

Rob- Concealed carry in the house.  
Safe storage of a firearm with children.

John – Kathy Jackson had 5 kids under 6. She decided the safest place to keep a firearm was on her hip.

 

Taxi Driver Stops Attack With His Gun
An unruly passenger pulled an ice pick on a New York taxi driver. He pulled his gun. There is no indication he uttered the words; “Youz talkin’ to me?”

Collin Green, picked up Katrina Green, 39, no relation.  After driving her to several stops, it became obvious she would not pay. He stopped the car and called police. Katrina became agitated and knocked the phone out of the driver’s hand and then pulled an ice pick. Both exited the vehicle and Katrina demonstrated her rage by shattering the rear window of the car with the pick. When advanced on Collin, he pulled the handgun he bought after being stabbed 13 times. “Look, don’t come any further. Don’t make me do this. I don’t want to have to hurt you.”

Reason somehow penetrated Katrina’s skull, and she calmed enough to allow Collin to drive away. Police later arrested the woman and charged her with Menacing, Criminal Mischief, Criminal Possession of a Weapon, and theft of services. Because of the damage to the taxi, the charges could be upgraded to a felony. Lt. Jon Ballard praised Collin for his actions in dealing with the situation. “The guy did everything correct. He used his handgun to protect himself but didn’t go above and beyond what was necessary.”

We too congratulate Collin Green, who could pass for funkmeister George Clinton, for his measured response — and also his foresight in buying, getting his carry license, and carrying a weapon. Driving a hack is one of the most dangerous occupations.

Another save for POGO!

 

Rachel-I wonder what was going on in his mind. I imagine it could be difficult for a man to overcome social expectations and pull a gun on a woman….even though obviously it was VERY warranted and necessary to save his life.

Rob- Disparity of force.  You don’t don’t have to press the trigger.  

Paul – New York City cabbie and he was able to get a permit? There ARE Unicorns!

John – I wish. He was upstate in Rochester.

 

Four Against One, The One Had a Gun

In a quiet, South Florida neighborhood, four armed intruders violently stormed into a home midday Saturday. The homeowner was forced to fight back against those incredible odds.

 

According to the police, the homeowner acted to defend his life and the lives of the three women in the house. His shots killed one invader and caused the other three to flee. They escaped in a green sedan and have not been located. Other than the intruder, no others were harmed. An elderly woman resident was shaken up and taken to relatives.

 

“I do have a license to carry, and it’s because of things like this,” said neighbor Jorge  Martinez.  

 

We POGO because of things like this.  

Rob- This is closer to the rule than the exception.  Robbers attack in packs.

 

Paul – For new listeners, POGO means Pants On Gun On

John – Makes me think that the pistol of choice needs to be an AR pistol with a 30 rd mag.

Rob- Who carries a spare magazine?

 

We post each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com  Please take a minute and share them with a friend.

 

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6- E-mail, blog notes, and show close

 

Listener e-mail discussion

605-215-1438 or onair@politicsandguns.com

First, an email from Carl that we didn’t get to last week.

 

Hello,

Recently Rob published an article regarding the Presbyterian Church USA (PCUSA) and its naïve stance on firearms.  I am here to say that I am a member and elder of that denomination and I agree with Rob.  For many years, PCUSA has been against any gun that isn’t used for hunting.

PCUSA is rife with members who whole-heartedly support the 2nd amendment.  The problem is that the leadership is stuffed with liberals.  This was confirmed to me by my old friend and college roommate, a retired Presbyterian pastor and United States Navy chaplain who retired with the rank of Commander.  He is about as disgusted with the situation as I am.

PCUSA advocates for ministry to people who have been affected by gun violence.  OK, it is good to do that for people who have been affected by violence of any kind.  But they also call for (http://www.pcusa.org/news/2014/6/19/assembly-acts-decisively-gun-violence-abortion-tax/):

  • opposition to legislation that exempts gun manufacturers and marketers from legal liability and/or financial accountability for the medical and security costs of predictable gun misuse and availability to criminals, the unstable, and the self-destructive;
  • opposition to “stand your ground” and other legislation that may entitle gun owners to shoot before taking alternative measures (such as relying on law enforcement and/or other de-escalation techniques) in perceived defense of persons or property;
  • encouraging church sessions and PC(USA) entities that own property to declare their particular premises and gatherings to be gun-free zones;
  • raising the age for handgun ownership to 21;
  • supporting legislation to ban semiautomatic assault weapons, armor-piercing handgun ammunition and .50-caliber rifles; and
  • advocacy in support of state and federal legislation to regulate ammunition.

I have stayed Presbyterian for a few reasons, one of which is to possibly promote change from within.  PCUSA has progressively removed itself from the Bible in many areas.  Now I am tired.  Maybe I should go back to my Lutheran roots (attention Lloyd Bailey!).  Or my wife’s Baptist roots.

Thanks for listening to my rant.

Carl

 

Rob-  Thank you, Carl.  I’m sorry your church isn’t listening to reason.  That must be alienating, to say the least.  I hope you will find and support a church that shares your values.

 

Rachel- Thank you for your honesty.

Gary –

 

Next an email from John about show notes.

 

I have been listening to your show for about a year or so.

Many changes, lots of growth, and my favorite of the 9 I listen to.

However. I use an iPhone 6s to listen.
Whenever you mention show notes, I am unable to see them using the iPhone podcast app.

Suggestions?

I use this app as it is the best choice for all the different podcasts I listen to.

Thanks
John

 

Paul – That is entirely my fault. I will work on getting a solution in place to make this happen

Rachel – Awww we’re his favorite!

Rob- Paul, you might try the Blueberry publisher.

 

An anonymous emailer writes in

First off I would prefer that you not use my name – Only my wife and son know that I carry concealed and I prefer to keep it that way.

I try to follow John Farnam’s advice …stealth is good, don’t draw attention to yourself as a concealed carrier.

Here is my question for discussion….Do you recommend getting a few training classes under your belt before going to a MAG40.

My state concealed carry permit requires 8 hrs. of class room which includes live fire. I have done that plus 4 hrs. of club training with range qualification.

I also practice at the range every other weekend for almost a year now.

I don’t want to put out significant dollars for MAG40 and have it be too early in the process for me and not get the maximum value out of the class.

I am over 50 years old and CCW permitted I May 2016.

I really enjoy all of you on the show…I listen to you and Bob Mayne.

Thanks

 

Rachel- I think someone would find themselves behind the curve and frustrated if they attended a MAG-40 class either (1) without a good quality handgun (i.e. a tiny 380 or something that jams every other mag), or (2) without being comfortable and safe in handling the firearm (loading, chambering, manipulating, drawing, holstering, basic shooting). Other than that, you’re good. You don’t have to be a great shot. MAG is supposed to teach you to shoot – you don’t have to come already knowing everything. You sound like you’re at a place to definitely get maximum value. As far as the classroom portion (rules of engagement): if you’ve thought about the sober ramifications of carrying a gun and read some DGU’s (or listened to ours) you are ready. And once you pass MAG-20, go to MAG-30. It is AMAZING how far you can go in your shooting with just 3 days of David’s instruction.

 

Paul – I want to re-iterate what Rachel says here plus say that a lot of dry fire practice after ANY training helps

Gary –

Rachel – don’t wait to get really good instruction.  

 

Charlie Cook of Riding Shotgun with Charlie sent us a Facebook message

Hi Polite Society Podcast hosts,

I was just listening to Ep 398. It had John Corriea of ASP and Amanda Suffecool. During the email questions, someone asked about traveling on airlines with a firearm.

I’ve done it a few times. Wish I did for SHOT just to do it again. But I wasn’t going anywhere where we could carry.  

In Providence RI in 2007, someone stole my suitcase that contained 4 handguns that were properly checked and in locked, secure containers. They were gone for 2 weeks. The secure containers were broken into and the contents taken out.

The criminal got caught trying to sell my snub 38 in downtown Providence.   After he was caught, his roommate turned the guns in to the local police and called me. I was able to get the guns back. Three of them came back a week after he was arrested. The one he tried to sell was held up for the court case. We all have nicknames for our carry guns. My is The Evidence. (Hehe).

The reason my suitcase was stolen is partly on me. I went to the bathroom after I got off the airplane and before I retrieved my luggage.

So my advice on traveling on an airplane with a suitcase. Get your suitcase THEN go to the bathroom.

~ Charlie

 

Gary –

Rob –

 

Paul: Rob, do you have any posts from your SlowFacts blog you want to mention?

 

Rob-  I’d like to talk to our listeners.  Thank you.  People like you saved dozens of lives in December.  I wrote about your success in my article “Armed Civilians Saved Lives”

I also helped Greg Hopkins put up the article that our listener Carl talked about.  It is called  “Liberal Churches are Confused About Evil and Guns”

That, and much more is up on Clash Daily, on Ammoland, and at my blog, slow facts dot wordpress dot com.  John, tell us what’s new at your blog no lawyers only guns and money

 

John- The fight against traditional lead ammo and fishing tackle has been going on for years. So-called environmental groups such as the Center for Biological Diversity and Project Gutpile (I kid you not on that name) sued multiple times and always lost in the courts. As a parting gift to these groups, Dan Ashe, Director of the US Fish & Wildlife Service, issued a Director’s Order on Jan 19th mandating the elimination of lead ammo and fishing tackle on Federally owned properties within 5 years. He went further and said that lead-based shotgun shells would be outlawed for dove and upland bird hunting. This order was based upon bad science and political opportunism and without consultation with any of the state fish and game agencies. I am hopeful that the Trump Administration overturns this order rather quickly.

 

That and more is at only guns and money dot blogspot dot com.

 

Rob- The older I get, the less I want the feds owning ANY lands.  None.  Nada.

 

Susan – https://youtu.be/db0nEyXK_e4

 

We would like to thank Charlie Foxtrot for writing up show notes for us. Even though you don’t hear him on the air he is certainly part of what you do hear. Look at his blog at not one more gun law dot blogspot dot com

 

Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast.  I’d like to thank (Guests) for joining us today.  So for Charlie Foxtrot, Craig, Gary, John, Rachel, Susan, and Rob,

(Paul, stop talking now)

 

Rob: Until the next time…

Gary: stay safe,

Rachel: be aware,

John: and we’ll see you down the road.

Episode 398 – Cover Your ASP

Full Episode Download: http://traffic.libsyn.com/politicsandguns/398.mp3

1- Open and Personal News Segment

2- News Segment

3- Interview Segment 1: Guest John Corriea

4- Interview Segment 2: Guest Amanda Suffecool

5- DGU Segment:

6- Email and Show Close:

1- Introduction

Paul: Welcome to the polite society podcast sponsored by the Firearms Policy Coalition recorded on Friday January 13th 2017 , I’m Paul Lathrop

Gary:… so climb aboard

Susan: strap in

Paul : and hang on!

Paul:  episode 398 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.

Show intro music.

 

Personal news from each participant (when you are done with your segment please ask the next person what has been up with them)

 

Gary

Paul/Susan

 

Promo about upcoming training classes here.

(February 11 & 12, 2017 MAG20 in Austin, TX)

(June 24 & 25, 2017 Beyond Concealed Carry Enhanced. 9am-5pm both days. Richmond, IL)

(August 10-13, 2017 MAG40 in Sioux Falls, SD)

(August 26 & 27, 2017 Beyond Concealed Carry Enhanced. Sioux Falls, SD)

 

Break

2- News 1

National Carry Reciprocity Update

The Washington Free Beacon published an article with further details related to Representative Richard Hudson’s (R-NC) proposed reciprocity legislation.  This news outlines Rep. Hudson’s intent that the Act will recognize both resident and non-resident licenses or permits.  He stated that he has, “confirmed this with legislative counsel and Judiciary Committee staff.”  The bill has over 100 co-sponsors.

 

Imagine that you live in New Jersey, Washington D.C. or Orange County, California.  You have given up hope to obtain a carry permit since you are not one of the privileged class.  If this bill passes with the author’s stated intent, you would be able to obtain a permit from a free state and be allowed to carry in your own state.  

 

Forum Shopping is a frequent tactic in the legal profession to try cases in an area where the chances of a favorable outcome are the most likely.  Many large businesses are incorporated in Delaware because of their favorable laws.  Why shouldn’t the average citizen have the opportunity to obtain freedom from the most favorable venue?

 

It is no wonder that Alan Gottlieb of the Second Amendment Foundation has applauded Rep. Hudson for inclusion of non-resident permits in the legislation.  There is little doubt that the gun control lobby will pull out all of the stops to ensure this legislation is not successful.  It is our job to ensure there are consequences for politicians determined to infringe open our rights.  Just say no to gun free zones, magazine capacity restrictions, trigger weight requirements and any other ludicrous schemes meant to turn law-abiding citizens into criminals.

 

Gary –

Paul – I alluded to this last week. GET YOUR CCW NOW! Utah- Arizona-Florida etc

=========================================

Loretta Lynch: U.S. Attorney’s Office Worked ‘Around the Clock’ Against Chicago ‘Gun Violence’

Amid reports that lax prosecution is one of the chief enablers of Chicago gun crime, Attorney General Loretta Lynch says the U.S. Attorney’s Office for the Northern District of Illinois has worked “around the clock” against Chicago “gun violence.” Moreover, in the past few years, the NRA has pointed to a lack of federal prosecutions as a weak link in the fight against Chicago gun crime.

 

Gun Quotes

As far as I’m concerned, ARs are for all practical purposes military weapons. But before any of my gun-rights brothers accuse me of betraying the cause, let me follow up with this statement: there’s nothing wrong with the fact that they’re military weapons. It’s a good thing. – Chris Hernandez

 

Hang on everybody, we’ll be back with our guest John Correa of Active Self Protection

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3- Interview 1

 

4- Interview 2

 

5- DGUs  (at beginning) These discussions are NOT legal advice. Some of us are trainers, but this is not formal training and YOU NEED formal training. The Defensive Gun Use segment is intended as information, NOT as training. As always the opinions of the hosts are only their own opinions and not those of any sponsors or other affiliations.

 

Trying to Rob Gun Store

You’ve got to be brazen or stupid – or a large amount of both – to rob a gun store. A pair of robbers tried their luck at Dixie Gun and Pawn in the Atlanta, Georgia area. The results were entirely predictable.

           Video of Dixie Gun and Pawn Robbery


The video contained in the show notes is very instructive. It shows two masked men entering the store with guns drawn and pointed at the two workers inside. The video starts with one employee with his hands up and the store owner with his back to the thugs. When the owners recognizes the situation, he turns, retreats slightly and comes up with his 1911. He targets the closest threat, who is pointing two pistols at him. Both men fire, but the owner’s shots immediately drop the robber onto his back motionless. It seems the first shot

was a critical central nervous system hit and the perp was dead before he hit the ground. Three quick shots drive the other thief out the door. The entire incident took only 11 seconds, the actual shooting — less than 5.   

 

The two workers likely survived because the store owner knew what he was doing and performed his tasks effectively and efficiently. His actions speak of training and practice. Most importantly, he had his life-saving equipment on his hip when it was needed – for the first time in 30 years.

 

POGO, you never know.   

 

How’s That Rehabilitation Working Out For Yah?
A Sarasota County, Florida homeowner was forced to shoot and kill a home invader in self defense. The man and his family returned home when they were attacked by a man with a baseball bat. The owner shot the intruder in self-defense.  

Glenn Edward Oliver, 30, died inside his victim’s house. This violent career criminal had recently been released from prison after a 10 year sentence for armed robbery with a firearm and car-jacking. His prison time and five year probation apparently did little to deter him from his chosen profession. A profession that threatened the lives of others.

 

Oliver was accorded victim status by the Gun Memorial website, which described him as one “Lost to gun violence on January 8, 2017 in Sarasota, Florida.” There was no mention of the family that he threatened with serious injury or death.

 

Dr Sowell’s DGU

Dr Thomas Sowell has retired. For as long as we can remember, Dr Sowell has been a contrarian voice of reason and rationality. The respected economist and Senior Fellow of the Hoover Institute wrote widely on a host of subjects, never failing to bring his unique clarity and communication ability to the issue. Now, the 86-year-old, small “L” libertarian has hung up his pen. In one of his last columns, Sowell took on the New York Times and their bigoted, fictitious image of legal gun carriers. He lays out a convincing argument for the law-abiding, armed citizen and disassembles the Times’ lies. Almost as an aside, he reveals that he has used a gun in self-defense. Yes, Dr Sowell has had a DGU!

 

In Dr Sowell’s words: “The only time I ever pointed a gun at a human being, it was when someone was sneaking up toward me from behind a shed in the middle of the night. I never fired a shot. I just pointed the gun at him and told him to stop. He stopped.” <unquote> In this, the exceptional Dr Sowell becomes rather ordinary; as in the vast majority of DGUs a shot is never fired. The victim’s firearm causes the criminal to rapidly reevaluate the situation, usually resulting in a decision to be elsewhere as soon as possible.  

 

We wish Dr Sowell a long and happy retirement. He will be devoting himself to his photography, which is featured at his website. His black and white photographs are truly stunning. We also thank him for his last column on the fallacy of gun control and highly recommend it to our listeners. The link can be found in the shownotes.  

Don’t Torque Off the Old Gal

In another of our continuing “Don’t Torque Off an Ol’ Gal” series, a feisty 74-year-old Texan puts the fear of Grandmother in a thug.   

 

Rebbie Robertson was watching TV when she was startled by an armed intruder.  Not one to take an interruption to her shows lightly, she grabbed a .38 on a nearby table and pointed it at the bad guy, who quite understandably ran for his life. Putting the robber to flight wasn’t enough for the cranky septuagenarian, so she ran after him firing her gun. There was no doubt in her mind; “I tried to kill him! Anybody break in on me I’m going to kill them! He going to kill me or I’m going to kill him!” Unfortunately for her house, her aim wasn’t quite as well developed as her outrage.  


Police aren’t certain if ol’ Deadeye actually hit the intruder, however they’re continuing to look for the criminal, who might still be running. You just don’t dare torque off an old grandmother!  

 

We post each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com  Please take a minute and share them with a friend.

 

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6- E-mail, blog notes, and show close

 

Listener e-mail discussion

605-215-1438

 

1st email

 

I have just recently learned about and started listening to the Polite Society podcast.  Good stuff.

Here are a few thoughts from the prepper interview:

I am a huge proponent of using a .22lr rifle.  I disagree that auto loaders are more complex than a bolt action or lever action rifle.  I have disassembled (and reassembled) multiple Ruger 10/22 rifles.  They are pretty simple.  They are also quite effective.  Why?

An autoloader allows for a much faster followup shot than a bolt action or lever action and I have seen very few malfunctions, maybe one out of a thousand rounds, all of which could be cleared by nothing more than cycling the bolt.  Using quality ammunition is important.

I can carry a case (5K) rounds of .22lr (CCI MiniMags preferred) under one arm.  A single tin (440 rounds) of 7.62x54r is a bit tougher to carry. https://www.faclevents.org/austin-tx-1-day-14jan2017

In a survival situation, I would be willing to hunt even deer with a .22lr.  Mind you, the deer in Texas run kind of small.

In a long term survival situation, rounds of .22lr would make a good currency, with each round being of fairly small denomination.

While not great in defending a position, it’s still enough to discourage attackers at 100+ yards.

So, while I don’t think it is a solution to everything, I would not be surprised if a .22lr turned out to be the most often used round in a survival situation.

And, as a followup, I highly recommend classes from the Appleseed Project (Hi, Rachel) as the best and most cost effective introductory rifle marksmanship training.  So much so that I have a standing offer to pay for a friend of mine to take a weekend class.

Keep up the good work, I have been enjoying the podcasts.

— Matt

 

Jake from Iowa wrote in:

 

On the subject of National Carry Reciprocity, Rachel expressed doubts that this was something we want the federal government getting their hands into.  I generally share her caution about government, and really respect and appreciate her principled approach to things, but I disagree – I think that in order to respect the constitution, the federal government MUST institute national reciprocity.  

The justification would be under the “full faith and credit” clause of the constitution, which requires states to respect the documents issued by other states, such as drivers licenses, marriage licenses, etc.

Politicians are certainly known for “creative” interpretations of the constitution, such as the much-abused interstate commerce clause, but the full faith and credit clause can only honestly be interpreted in our favor – It could not be used to justify forcing more strenuous qualifications for permits on the states.  One could maybe create several “levels” of carry permits, and argue that, say Utah’s carry permit is only equivalent to California’s “basic” carry permit, so you can’t carry in a bunch of places until you get some kind of prohibitively expensive “enhanced” permit, but even that would be progress.

 

Right now, I have an Iowa carry permit but work in Illinois.  It is literally impossible for me to get an IL carry permit because IL will not issue one to IA residents, nor will they honor my IA permit, except in my vehicle.  This is a pretty blatant denial of rights, and is unconstitutional both on 2A grounds and based on the full faith and credit clause, and I would love to see them slapped down on this.

 

Thanks,

-Jake from Iowa

 

And Carl also wrote in.

 

Hello,

Recently Rob published an article regarding the Presbyterian Church USA (PCUSA) and its naïve stance on firearms.  I am here to say that I am a member and elder of that denomination and I agree with Rob.  For many years, PCUSA has been against any gun that isn’t used for hunting.

PCUSA is rife with members who whole-heartedly support the 2nd amendment.  The problem is that the leadership is stuffed with liberals.  This was confirmed to me by my old friend and college roommate, a retired Presbyterian pastor and United States Navy chaplain who retired with the rank of Commander.  He is about as disgusted with the situation as I am.

PCUSA advocates for ministry to people who have been affected by gun violence.  OK, it is good to do that for people who have been affected by violence of any kind.  But they also call for (http://www.pcusa.org/news/2014/6/19/assembly-acts-decisively-gun-violence-abortion-tax/):

  • opposition to legislation that exempts gun manufacturers and marketers from legal liability and/or financial accountability for the medical and security costs of predictable gun misuse and availability to criminals, the unstable, and the self-destructive;
  • opposition to “stand your ground” and other legislation that may entitle gun owners to shoot before taking alternative measures (such as relying on law enforcement and/or other de-escalation techniques) in perceived defense of persons or property;
  • encouraging church sessions and PC(USA) entities that own property to declare their particular premises and gatherings to be gun-free zones;
  • raising the age for handgun ownership to 21;
  • supporting legislation to ban semiautomatic assault weapons, armor-piercing handgun ammunition and .50-caliber rifles; and
  • advocacy in support of state and federal legislation to regulate ammunition.

I have stayed Presbyterian for a few reasons, one of which is to possibly promote change from within.  PCUSA has progressively removed itself from the Bible in many areas.  Now I am tired.  Maybe I should go back to my Lutheran roots (attention Lloyd Bailey!).  Or my wife’s Baptist roots.

Thanks for listening to my rant.

Carl

 

Paul: Rob, do you have any new posts from your SlowFacts blog you want to mention?

 

Rob- Clash Daily.  Ammoland.  Slowfacts. That is at slow facts dot wordpress dot com.  John, tell us what’s new at your blog no lawyers only guns and money

 

That and more is at only guns and money dot blogspot dot com.

 

We would like to thank Charlie Foxtrot for writing up show notes for us. Even though you don’t hear him on the air he is certainly part of what you do hear. Look at his blog at not one more gun law dot blogspot dot com

 

Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast.  I’d like to thank (Guests) for joining us today.  So for Charlie Foxtrot, Gary, John, Rachel, Susan, and Rob,

 

Paul: Until the next time…

Gary: stay safe,

Susan: be aware,

Paul: and we’ll see you down the road.

 

(after show close) How could we have made this episode better?

 

(DO NOT READ)Look at the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.  Subscribing from the link in our show notes helps Bob and Ben as well as helps us here at the Polite Society Podcast.

 

(DO NOT READ)Join your local civil rights group like the New Jersey Second Amendment Society, Arizona Citizens Defense League, Gun Owners of California, Commonwealth Second Amendment,  Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Florida Carry, Georgia Carry, Georgia Gun Owners, Grass Roots North Carolina, Illinois Carry, Maryland Shall Issue,  Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry, and  Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.

 

There are Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance,  Nebraska Firearms Owners Association,   Citizens for a Safer New Jersey, New York State Rifle & Pistol Association,  Palmetto Concealed Carry, Open Carry Texas, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Virginia Open Carry,  West Virginia Citizens Defense League, wisconsingunowners.org, and Wyoming Gun Owners.

 

For our Canadian listeners, and their supporters, join the Canadian Shooting Sports Association and the Canadian National Firearms Association.  If YOUR state or local organization isn’t read each episode, then send us an email and we’ll add them!

 

(DO NOT READ)The Polite Society download app is out on Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.