Episode 454 – Rachel Malone


Paul: Welcome to the polite society podcast powered by the Firearms Policy Coalition recorded on Monday, July 9th, 2018 I’m Paul Lathrop

Rob: I’m Rob Morse and on tonight’s show we welcome back Rachel Malone!

John: I’m John Richardson, and we’ll talk about video showing Las Vegas Metro Officers freezing rather than stopping the Mandalay Bay shooter.

Belle: I’m Belle McCormack, and we’ll talk about Idaho getting a stand your ground law

Rachel: I’m Rachel Malone, and we’ll talk about Red Flag proposals in Texas.

Gary: I’m Gary Daugherty and in one of our DGUs a no shots fired DGU comes out of Milwaukee. So climb aboard.

Rachel: strap in

John : and hang on!

Paul:  episode 454 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.

Show intro music.

Personal news from each participant (when you are done with your segment please ask the next person what has been up with them)

Rob- Bill Frady and I talked about Self-Defense Gun Stories. That was on his Lock and Load Radio program. I also recorded another Episode of Self-Defense Gun Stories.

I got in some dry practice for my faster class. I have a room at GRPC.

John- A few episodes ago I asked our listeners if they could point me to a cheap Savage 110 rifle in .30-06. Well, I found it at an auction site and got it for a fraction of retail because the auctioneers read 111 as 3. This will be a project gun as I want to rebarrel it in .257 Ackley Improved and replace the plastic stock. I had thought about using wood from a maple tree I’m having cut down but I don’t have 10 years for the wood to age!

I bought my plane ticket and reserved my room for GRPC.


Belle- Spent the weekend before the holiday getting run thru the ringer by Chuck Taylor, then spent this weekend just past taking Zack Campbell’s IDPA Bootcamp with my oldest son. 2000+ rounds later, I’m feeling ready for the next few weeks. I get to hang out with Paul and Susan at MAG and our ASIC. Then TAC CON! Yikes:-)

Rachel- Lost a job, got a job. Went to Wisconsin and back for MAG-180 (shooting alongside Tracy and Dr. John Edeen!) Braved driving to Chicago because it was worth it to see Gary and Sherry, headed to Oklahoma for a run n gun this weekend! Working on fighting gun control measures….yes, in Texas. Show up to the hearing on July 24 if you can! I still need to make travel plans for GRPC, but I’ll be there!

Paul/Susan ordered ammo to be shipped to FAS for the upcoming classes. Home today, deliver tomorrow night then off until after we are back. I will not be on the next 2 shows as we are spending time with family next monday and we are taking a day off the following monday between MAG 40 and FAS/PSP Active Shooter Interdiction and I am hoping to get some rifle time in at the range and hang with some of the best people in the world!

Promo about upcoming training classes here.

PATCHES: We still have some PSP patches left. They are $10 for 1 or $18 for two with all proceeds going to the Second Amendment Foundation. You can send PayPal to john@politicsandguns.com or, if you want to send a check, send me an email at the address and I’ll tell you where to mail it.

Ask listeners to listen to other shows on the network, name at least 2 shows.


2- News


Another Year of Campus Carry..Yawn

Well, that was dull. Another year went by and legally licensed concealed carry holders were armed on post-secondary schools across the country. We were told that drunk and drugged-up students who had a carry permit would kill each other over parking places. Critics said that faculty would be shot down in the classroom for teaching unpopular courses. It never happened. It turns out that your average gun owner remains extraordinarily level-headed even when he comes on campus. Who knew?!

Georgia’s campus carry law took effect in July of last year. I checked, and the fresh wave of aggravated murder on campus by licensed concealed carry holders didn’t put an uptick in the budget for emergency medical services. Nothing happened, and newspaper editors across Georgia were shocked.

Kansas started last year as well. Given how flat Kansas is, we were told that the river of blood would overflow the state’s borders. Turns out the rivers never turned red..or even pink.

Campus carry was legal for junior colleges in Texas as of August of last year. It has been two years for Texas Universities and Colleges. You remember reading about all that death and destruction at post secondary schools? Texas has hundreds of technical schools, junior colleges, colleges and universities.  Texas also has 1.2 million permit holders who have been on campus.. and we never noticed.

Maybe a few years isn’t enough time for us to see meaningful results. Perhaps the tidal wave of on-campus carnage simply takes years to build up. We can look at real results rather than spin fantasies. 10 states allow licensed concealed carry on campus, though some states require additional training. An additional 23 states let the governing board of each institution set their own policy. That gives us many lifetimes of experience so we should have seen something by now. Colorado and Utah had campus carry for the last 14 years.. and nothing.

You noticed which states banned concealed carry because of the constant flow of blood and news articles documenting attacks by licensed gun owners on campus? No, me neither.

It wasn’t blood spilled on campus, but ink spilled by newspapers predicting a holocaust. The only thing murdered was the truth as the news media deliberately ignored that mass-murderers choose gun-free zones.

Please remember the media’s terrible record the next time a reporter offers up his fantasy about armed america..

  ..and happy anniversary to campus carry.

John – One of Pres Trump’s potential nominees Allison Eid wrote the decision of the CO Sup Ct allowing campus carry on the U of CO campus.




Listeners, you’ll have heard us commenting occasionally that it’s taking some time to get information about the response to the notorious Mandalay Bay hotel murders in Las Vegas. The murderer shot down on the audience at a concert using multiple firearms and triggering the call for a ban on bump stocks.

A recent video release may provide part of the answer for the delay. The video shows that the first Las Vegas Metro Police office on the scene, Cordell Hendrex, froze in place one floor below the room the murderer was using. In so doing, he kept hotel security staff from responding, and also held back a new officer-in training. By failing to confront the murderer, Officer Hendrex allowed the shooting to continue.

In an interview regarding his actions, Officer Hendrex said, “I said a prayer for all of us in the elevator. I could tell that the shooting was coming from the floor above us. I know I hesitated and remember being terrified with fear and I think that I froze right there in the middle of the hall, for how long I can’t say.”

His body cam video recorded him as saying “Holy S—. That’s rapid fire” as he remained on floor below.

A retired Las Vegas Metro Police Officer commented on the footage, “.. it’s really disturbing.. to see that he just froze..was so frightened that he didn’t do anything.. and not only him, but no one else acted since they were waiting for his lead.”

The trainee, Officer Vardin, reported that “..the team “posted up” in the stairwell between floors 31 and 32 to “contain the area and wait until SWAT arrived.”

Listeners, you’ll be aware of the painful similarities with the circumstances surrounding Broward County Sheriff’s Department staff in the recent Parklands school murders.

Paul – While there is likely nothing at all that the average concealed carrier could have done from the ground however this points out that WE ARE ON OUR OWN.

Gary –




Listeners, some of you may not be aware that it is actually legal for us here in the USA to manufacture our own firearms. When we do this, the resulting guns do not need to be serialized, and do not need to be registered with the police. However, it is *illegal* to sell or distribute them.

Most often, people do this by buying and finishing a so-called “80-percent lower (receiver)”, and then complete the gun with parts freely available in retail stores and on-line. It is these finished unserialized firearms that are referred to as “ghost-guns” by the media and by left-leaning politicians.

Now, LAPD have revealed the results of a 6-month operation where they have recovered a “small arsenal” of 45 of these unserialized guns from gangs round LA. The recovery of both AR-15-style rifles and semi-auto pistols was disclosed.

ATF Special Agent Bill Mullen said “Criminals are making their own weapons because they cannot buy them legally … or they are paying other people to make those guns for them to get around the gun laws. “This is a trend among Southern California gangs.” Investigators claimed that those prohibited from buying a complete firearm, such as felons, can still purchase an 80% lower, and complete their own, illegal, firearm.

LAPD commander Blake Chow said that the investigation recovered manufacturing equipment, and a line of supply that resembled a “fast food restaurant for guns”. A total of 47 felony charges have been filed.

Listeners, it surely won’t be long before the Bloomberg Red Shirts and Dems in general begin to campaign for the abolition of this right from you, the responsible gun owner. They are coming for your guns.

Paul – I have heard of people making AK receivers out of shovels. You cannot totally ban guns. A resourceful person will make them.

John – You merely see what the gunsmiths do in Pakistan adjoining Afghanistan.

Rachel – gun control is based on the false premise that evil can be eliminated.

Rob- and that criminals obey gun laws. What idiot thinks that?






Shortly after the Santa Fe, TX school shooting in May, Governor Abbott released a 44-page document titled “SCHOOL AND FIREARM SAFETY ACTION PLAN.” Proposals are listed under main headings such as “Making Schools Safer,” “Preventing Threats in Advance,” and “Enhancing Firearms Safety.”

Notably missing from the document is any mention of simply eliminating gun-free zones in schools, which would give teachers, parents, and volunteers who already are licensed to carry firearms the ability to carry those firearms inside a school.

Prominently featured were “Red Flag’ laws similar to what have been proposed (and passed) in other states. Governor Abbott claims that these would strictly adhere to due process. However, the proposal would allow law enforcement, a family member, school employee, or a district attorney to file a petition seeking the removal of firearms from a person somehow proven to be dangerous to himself or to others (no standard is given – sounds like a subjective opinion). The courts would then provide that person notice and a hearing, and upon finding that they pose a significant risk of danger to themselves or others the court would order law enforcement to take possession of firearms.

Even though the legislature is not in session, they are holding “interim hearings” to study various topics in preparation for the session which begins in January. The House of Representatives already held a hearing on the Red Flag proposals in June, and the Senate will hold theirs on July 24.

Moms Demand Action had a field day showing up to support the proposals on the first go-around. Anyone seeing any red flags here?

Rob- Since when do we strip Constitutional rights because of a suspicion that someone might misuse it in the future?

Possible Comment- Our justice system is supposed to prosecute and punish people who have broken an actual law, not those who are thought to be likely to commit a crime in the future.

Paul- Just think about the potential for abuse. A vengeful relative who dislikes guns could report someone’s gun ownership with a personal opinion that they are unfit to own guns. A peaceful citizen with odd, harmless habits could be reported as “dangerous” and be investigated and threatened with confiscation of firearms.

John – If the person is actually so dangerous, why are they on the streets? Wouldn’t you try to have them committed to a mental institution instead to get the help they really need?


Rachel- distinction between this proposal and other states. This is touted as “due process” since the accused is notified of the hearing and allowed to defend themselves. But…..they are still summoned to court WITHOUT probable cause of a crime having committed, AND guns could be taken away AGAIN without probable cause of a crime having been committed — just on an “educated guess” that the person might be a risk in the future.

Check texasfirearmsfreedom.com for hearing info and phone numbers to call.



Idaho senate bill 1313 went into effect on July 1st. This bill, now law, consolidated and codified the  right to stand your ground for the purpose of self defence in Idaho.

The law also clarifies that a person has the right to defend themselves against intruders to their home or business, without having to demonstrate that they feared an imminent threat to their life. The law now states that the act of forcible entry alone is sufficient for a person to reasonably assume the threat of death or grave bodily harm, allowing them to use lethal force in response.

An Idahoans’ home is now their castle.

Paul – This is great news for a great state.



Gun Quotes- The bill of rights isn’t about us, it’s about them.  It isn’t a list of thing we’re permitted to do. It’s a list of things THEY aren’t allowed to even consider.  L. Neil Smith

Hang on everybody, we’ll be back with our guest (Name).


3- Interview 1 Rachel Malone

Texas- How do I love thee? Let me count the 44 pages.

4- Interview 2

5- DGUs  (at beginning) These discussions are NOT legal advice. Some of us are trainers, but this is not formal training and YOU NEED formal training. The Defensive Gun Use segment is intended as information, NOT as training. As always the opinions of the hosts are only their own opinions and not those of any sponsors or other affiliations.

We post each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com  Please take a minute and share them with a friend.




WE all have done it.. it’ll just take a minute… and you decide to leave the kids in the car while you go into the store.

Well when this Dallas mom made that decision, her decision got a lot more frightening.

The mom stopped for gas at 10pm on Independence Day. She went in to pay and buy something from the convenience store, but when she returned she saw a man jumping into her car. Just as he was about to pull off with her two children (aged 2 and 4), she managed to get into the backseat of the car.

She demanded that he pull over, but he did not. Instead, he turned and looked at her, surprised that she had been able to get into the car. This gave her the opportunity she needed to reach between the seats, grab her gun from the glove compartment and shoot the carjacker in the head.

The car crashed into a pole. Neither the woman nor her children were hurt. The woman was questioned at the scene and was released. It’s unlikely she will face any charges.


Rachel: I’m glad she didn’t leave her gun at home or locked up in the trunk. I’m glad she had a momma bear fighter’s instinct to protect her kids against all odds. I’m glad that the bad guy had terrible situational awareness and reaction that allowed her to get in the car, access her gun, and stop the threat. I really hate pointing the finger at someone who successfully saved her life and her kids’ lives – for that, she is a hero. But Tracy and I were talking the other night about how we must use this as a teachable moment. Thoughts, anyone?

John – Shannon Watts claims the mom had tried to fire a warning shot and didn’t mean to hit him in the head. Really?

Rob- Let’s look at what she should have done. Lock the car. Have your gun on your body.

Paul – PLEASE POGO. What if he would have been able to drive off with the kids AND GUN?

Rob- sliders!



Listeners.. you’ve heard us say “POGO – Pants On, Gun On” and you may have heard Mark Walters of Armed American Radio say “Never leave your cave without your club”. Well, when it all works perfectly, the bad guy has a really bad day.

In this classic DGU from May 31st 2017,  hapless criminal tried to rob a convenience store where four off-duty police officers were shopping.

The suspect entered the store and produced a handgun. He was immediately shot by one of the officers and when he reached for the gun again, the other three officers shot him too.

Sometimes, you just can’t catch a break…

Rob- Sweet. Cleanup on aisle 3.





After a successful carjacking in El Paso County in Colorado, a man decided to drive the stolen car into Pike National Forest. For extra fun, our hero decided to shoot randomly at cars and other vehicles along the route.

Eventually, he stopped at a campground and, with his rifle once again ready to go, approached a camper van with it. However, there was one flaw in the master plan of our criminal genius – he had not considered that people who camp in Colorado’s forests are likely to be armed.

When he saw our hero approaching his camper van, the spoilsport occupant, who clearly lacked a sense of fun, opened fire, wounding the man and allowing the Manitou Springs Police Department to capture him.

The perpetrator is in hospital suffering the effects of multiple gunshots, and is stable. No-one else was injured.


Rob- Toxicology tech to room 7.

Paul – I would say that you NEED to be armed in any wilderness situation

John – As a reminder, even a tent is considered your castle and dwelling for self-defense purposes.



Sometimes the sight of a gun in the hands of a determined CCW holder is enough.

The George Webb restaurant in downtown Milwaukee was the scene of a defensive firearm use that resolved the situation with no shots fired.

When an employee entered the George Webb restaurant in Milwaukee, she was followed by a regular customer, who was cursing and swearing. The man had been complaining of poor service and demanding that his bill be refunded. When the server – our victim – refused, the man followed her behind the scenes at the restaurant and punched her repeatedly around the head and face.

When he continued to attack the server, another waitress pulled her CCW firearm and pointed it at the man until he eventually backed off.

The man escaped, but Milwaukee police know his identity. The victim is now back at work. The restaurant allows its workers to carry defensive firearms so long as they are properly permitted.

Listeners, this is one of the DGUs that never makes national news, no one got shot, the situation was resolved and the left’s agenda was not triggered.




John –




6- E-mail, blog notes, and show close

Listener e-mail discussion

Rob- Matt sends in our only email this week.

Hey Paul and friends!  

What are your thoughts on the safety benefits of a back strap safety and take-down process of the Springfield XDM?

On most handguns carried for self-defense, holstering and cleaning are the most dangerous things you can do.  The XDM can be held and holstered without engaging the back-strap safety release. I have carried it this way for years and feel much more confident of my safety when holstering the firearm with one in the chamber.

When you field strip most pistols, you have to pull the trigger to release the slide causing many negligent discharges but the XDM doesn’t require the trigger pull on take-down.  I understand we should clear our firearms prior to cleaning but, as Massad Ayoob’s recent ND at his training course shows, even the best of us can fail to completely clear the firearm properly.  (BTW, his is the best blog on the internet)

Why do more firearms instructors and police departments not recognize the immense benefit of these features on the XDM?  I understand that these safety features make the firearm more complicated and complications affect reliability, but as Mas says, “I don’t have any ego investment in the Springfield XDM; I do have some logic invested in the fact that it’s an excellent self-defense handgun.”

On another note, I know you guys want to reach out to new shooters and I’m sure this podcast is a great way to do that, but please know that you provide a valuable show to the “choir” as well.  Please keep on preaching and thanks for all you do!


Scottsburg, Indiana

Rachel: my opinion is simple. I think the XD’s added safety features are a definite plus. I also believe that you should never put your trust in gun safety features — we always must practice safe gun handling no matter what. I also do happen to love the XD’s and XDM’s for lots of reasons. Glad to hear you do too!

Paul – I want to say that Rob and John have blogs that are at least as good as Mas’s blog. I am NOT a fan of external safeties of any kind

Rob- I like the XDM. I don’t think the grip safety adds anything..and I used to drive a 1911.

Paul: Rob, do you have any new posts from your SlowFacts blog you want to mention?

Rob- Class Review- Fighting Pistol at Tactical Response

Another Year of Campus Carry..Yawn

My articles are up at Clash Daily, at Ammoland and at my blog, slow facts dot wordpress dot com.  John, tell us what’s new at your blog no lawyers only guns and money.

I have posted Parts 3 through 5 of my mini-bios of the potential Supreme Court nominees. Of course, by the time this episode airs we will know the nominee. In a bit of history for Independence Day I reposted my annual post about the Mecklenburg Declaration and Resolves. These historical documents preceded the Declaration of Independence by over a year and the date of the Mecklenburg Declaration is featured on the North Carolina State Flag. It is why the North Carolina license plates say, “First in Freedom”.

That and more is at only guns and money dot blogspot dot com.

Facebook listeners group

Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast.  I’d like to thank (RAchel?) for joining us today. So for Amy, Tracy, Belle, Dana, Douglas, Gary, John, Rachel, Susan, Grant and Rob,

(Paul, stop talking now)

Rob: Until the next time…

Gary: stay safe,

Rachel: be aware,

John: and we’ll see you down the road.