Episode 277 – Frank Fiamingo and Ebola Prepping

Paul: Welcome to the polite society podcast recorded live on Sunday October 19, 2014. I’m Paul Lathrop

John: I’m John Richardson, and we’ll talk with Frank Fiamingo of NJ2AS

Gary D: I’m Gary Daugherty and I think Cook County, IL is trying to create a gun registry

Gary: I’m Gary Harpster and we have a discussion about gas masks and surgical masks

Gary D: so climb aboard

John: strap in

Gary H: and hang on!

Paul: Episode 277 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.

Show intro music.

Seg 1- Personal news from each participant

John – I spent yesterday morning at a gun auction. It was the auction of a guy’s accumulated gun collection. It was mostly hunting guns. The thing I found most interesting is what people would bid up. For example, a Chinese SKS that reputedly was a Vietnam War bring-back with no proof or documentation went for $900. I could see this with proof but otherwise it is just another Norinco SKS that should have sold for $3-400.

Paul – Not much gun related. No recent donations to our GoFundMe page to get equipment for streaming GRPC 2015, but we still have about 11 months to go. I want to say a public thank you to both John and Gary D for making contributions. Lots of planning for next year. confirmed final plans for Citizen First Response with Chaz Murray, Ken Kowalski and Jon Hodoway. Also going to have Beyond Concealed Carry Enhanced and Cornered Cat classes next summer.  Add that to doing Shot Show this winter and GRPC next fall and trying to arrange going up to the great white north to do the Slam Fire Radio Charity shoot in June and it is looking to be a REALLY busy year next year.

Gary D. – I got to shoot the new guns, both very nice. Because they will eventually be PDFs I will shoot some PD ammo through them before the get put into service in that capacity. I wanted to do a quick follow up from the end of the last show. Rob and Rachel were talking about situational awareness and coincidently at around the same time I was talking to a student about exactly the same thing. This student has his permit but chooses not to carry, and I was explaining Jeff Cooper’s levels of awareness and how if we walk around in condition white we aren’t able to control the escalation of our awareness. We just get surprised by a bad guy and are thrown into condition black. If you are unfamiliar check out the link in the show notes, and be aware whether you are carrying or not.


advertisement ABN

Seg 2- News

John –Politico is reporting that in true Rahm Emanuel fashion a group of Democrats are using the current Ebola scare to try and push for confirmation of Dr. Vivek Murthy as Surgeon General. You may recall that Murthy has been held up in the past because of his rather extreme anti-gun views. The Democrats making the most noise about this are members of the house, and since the Senate confirms appointees we don’t have a lot to worry about on this subject right now, but we will keep an eye on it.

Paul comment – a surgeon general has recently been a cheerleader with no real power and as such wouldn’t help much with Ebola, and if the position ever got real power we definitely would have issues with someone like Murthy.

Paul – Shocking as it may sound, CNN actually ran a story illustrating a young shooter in a positive light. They profiled Shyanne Roberts, age 10, of Franklinville, NJ who is a 3-Gun and USPSA competitor. Last year, she was second highest woman in the New Jersey Ruger Rimfire Challenge. Shyanne started learning the rules of gun safety at age 5 from her dad Dan and began shooting at age 6. She says, “”I want to be an inspiration to other kids and be a leader. Kids and guns don’t always mean bad things happen.”

Gary D – Cook County, IL started a gun registry and I missed it.


Paul  -A few episodes back we mentioned that GOA hadn’t yet released their 2014 voter guide. Well it is out now. It seems to us  that it is a little late in the game for this to come out with the elections being just a few weeks out, and early voting already started in several states, but better late than never.

John – Comment – While I generally agree with the grades, it could be better organized. For example, in South Carolina which has both US Senate seats up for grabs, all the candidates are lumped together instead of by each contest.

Gary -We are mostly pro law enforcement here, and actively look for places to promote positive police stories, and it could be said that when speaking of the rank and file officers of the Asheville NC police department that that is the case here. wlos.com is reporting that 44 of the rank and file officers have signed a petition that states they believe that their chief should step down immediately. There are allegations of corruption as well as complaints about short staffing and mandatory overtime.

John – I live in the Asheville area. Chief William Anderson doesn’t take responsibility for when things go wrong. An example recently was a number of radar guns having outdated certification which led to dismissal of a number of speeding tickets. Anderson denied knowing about it which is either a failure of communication or a failure of management.

John -While the last story was about average cops doing the right thing, the next story comes right out of the you have got to be kidding me department. A 5 year old in Alabama was kicked out of class and was forced to sign a contract stating that she will tell an adult before she commits suicide or murders someone. Her offense – holding a crayon and stating “pew pew.” The girl’s mother was understandably outraged and infuriated when the 5 year old was forced to sign the contract without her parent’s knowledge or consent.

Paul comment – in most states a contract signed by someone under 18 years old is unenforceable. In a few instances the person requiring the signature can face criminal penalties.

Gary –MyFoxDC is reporting that DC police chief Cathy Lanier thinks that people who have a carry permit should be able to be arrested without warning if they are carrying in the area of a Presidential motorcade. She thinks that a policemen giving a warning and asking the person to leave the area is too large a burden. “The fact that the event is a gun-free event and is both posted and advertised should be sufficient notice,” she said. She also stated that it was difficult to provide advance notice of motorcades carrying dignitaries through city streets and said it was reasonable for gun owners in the vicinity of such events to be personally warned.

John -Miguel over at the Gun Free Zone Blog had a post this week discussing the story that South Carolina prosecutors are no longer allowing the victims of domestic violence to use the “stand your ground” defense.  Here is a quote from that post from a South Carolina prosecutor. “(The Legislature’s) intent … was to provide law-abiding citizens greater protections from external threats in the form of intruders and attackers,” prosecutor Culver Kidd told the Post and Courier. “We believe that applying the statute so that its reach into our homes and personal relationships is inconsistent with (its) wording and intent.”  So now you have a law that protects you in your home… except when it doesn’t.  Also you can defend yourself… except when you can’t.

Paul (I REALLY want to do this story) – long time listeners to the show know that I have had my issues with Robert Farago and The Truth About Guns. However the story that he posted Thursday has a lot  of people up in arms. The police chief of Watervliet NY (water FLEET) is asking for Facebook usernames AND PASSWORDS in pistol permit applications. Robert called the police department and had a conversation with Chief Ron Boisvert. The following is directly from the post

The Chief told TTAG that the sheet shouldn’t have been in the application packet – and won’t be in future. “It’s for internal use only,” he said.

Yes, well, the Chief said he uses the form to gather the applicant’s Facebook deets during a face-to-face interview. Why make note of the password? “We don’t,” he insisted. “We ask the applicant to log on to Facebook in front of us.” So the Chief scrolls through the applicant’s Facebook page searching for . . . ?

“Pages they’re looked at, friends – anything that reflects on the character of the applicant.” I pointed out that there’s a big difference [in terms of privacy] between viewing a Facebook page as a friend and viewing it as the owner. The Chief wasn’t bothered by the distinction.

When I pointed out that checking someone’s Facebook page (in front of them no less) was unnecessary, unfair and unconstitutional, the Chief said “I’m just the middleman here” and “it is what it is.” He said the information gets sent to a Superior Court judge who makes the final decision. The Facebook search is, in fact, the judiciary’s idea. I mean, requirement.

I asked the Chief what would happen if someone refused to log on to their Facebook account. “I’d just note the fact and send it to the Judges.”

Gun Quotes

Paul – We put out a post asking for gun quotes this morning on our Facebook page and we got a LOT of them. So many of them are good so we will be using them over the next several shows. Today’s quote was submitted by Kathy Jackson, (yes THAT Kathy Jackson)  “The way you get shot by a concealed weapons permit holder is you point a gun at him.” – Spartanburg County Sheriff Chuck Wright

Hang on everybody, Our interview with Frank Fiamingo is up right after this.

advertisement Concealment Solutions

Segment 3 Interviews

Frank Fiamingo – President NJ2AS

Segment 4 DGUs

Paul – Our first DGU comes from a Montana newspaper and we just LOVE the headline: Failed fumbler fears fleeing

Quoting directly from the article

ROLLINS – It appears alleged burglar Cole J. Johnson was more afraid of the neighbor holding a loaded gun on him than he was of the four cops who showed up to arrest him.

Under the barrel of his neighbor, Johnson, 20, of Lake County, remained still, caught in the act of burglarizing a Rollins-area home in North County. But when the police arrived, Lake County Undersheriff Dan Yonkin said Johnson tried to run.

The incident started about 10 p.m., Oct. 9, when a woman called 9-1-1 to report that her husband and two sons went to her neighbor’s house with a loaded gun, interrupted an attempted burglary and were holding the suspect at gunpoint.

While three Lake County Sheriff’s deputies and a Montana Highway Patrol trooper responded to the scene, another neighbor called dispatch to report they heard gunfire. The first 911 caller suspected Johnson was highly intoxicated, according to the call.

Johnson hid in a dark place inside the house where the gun-toting neighbor could not see him, emergency dispatchers said. But the gun-toting neighbor already saw the broken window and knew he was hiding.

“Don’t move or I’ll shoot,” the neighbor said. According to Yonkin, the gun-holding neighbor was just trying to scare the failed burglar, shot a warning into the air and held him at gunpoint until cops arrived.

When officers arrived on scene they noted that Johnson was “very drunk,” and had an active warrant out for his arrest and he tried to flee when taken into custody, Yonkin said.

Johnson was cited for attempted burglary and felony criminal mischief and taken to CSKT Tribal Jail.

John -Two armed home invaders in Shawnee, Oklahoma ignored the security system sign, the motion sensors, and the alarm system when they broke into Frances and Cardell Banks’ home around 2:30am Wednesday morning. The elderly couple had lived there for 40 year. When one of the armed home invaders broke into their bedroom, pointed his shotgun at the couple, and told them to get on the floor, Mr. Banks responded “You get out of here.” He then shot the intruder in the chest. The intruder along with his accomplice then fled the house. Justin Ray Harjo, age 26,  was later found under a truck and taken to the OU Medical Center for emergency surgery. He is in the ICU is serious condition.

There is more to this story. According to Mr. Banks, he didn’t have any experience with firearms. “No! That’s my first time shooting a gun,” he said. His wife Frances said they bought the gun hoping to never need it, but now she’s glad it was there. Mr. Banks also said his gun jammed after the first shot.

Comment – The Banks were lucky.

Gary -A strange DGU came out of Lakeland Florida on Saturday. According to theledger.com Michael Thomas White trespassed on 2 properties on Saturday morning. At the second he encountered the homeowner. When she asked him to leave he brandished a 12 ½ inch double edged dagger. The homeowner then got her husband and his Mossberg 12ga shotgun.  When the husband asked him to leave White stated that his sister was a witch and had been burned at the stake on that property and therefore the property was his. He then threw the dagger, at which point the husband shot white in the arm. According to the article White started dancing around and flailing his arms, then exited the property.  He was found in a grocery store parking lot a few blocks away and was arrested and taken to the hospital with non life threatening injuries.

We have the links to each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com if you want to share them with a friend.


Segment 5 Show close

Listener e-mail discussion

Jacob sent in our first email

Last podcast you all had a wonderful debate about the trainer refusing to train Muslims.  I enjoyed listening to the responses, and like so many other times when listening to intelligent debate, I could appreciate the opinions expressed, even if I didn’t always agree.  I found myself often bringing up counterpoints in my head, only to hear someone bring the very same point up on-air, which was satisfying, to say the least.  One point was not brought up, so I felt I should say something about it.

It is definitely a reality that if you soak a crucifix in urine and try and call it “art,” you’ll get a “tsk-tsk” from the Christian community, whereas if you draw an image of Muhammed with a bomb under his turban you may very well have a firebombing at your house.  That said, someone (I don’t recall who) said that while it was only an extremist minority committing violence or terrorism, the rest of the Muslim world wasn’t protesting or condemning them publicly, which makes them complicit.  This would be true, if the media chose the very condemnations we’re looking for.  I remember recently reading a pretty cool point-by-point condemnation of ISIS in an open letter from over 100 Muslim clerics.  I’ve included a link to both the text, and a news article discussing it.



A few gems:

“10. It is forbidden in Islam to harm or mistreat in any way Christians or any ‘People of the Scripture’”

“13. It is forbidden in Islam to force people to convert”

“16. It is forbidden in Islam to enact legal punishments (hudud) without following the correct procedures that ensure justice and mercy.”

“17. It is forbidden in Islam to torture people”

About 9/11 – On the very day of the attack (or so this article indicates), American Muslims spoke out and condemned the attacks.


“American Muslims utterly condemn what are apparently vicious and cowardly acts of terrorism against innocent civilians. We join with all Americans in calling for the swift apprehension and punishment of the perpetrators. No political cause could ever be assisted by such immoral acts.”

It happens, but it appears it gets the same coverage in the American media that is given for attempted mass shootings stopped by CCW holders.  That is to say, not very much


Paul – Mike in NJ wrote in a brief email stating that Ah-Ha’s Take On Me was the best music video ever made, not Robert Palmer’s Addicted to Love. I emailed him back and stated that while Take On Me was likely in the top 10 it was not even close to the best ever… Must be something in New Jersey’s water. Bad gun laws and bad taste in music’ videos.


Greg in Bremerton emailed this in.


Your opinion, is this worthwhile?  You can answer in an Email or cover it on your next show.

Thanks for your time.

Greg, Bremerton


(DO NOT READ)The Polite Society download app is out on Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.

John do you want to mention anything off of your blog you would like to talk about? – NOTHING from ME.

(DO NOT READ)Look at the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.  Subscribing from the link in our show notes helps Bob and Ben as well as helps us here at the Polite Society Podcast.

(DO NOT READ)Join your local civil rights group like the New Jersey Second Amendment Society, Arizona Citizens Defense League, Gun Owners of California, Commonwealth Second Amendment,  Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Florida Carry, Georgia Carry, Georgia Gun Owners, Grass Roots North Carolina, Illinois Carry, Maryland Shall Issue,  Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry, and  Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.

There are Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance,  Nebraska Firearms Owners Association,   Citizens for a Safer New Jersey, New York State Rifle & Pistol Association,  Palmetto Concealed Carry, Open Carry Texas, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Virginia Open Carry,  West Virginia Citizens Defense League, wisconsingunowners.org, and Wyoming Gun Owners.

For our Canadian listeners, and their supporters, join the Canadian Shooting Sports Association and the Canadian National Firearms Association.  If YOUR state or local organization isn’t read each episode, then send us an email and we’ll add them!

Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast.  I’d like to thank (Guests) for joining us today.  co-hosts, will you be with us next time?  I’m looking forward to it.  Until the next time…

Paul : stay safe,

Gary D. : be aware,

John: and we’ll see you down the road.

Mention advertisers, ABN, Concealment Solutions, Crusader Weaponry and NJ2AS. Firearm Safety Institute