Paul: Welcome to the Polite Society Podcast powered by the Firearms Policy Coalition recorded on April 22nd, 2019, I’m Paul Lathrop
Rob: I’m Rob Morse and on tonight’s show we will talk with Kat Ainsworth and Ken Whitmore.
John: I’m John Richardson, and we’ll talk about the internal troubles at the NRA.
Gary: I’m Gary Daugherty and we have another DGU in a the same family.. so climb aboard
Grant: strap in
John : and hang on!
Paul: episode 492 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.
Show intro music.
Personal news from each participant (when you are done with your segment please ask the next person what has been up with them)
John – In between rain showers, I did more work this Saturday on the hunting plot. I’m trying to open up a shooting lane of about 100 yards. I’d say I have about 50 yards cleared so far. I’m planting food crops for the deer in the cleared area. Even though the chainsaw does most of the work, I still feel it in my back the next day! With regard to firearms, UTG sent me the correct size screws for my Mossberg 500 and I have mounted a red dot on it. Finally, I also got notification today that my media credentials for the NRA AM were approved.
Grant – Nothing major on the firearms front this week. Taught a good class that was very well attended. Thanks to all the students who took part. Other than that it was workety-work and my usual Thursday evening spell at the range. I took advantage of not having any classes this weekend to do family things. Paul? How’s the disarmament dance?
Paul/Susan – Nra credentials for us as well
Promo about upcoming training classes here.
Grant – we have National Train a Teacher day coming up on July 20th, I reached out to… We also have USCCA and NRA Instructor courses coming over the summer. Email me at: grant-at-scotshot-dot-com for details.
Ask listeners to listen to other shows on the network, name at least 2 shows.
POLITE SOCIETY NEWS, April 22nd 2019
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Grant – WHAT IS GOING ON AT THE NRA?
NRA is by far the largest gun advocacy group in the United States. With an estimated six million members, and a large lobbying effort, it remains the elephant in the room. In the past, they have brought notable legislative successes (FOPA, for example), but recently, a series of controversies has brought frustration with the organization among grass roots members and high profile firearms personalities alike, These have included calls for members to leave the NRA, effectively defunding it.
The NRA suffered a major setback when its “Carry Guard” program essentially failed. Carry Guard was a combination of concealed carry Insurance and concealed carry Training. Left wing States, such as New York, filed legal action against NRA to stop them selling insurance in their states, claiming that NRA was not licensed to do so; these actions are being pursued aggressively and tie up NRA member dollars against essentially unlimited state taxpayer dollars. There’s little doubt too, that NY basically coerced companies into cutting ties with the NRA.
Then there was the controversy over NRA green-lighting the bump-stock ban following the Las Vegas murders. Many people saw this as a direct strike against the 2nd Amendment despite a long-standing policy within NRA that supported gun owners following the law, and not attempting to make end-runs around it; NRA spokesperson and board person Marion Hammer said this explicitly about the bump stock.
Now, we see that NRA has decided to sue its marketing agency of some 30 years standing, Ackerman McQueen. Ackerman McQueen produces essentially all sales and marketing strategy for NRA, and they also produce all the programming for NRA TV. The NRA pays them a whopping forty-two million dollars a year. Well known NRA personalities such as Colion Noir and Dana Loesch actually work for Ackerman McQueen.
However, the lawsuit claims that the agency has declined to provide NRA with contractually-obliged analytic information, absent which, NRA can’t make key decisions about the effectiveness of its marketing plan.
This is going to be a high profile case that is already seeing a lot of attention, leading into the Annual Conference. With the NRA embroiled in internal conflict on every topic from executive compensation, training programs, an unwieldy and allegedly toothless board of directors, to conflicts of interest, it is a pivotal point in the history of the organization. It is up to us, the members, to determine whether we want change, and what sort of change that should be.
So, what is your take? Leave NRA alone? Defund it by abandoning membership? Support it more, since we need it to be stronger? Let us know!
John – A Board member told me they think the lawsuit against Ack-Mac might be a smokescreen to divert attention from the Board’s lack of due diligence.
Rob- Marketing? Due diligence.
Paul – $42 million spent on marketing, $1M spent on WLP salary I hate to make the comparison, but comparing income to marketing expenses the NRA is getting close to NAGR and Dudley Brown.
Grant – as an NRA Training COunselor, I truly want the organization to succeed, and it saddens me when people are so ready to call for people to give money instead only to their local orgs – on the other hand, SAF hs advanced or rights in court and that is where the action is.
John – Another major expense is the legal bills paid to William Brewer which are averaging $1.2 million per month. Another board member who is an atty called him a hustler and not a respected atty.
John – Let me conclude – just how bad is the situation – Marion Hammer who hasn’t attended a board meeting since hell froze over is supposed to be at the next board meeting.
Rob- Why should the NRA save you when you don’t save yourself and join your local state organization?
Grant – I’m not a life member but I renew every year. W
John – ANNIVERSARY OF COLUMBINE BRINGS DANGER TO COLORADO
An 18-year-old woman from Florida was apparently obsessed with the Columbine High School murders from 20 years ago. She made threats in the period leading up to the 20th Anniversary of the murders. The FBI described her as being “infatuated” with Columbine, and said she was “extremely dangerous”.
The Miami Beach high-schooler flew to Colorado and bought a pump action shotgun, and ammunition. Because of her threats, Columbine and over 20 other schools locked their doors. Over half-a-million students in all were affected. Some cancelled evening activities, some moved them inside, behind locked doors.
After an extensive hunt, she was found dead, having taken her own life.
School friends described her as quiet, studious and someone who kept to herself. Her journals and diaries told a story of obsession with the Columbine attack, and one of the perpetrators. She also wrote about her desire to obtain a firearm, and the closeness of the upcoming anniversary.
The FBI said that while this girl was working alone, she showed all the features of someone who locked into a perverse romantic image of Columbine, as many had before her. The real-time coverage by mainstream media of this and subsequent events, reinforced such fantasies, they said.
Fortunately in this case, the planned attack was thwarted and the only person to die was the would-be murderer.
Now, in a bizarre twist, some say that the store which sold this person the shotgun in fact broke the law and should themselves be prosecuted. Colorado law says that it is legal to sell a long gun to an out-of-state resident, provided it would be legal for that person to buy the same gun in their home state. The would-be murderer was under 21 when she bought the shotgun. However, following the Parkland murders, Florida raised the legal age to buy *any* firearm, to 21.
This is just another twist in how anti gunners are setting up traps all over the country, not just for gun buyers, but for gun sellers too. All around, this episode is a sorry mess.
Rob- She was infatuated with becoming a media celebrity.
John- Interestingly, this time it was a woman and not a young man.
Paul – I want to reiterate our policy on this show that we will never name a mass murderer or in this case a potential mass murderer.
Paul STORY THREE
INDIANA ADVANCES SCHOOL SAFETY LEGISLATION
A move aimed at increasing school safety by helping school employees acquire firearms training recently passed in the Indiana Senate.
HB 1253, was approved in a 32-14 vote in the chamber this week while the House passed the bill 72-25 in February. There will be a final concurrence vote in the House and then it can go to the governor’s desk.
The Bill’s author, Representative Jim Lucas, said “People have a constitutional right to defend themselves when placed in threatening situations.” He continued, “This legislation would ensure our educators are properly trained if ever faced with an active shooter situation. The training could provide added protection for Hoosier teachers and students.”
Indiana already allows school boards to grant teachers and administrators the authority to carry firearms on school property. The measure will allow those districts to apply for a grant to train staff who chose to carry. Lucas said previously that the specialized training would consist of about 40 hours of instruction ranging from firearm safety to emergency medicine and use of force. The grants would be open to public, private and charter schools.
Lucas argued that police could be 10 or more minutes away in an active shooter situation, whereas armed school staff could likely already be on-site.
Gun control advocates are, of course, against the proposal, calling the move “dangerous.”
Indiana’s current governor, Republican Eric Holcomb, took office in 2017. He has signed pro-gun bills in the past and his wife, Indiana First Lady Janet Holcomb, is a certified pistol instructor.
Rob- Quantity has a quality of its own. You can train about 300 school volunteers for the cost of one school resource officer.
John – I’m pretty sure Gov. Holcomb will be a speaker at the NRA Leadership Forum on Friday.
Paul- 40 hours of instruction if done properly can make a HUGE amount of difference in your ab
Rob STORY FOUR
GRASS-ROOTS WIN IN VIRGINIA
You must be present to win. Virginia CCW permits can cost from $15 dollars (the statutory minimum) to $50 dollars, depending on your county. For example, in Caroline COunty the permit is $15, while in King William County, it is the full $50. The $35 is a fee, which can be charged in whole or in part, by the issuing authority.
Well, now Virginia Defense League member Thomas M Coffin Snr has successfully had this discretionary fee eliminated in his home King William County.
Having learned that his home county levied the full $35 discretionary fee, he approached his local board to ask about the fee. After a prolonged discussion with Board Member Hodges, he agreed that the board would drop the fee, bringing the cost of a CCW permit down to $15.
Grant – people often say that they themselves can’t make a difference, this story shows us that individuals can, and DOuu, make important differences.
Rob- I would rather have questions that can’t be answered than answers that can’t be questioned. Physicist Richard Feynman.
Hang on everybody, we’ll be back with our guests Kat Ainsworth and Ken Whitmore advertisement
3- Interview 1
Kat Ainsworth- Field editor at range 365. USCCA
Ken Whitmore- freelance writer former marine
4- Interview 2
5- DGUs (at beginning) These discussions are NOT legal advice. Some of us are trainers, but this is not formal training and YOU NEED formal training. The Defensive Gun Use segment is intended as information, NOT as training. As always the opinions of the hosts are only their own opinions and not those of any sponsors or other affiliations.
Gary – Sarasota, Florida
Two male drivers were on the road in Florida last week when one noticed the other swerving back and forth. One driver pulled over and the second did a U turn and pulled up alongside the first. The two men then began arguing.
The first driver got out of his car and walked toward the other car’s passenger side window. The second driver warned the approaching man to back away from the windows and took out a pistol.
The first driver in turn pulled out his weapon and pointed at the second driver. The second driver shot the first one, killing him. He then pulled off to the side and called 911. He then waited for deputies.
He continues to cooperate with deputies in the investigation.
Grant- so, who was the aggressor? Who escalated the conflict?
Paul- The monkey dance gone horribly wrong.
Paul- Yakima County, Washington
Benjamin Rodriguez, 19, had been accused of shooting and killing his father. The father had gotten enraged when he was denied access to prescription drugs that were not his. A prosecutor’s written statement described the father as a, “drug user, prone to violence”.
The enraged father was outside the house and firing shots from a gun. He told Benjamin to call police so he can get in a shoot-out with them. Suicide by cop.
Benjamin did not call police, because he was afraid there would be a shooting. He didn’t call his grandparents out of fear for their safety.
He attempted to calm his father down and grabbed his own rifle when his father started firing shots in the yard. He fired after his father pointed his gun at him.
Benjamin called his grandmother, who then called 911.
Deputies arrived, finding the father in a garage bleeding, with a plastic bag over his head and a belt around his neck. A deputy ripped the bag off his head after hearing him gasp.
Rodriguez admitted to putting the bag on his father’s head and using the belt to secure it, in order to keep blood off the porch. He also admitted to moving him to the garage.
Joseph Brusic, Prosecuting Attorney for Yakima County, stated “There had been substantial volatility with this family. The decedent had a substantial drug problem and had engaged in this erratic and aggressive behavior for some time. This abusive behavior was corroborated by both the suspect and his grandparents.” Benjamin was the only witness to the incident.
“It’s extremely sad for everybody involved,” Brusic said. “You have a son that takes his father’s life — it is a homicide. It’s not the way anyone wanted this to turn out, especially the son and the grandparents.”
“In this case, the State of Washington would be unable to prove the absence of self-defense once the Court allows that defense to move forward. The nature of the relationship, living situation and subjective evaluation by the suspect would prevent conviction by a reasonable and objective fact finder.”
John – The son was lucky to not be prosecuted given some of the stupid stuff he did.
Grant – kal-kas-ka county Kalkaska County, Michigan
Ex-boyfriends will never learn.
At 9 PM on a Saturday, a 26 year-old Kalkaska man went to the residence of his ex-girlfriend’s current boyfriend, where she was also living.
The homeowner told the 26 year old ex to leave. He did as he was told, but then started sending threatening messages to the couple. He declared that he was returning in order to fight the current boyfriend.
When he returned at 3:30 AM the next morning, he was greeted by the homeowner. The homeowner was armed with a rifle and demanded the ex leave once again.
The ex forced his way into the home and a struggle began for the rifle. He was able to gain control of it from the homeowner but they continued to struggle for it.
At some point, the homeowner produced a small caliber pistol and shot the intruder in the chest one time.
The man was transported to a medical center for treatment and was recovering.
The homeowner was questioned and released. The investigation continues.
Paul – If you have a rifle and the bad guy keeps coming at
Rob- Open carry didn’t work as advertised.
Rob- St Louis, Missouri
The 22 year old man had just left a gas station and was headed east on Humphrey with another man. Suddenly, a robber jumped from between two parked cars. He had a handgun and tried to rob them.
Unfortunately for him, one of his intended victims was also armed. He pulled his own weapon and fired several times, hitting the robber three times.
Police corroborated the man’s story with witnesses and recovered the would-be robber’s gun.
The robber is in critical condition.
Rob- Two on one?
We post each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com Please take a minute and share them with a friend.
6- E-mail, blog notes, and show close
Listener e-mail discussion
Your rant last week re illegals?
Paul: Rob, do you have any new posts from your SlowFacts blog you want to mention?
Rob- The Democrat candidates for president have already demonized gun owners. They said lawful gun owners are the real source of crime and violence in the US. Gun owners should turn in their guns or be sent to prison, and if you disagree, then that shows you’re a threat to yourself or others, and you should be forcibly disarmed.
When democrats say this, the media bobbleheads simply nod because it is socially acceptable to hate gun owners.
How is this possible given that guns save lives?
This two-minute hate directed at honest gun owners makes sense once we think about it from a particular perspective. The second amendment isn’t about pistols, rifles or shotguns. It isn’t about bump stocks or even about cannons. The second amendment is about limiting government power. Billionaire Michael Bloomberg doesn’t like limiting government power, and neither do the other Socialists presidential candidates.
I’ll stop there, but you can find four hundred more words in the article called
Paul – one of the people running for the dem nomination is actively campaigning to jail those that own ars and don’t turn them in.
Congressman Eric Swalwell
Grant – this weekend was the anniversary of the first shot of the revolutionary war… some have described this as “common sense gun control – removing ‘powder’ from the hands of unstable colonists – does this sound like red flag to you?
I have had a number of posts up since our last podcast dealing with the NRA, its lawsuit against their ad agency Ackerman McQueen, and other related things. I should say at the outset I’m an Endowment Life member. I have an investment in the NRA. What really concerns me the is the rampant self-dealing by members of the executive staff and some BOD members and the lack of oversight by the board which may lead to either sanction from the IRS thanks to a complaint from Everytown or a move to dissolve the NRA by the Atty General of New York. These are not frivolous charges and there is substantiation behind them. I have had off-the-record conversations with two NRA directors and they are very concerned. If the BOD doesn’t step up ASAP to clean house, we may not have a NRA.
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Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast. I’d like to thank (Kat Ainsworth and Ken Whitmore) for joining us today. So for Amy, Tracy, Belle, Dana, Gary, John, Rachel, Susan, Grant and Rob,
(Paul, stop talking now)
Rob: Until the next time…
Gary: stay safe,
Grant: be aware,
John: and we’ll see you down the road.