Episode 475 – An Interview with Charles Heller

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1- Introduction

John – Welcome to the polite society podcast powered by the Firearms Policy Coalition recorded on Monday, December 17th, 2018, I’m John Richardson.

Rob: I’m Rob Morse and on tonight’s show we will talk with Charles Heller about Tucson Arizona virtue signaling with taxpayer dollars.

Grant: I’m Grant Gallagher, and we’ll talk about the recently released report on the Parkland school mass murders.

Gary: I’m Gary Daugherty and in one of our DGUs Those ex-boyfriends are at it again… so climb aboard

Rob: strap in

Grant : and hang on!

John:  episode 475 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.

Show intro music.

Personal news from each participant (when you are done with your segment please ask the next person what has been up with them)

Rob- Bill Frady and I talked about Self-Defense Gun Stories.  That was on his Lock and Load Radio program. ???and I recorded another Episode of Self-Defense Gun Stories. I’m still looking for a bilingual host to produce the show in spanish.

Gary-

Grant- I conducted my last class of 2018 on Saturday, our beginner handgun class, the class went well and my EMT co-instructor Pete from Berin Arms did a great job. It’s always good to work with motivated students, and always interesting to see what guns they bring. This class, someone brought an M&P 380-EeZee. It’s remarkable how well that slide is set up and how easily it can be manipulated, and she shot well with it.

John – As you might expect in the South, the snow is quickly fading away. I did do some more “gunsmithing” this week finishing up projects. I have also started getting ready for the SHOT Show which starts little more than a month from now. If any of our listeners want me to check out certain new product releases, they can either send feedback to our show email or to me directly at john@politicsandguns.com.

Promo about upcoming training classes here.

Grant – well, classes are over for this year, but next year is looming. We are going to be offering a mix of USCCA and NRA classes, including Instructor classes for both organizations, in handgun, rifle and home defense. We also have National Train a Teacher Day on July 27th. So if any of that sounds interesting, email me on Grant-at-scotshot-dot-com for more details

PATCHES – Yes, we still have PSP patches. I think they would make a great stocking stuffer! Price is $8 ppd. Send PayPal to john@politicsandguns.com or an email to that address if you want to pay by check. Proceeds go to the Second Amendment Foundation.

Ask listeners to listen to other shows on the network, name at least 2 shows.

Break

2- News

POLITE SOCIETY NEWS, December 17th 2018

Hi everyone. Please remember to send your comments on the news to “onair@politicsandguns.com”

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Grant STORY ONE

THE REPORT ON THE PARKLAND SCHOOL MASS MURDER IS OUT

At last, the preliminary report on the Parkland mass murder is out and it contains some real insight into what happened inside the school. The draft report sheds light on things the took place inside the school on that day.

It had been speculated that the murderer pulled a firearm to bring targets out into the crowded hallways. That isn’t true, it was dust and gun smoke that triggered the fire alarm.

The murderer only shot people in his line of sight. He never entered a classroom.

The teachers were isolated. They made their own decisions to shelter in the hardened corners, only doing so when they heard gunshots.

The teachers sheltering in the hardened corners of classrooms never used the school’s PA system, because the call button was not in the hardened corners.

There had not been an active shooter drill in the school in at least a year. The teachers did not call a “code red”. So, when they heard the fire alarm, some of them evacuated their classrooms.

All classroom walls were made of sheetrock and offered no protection from gunfire. Students murdered inside classrooms and hiding in the “hard” corners were shot by chance.

Local 911 dispatchers were not in direct contact with the Broward County Sheriff Department, because their office did not handle emergency services for the school.

Six people entered statements that they had previously reported concerns about the murderer to the school authorities.

As we will see in our next story, the report has changed the minds of may people, when it comes to allowing volunteer armed teachers to protect students.

Once you’ve looked at the report, we’d love to hear your thoughts. Email them to: onair at politics and guns dot com.

Rob, this was your story, why not fill in some of your thoughts?

Rob- This attack could have been much worse with much greater loss of life. We saw gross incompetence. Police from different jurisdictions and fire/EMTs could not communicate with each other by radio. Requests to use non-standard communications networks were delayed or denied. The school staff, the police, and EMTs would have discovered those shortcomings if they had walked through an attack during a drill.

There are phone apps for emergency response. Broward County Sheriff Scott Israel told his staff to take these apps off their phone. He wanted to be in charge.

The Broward county leos failed. That was true for sros, sargents, and incident commanders.

Coral Springs LEOs moved toward the gunfire as they were trained to do.

There was a lot of discussion in the report on “unified command and control”. That misses the point. The event will be over by the time you set up and staff your command and control network.

John – I’m kind of surprised to learn that the classroom walls were sheetrock. I’ve never been in a school that didn’t have cinderblock hall walls.

rob-

Grant – these communications issues were highlighted in the Sept 11th attacks – there’s no excuse for it now.

Gary

SOURCES:

http://www.fdle.state.fl.us/MSDHS/Meetings/2018/December-Meeting-Documents/MSD-draft-rec-and-findings-with-target-hardening.aspx?

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Gary STORY TWO

COMMISSION INVESTIGATING PARKLAND VOTES 13 – 1 TO ALLOW ARMED TEACHERS

As we reported last week, Sheriff Bob Gualtieri has reversed his opinion on whether volunteer  school teachers should be armed, and this past Wednesday, the commission investigating the murders voted 13 for, and one against, allowing volunteer armed teachers in schools.

He said, “People need to keep an open mind to it as the reality is that if someone else in the school had a gun it could have saved kids’ lives.”

The murderer stopped firing five times to reload. No one in the school was armed and able to take advantage of these gaps in the attack.

One of the Report’s authors said, “The Parkland Commission’s decision in favor of arming teachers is rational and founded in common sense. While many commissions often come to feel-good conclusions, the Parkland commission here came to very effective, clear and definitive recommendations.”

He continued that they will make a major improvement in protecting the lives of the children and teachers in Florida. It’s only a tragedy that it took seventeen lives to bring Florida to the same conclusion of so many other States.

So- are you in a state where the teachers are allowed to be armed? What do you think. Email: onair at politics and guns dot com

Rob- That recommendation from the advisory commission probably won’t be acted on. The florida school guardian program takes more than four weeks of training. Programs in other states take less than four days of training. The guardian program is only for non-classroom teachers. That is great if we have to protect the football field, but not so good if we want to protect our students who are usually located in the classroom.

John- NC just held hearings on school safety with public and LEO input.

Gary

rob-

SOURCES:

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2018/12/13/commission-investigating-parkland-votes-13-1-to-arm-teachers
https://www.tampabay.com/florida-politics/buzz/2018/12/13/the-culture-has-to-change-gualtieri-says-schools-must-change
http://www.fdle.state.fl.us/MSDHS/Meetings/2018/December-Meeting-Documents/MSD-draft-rec-and-findings-with-target-hardening.aspx

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John- STORY THREE

PITTSBURGH MAYOR GOES AGAINST STATE PREEMPTION AND DECLARES FOR GUN BANNING.

Pennsylvania is one of many states with so-called “State Preemption” over gun laws, meaning that individual towns, cities and districts in the state cannot create their own firearms laws within the State. However, this isn’t enough for Pittsburgh mayor William Petudo. He has his own ideas, preemption be damned.

He recently held a press conference proposing three new laws that are in direct conflict with State law, and State supreme court precedent. He was joined by State Governor Tom Wolff. Perhaps coincidentally, Governor Wolff received a half a million dollars of support from the Bloomberg front, Everyone for Gun Safety.

The laws are:

  • A complete ban on semiautomatic rifles shotguns and AR pistols
  • A ban on a whole slew of accessories, including: bump stocks, aftermarket triggers, silencers/suppressors, semi-automatic rifles with a detachable magazine and a pistol grip, magazines of more than 10 rounds, and others
  • A “Red Flag” law that allows reporting by family members, for a variety of reasons including marijuana use, and “other reasons” that might be accepted by a court.

The good Mayor is so enamored of his initiative that he has written to other cities across the country to do the same. Council member Corey O’Connor, who helped author the proposals, said, “Pittsburgh must seize the opportunity to make a real difference by partnering with other municipalities in the Commonwealth, and cities across America, to enact gun restrictions.”

The initiative is firmly against State law and State legal precedent. The case of “Ortiz v Commonwealth” spelled out clearly that a previous attempt by Pittsburgh and Philadelphia to defy state preemption was “frivolous”. So, Pittsburgh should be under no illusions. However, they are toeing the Bloomberg line, and will no doubt once again spend taxpayer money to defend the inevitable lawsuit.

Write to us, please, at onair at politics and guns dot com, and tell us what your state, city or township is up to.

Grant – I love that she “helped author” the bill – I guess that means she received the email from Bloomberg and pressed “print”

Rob- this was a bunch of word salad for gun control. I’ve talked with people who set up security programs in their synagogues.

Grant- the laws follow the same format as that introduced in the House of REpresentatives – it’s so OBVIOUS that this is a National gun control initiative sent from a central location and not at all authored at the local level.

Gary-

John- The sad thing is that the PA Sup Ct is now totally in the hands of Democrats so precedent may go out the window along with the black letter law.

SOURCES:

https://www.nraila.org/articles/20181214/pittsburgh-mayor-declares-intent-to-ban-guns-in-violation-of-state-law
http://apps.pittsburghpa.gov/redtail/images/4414_General_Firearm_Conduct.pdf
http://apps.pittsburghpa.gov/redtail/images/4412_Accessories_Ammoand_Modifications_Ban.pdf
http://apps.pittsburghpa.gov/redtail/images/4413_Extreme_Risk_Protection_Orders.pdf

Rob- TOO LATE, VENEZUELANS WISH THEY HADN’T GIVEN UP THEIR GUNS.

As Former Darling of the Left State Venezuela continues to spiral into tribal feudality under its socialist dictator, President Maduro, some are bitterly regretting not opposing successive waves of gun banning.

In 2012, then president Hugo Chavez enacted the “Control of Arms, Munitions and Disarmament Law”, with the explicit aim of disarming all citizens. The law banned the legal sale of guns and ammunition to anyone other than government entities.

There was a month-long amnesty – which collected only thirty-seven guns – followed by forcible seizures of 12,500 firearms. In 2014 the government spent more than $47 million dollars enforcing the gun bans and making grand public demonstrations of firearm destructions. The penalty for selling a firearm now is 20 years in prison.

Pro-Democracy activists have taken to the streets, and since April 2017, 200 of them have been shot dead by government police. Government-backed local groups – called “collectivos” have been going on crime rampages – since 2015 there have been 28,000 murders.

Pro-democracy spokesmen said: “Venezuelans didn’t care enough about their firearms. The idea of having the means to protect your home was seen as only needed out in the fields. People never would have believed they needed to defend themselves against the government,”

“Venezuela shows the deadly peril when citizens are deprived of the means of resisting the depredations of a criminal government,” said David Kopel of Denver University.

Although the bill was sold to the population as a hardline effort to improve security, and sharply reduce crime, many now point to Venezuela as a case study for how gun prohibition can actually produce the opposite effect.

Well – does that sound familiar? It’s unlikely that there will be such violence here in the USA, but do you think that a total gun ban is likely to happen? Write and let us know. The address is onair at politics and guns dot com.

John – Authoritarian regimes always need an unarmed populace to succeed in controlling people. It was that way in the USSR, Nazi German, Red China, and the list goes on.

Grant – gun bans, leading to knife bans.. Etc…

Gary-

Grant

Gary

Rob- They have a fantasy ideology that is divorced from reality. Government makes you helpless and then says you need more government for protection. That is a protection racket.

Grant – how does boulder outlaw a state CCW permit?

SOURCES:

https://www.foxnews.com/world/venezuelans-regret-gun-prohibition-we-could-have-defended-ourselves

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Gun Quotes- It is not the function of the government to keep the citizen from falling into error;

it is the function of the citizen to keep the government from falling into error.

Supreme Court Justice Robert H. Jackson

Hang on everybody, we’ll be back with our guest (Charles Heller).

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3- Interview 1 Charles Heller- 520.870.2700

Radio personality and media spokesman for AzCDL

Tucson City Council to discuss gun dealer policy

Tucson can choose where to buy new firearms and police equipment.

Tucson PD has to sell used and confiscated firearms. They can choose where to sell them. The city council says they can set the terms of sale.

State preemption

Are they restricted to sell to the highest bidder in a sale and the lowest bidder in a purchase?

Sell to art dealers for scrap?

John- Tucson seems to be more left or Democratic than the rest of the state. Why is this?

Grant- well, not really, AZ elected a  D senator…

JOhn, will you close w charles? – ask him how people can link with then in Az

AZCDL.ORG

Yes

One minute

4- Interview 2

John- DGUs  (at beginning) These discussions are NOT legal advice. Some of us are trainers, but this is not formal training and YOU NEED formal training. The Defensive Gun Use segment is intended as information, NOT as training. As always the opinions of the hosts are only their own opinions and not those of any sponsors or other affiliations.

John – Tulsa, Oklahoma

Those ex-boyfriends are at it again. They still haven’t learned the meaning of no means no.

Last week, a 42 year-old ex-boyfriend went to the ex-girlfriend’s apartment.  They had been broken up for a while but he was trying to get back together with her.

He pressured her to allow him to spend the night on her couch.

At 7 AM, police were dispatched to the apartment in response to a domestic shooting call.

The woman told law enforcement that while she was getting out of the shower, the ex attempted to sexually assault her.  During the struggle, she was able to retrieve a firearm and shoot him several times.

She told police that he continued his assault while she was getting her gun.

Witnesses reported hearing a woman’s screams and then gunshots.  The woman had several marks on her face and disclosed the sexual assault while speaking with a nurse after the shooting.

He was transported to the hospital where he succumbed to his wounds five days later.

Authorities did not anticipate any arrests or charges but she may still be interviewed by homicide detectives.

https://www.tulsaworld.com/news/local/man-dies-after-ex-girlfriend-shoots-him-during-alleged-sexual/article_91158b95-fb45-5481-b667-477fa4b4e6fc.html

Grant – don’t bring an ex boyfriend to your sofa….

Rob- Don’t be that guy or that gal.

Grant

Rob

Grant – Moon Township, Pennsylvania

We always like the thugs who don’t take our advice about taking a knife to a gunfight.

This 34 year old thug was taken to the hospital after he was found outside a CVS pharmacy in Carnegie, on the south side of Pittsburgh.  The suspect was taken at about 11:45 PM and had told law enforcement that he had been robbed at gunpoint.

An hour earlier, a 48 year-old Moon Township man had called 911 to report that he had been stabbed by another man and had fired a gun at the person.  He was transported to the hospital where he died from the stab wounds.

Shortly afterwards, Carnegie police responded to the CVS parking lot where our hapless thug was found with a gunshot wound to the arm.

Police later determined that the suspect was the person they were seeking in the stabbing of the moon township man.

It appears that he went to the residence to confront the victim, possibly about a romantic relationship he was having with a female that they were both acquainted with.

The thug will be taken to Allegheny County Jail upon his release from the hospital.

https://www.wtae.com/article/man-stabbed-and-killed-in-moon-township/25465886

Gary- Houston, Texas

A man and his nephew were arguing inside the uncle’s home recently when it turned to a DGU.

The fight started over the phone and ended when the nephew arrived at the home.

The two exchanged threats and then the uncle followed the nephew into his bedroom.

The uncle reported to investigators that he feared for his life and that is why he shot his nephew in the leg.

The nephew’s girlfriend took him to the hospital where he died.

He had recently moved in with his uncle and aunt but they were in the process of making him leave.  The uncle is being questioned and is cooperating.

The nephew was a safety on the Fort Bend Marshall High School football team which was to play a semi-final football game two days later.  Their opponent in that game had announced that they would put his #3 on their helmets.

https://abc13.com/police-uncle-claims-self-defense-for-fatally-shooting-nephew/4877358/

Rob- Metairie, Louisiana

A 27 year-old woman called police just before 9 PM to report that she had shot her husband in their home.

When Jefferson Parrish Sheriff’s officers arrived, they found that the 27 year-old husband had been shot multiple times.  He died where he lay. They took her into custody and took her to the agency’s detective bureau to be questioned.

The wife was cooperating and provided a detailed and well-documented history of physical and psychological abuse.

Although she had not called law enforcement or had discussed the abuse with family or friends, she was able to provide enough corroborating evidence to back up her statements.

She said that he had beaten her and attempted to strangle her before she shot him.  She feared the years of abuse would culminate in her death.

The Sheriff’s Office said that the woman “displayed multiple physical injuries that corroborated her account” of a justifiable killing in self-defense.

The Sheriff’s office will forward their findings to the Jefferson Parish District Attorney’s office, which will decide whether to file criminal charges.

https://www.theadvocate.com/new_orleans/news/crime_police/article_66f3d97c-fb0f-11e8-bf89-3b62a7dc2f0f.html

Rob-

We post each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com  Please take a minute and share them with a friend.

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6- E-mail, blog notes, and show close

John- intro

Listener e-mail discussion

Grant -This is from Matthew

Hey all,
Just wanted to ask if you can readdress “universal” background checks, and what exactly that means. Not just for me, but for other listeners. To me it sounds like a vague name the same way “gun violence”  is a vague term that infers one thing, but depending on whom is counting statistics, means something very different. Anyway, one other thing, Ohio allows face to face private sales, so there are some smaller gun sales at a local flea market that are done in that manner, not just a gun store who sets up a table and runs it like a satellite of their store. However, many of the major gun shows I’ve heard that is the case and they do background checks. That said, there are a great amount of buy/sell/trades that occur in the parking lot, which again, in ohio is legal. Wasn’t it proven that none of the mass shootings used “gun show loopholes”?  Also none of the mass-shooters were NRA members..
Love the show, keep up the good work!
Gary-

Rob-


Gary- This is from Carl

Listening to #473. Would Graham Grant talk about purchasing airguns and slingshots in New Jersey?  What happens in New Jersey, does not stay in New Jersey.

Also, have you seen the recent news where the mayor of Pittsburgh, PA wants to confiscate firearms?

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2018/12/16/pittsburgh-mayor-pushes-firearm-confiscation-orders-gun-magazine-bans/

As is aptly and logically pointed out in the article, his intentions will make his city more dangerous. When or if this happens he will not be held accountable. When will these fools stop their actions, and be more mindful of the safety of the citizens of the locations they represent?  My crystal ball is broken, so I do not know the answer to the question.

Carl-

Gary-

John – For Carl https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ieWrWLjii0

John: Rob, do you have any new posts from your SlowFacts blog you want to mention?

Rob-

We can pass laws that makes us feel better, but what should we do when these feel-good laws get us and our children killed? We disarmed the staff at school.  We disarmed the flock and the shepherd at church, and we disarmed the designated defender at the bar. That didn’t turn out the way we wanted. The article is called ‘Feel-Good Laws are Getting Us Killed”

My articles are up at Clash Daily, at Ammoland and at my blog, slow facts dot wordpress dot com.  John, tell us what’s new at your blog no lawyers only guns and money.

John – I have two posts I want to highlight. You may remember Operation Fast and Furious where the ATF helped the Mexican drug cartels walk guns to Mexico in order to build support for gun control. The head of the Sinoloa cartel, Joaquin Guzman or El Chapo, is on trial in NY and wants to bring it up in his defense since one of the charges against him involves firearms.  The US government is objecting to it saying it would confuse jurors. Actually, it might raise questions they don’t want to answer. The other post that I want to highlight is the gun control wish list released by Giffords. It has everything from gun and mag bans to red flag laws to government money for so-called smart guns and then some. They have shown their hand so it is time to push your Republican senators about not caving.

That and more is at only guns and money dot blogspot dot com.

Facebook listeners group – PSP Listeners

John: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast.  I’d like to thank Charles Heller for joining us today. So for Amy, Tracy, Belle, Dana, Douglas, Gary, John, Rachel, Susan, Grant and Rob,

(Paul, stop talking now)

Rob: Until the next time…

Gary: stay safe,

Grant: be aware,

John: and we’ll see you down the road.