Episode 255 – The Palmer Decision

Introduction
“An armed society is a polite society.. and this is the Polite Society Podcast where we support and report on civilian self-defense.”
Paul: Welcome to the polite society podcast recorded live from ABN Army Surplus on Saturday, July 26th, 2014. I’m Paul Lathrop
Rachel: I’m Rachel Malone and on tonights show we’ll talk with Bob Mayne of the Handgun World Show about some training coming to Sioux Falls next spring.
John: I’m John Richardson, and we’ll talk about self-defense news
Rob: I’m Rob Morse and we have our weekly stories of defensive gun use
Rachel: so climb aboard
John: strap in
Rob: and hang on!
Paul: Episode 255 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.
Show intro music.

Seg 1- Personal news from each participant

Paul – Shout out to Jason at Concealment Solutions, Watching a trucker that was almost concealed carrying. Working to get the house set up for our new family members.

John – No range time since Wednesday but I did read an excellent article that would go along well with our DGUs. It was about “spot shooting” and how it could improve your shooting. Or as the author’s 83 year old father told a would be robber, do you want it in the teeth or the belly.

Rachel- I’ve been sitting here all week fondling gun parts and was super excited about sharing with y’all my new AR upgrade that was supposed to happen today. Unfortunately, I had a friend with a medical emergency and ended up spending last night at the ER and today taking care of kids. Some things take priority. The gun parts will just have to wait.

Rob- I had two hours of SIRT training on Friday, and a five hour IDPA competition this morning. You’d rather end on a strong stage.. but I didn’t. I was disappointed in my last stage after I had to restart because the afternoon wind blew the targets over. 🙁

Break

Segment 2- NEWS News_Partner_white

Paul-We have a bit of breaking news a few hours ago as we record this the US District Court for the District of Columbia struck down the complete ban of carry in Washington DC.  From Alan Gura’s blog, the court stated that “In light of Heller, McDonald, and their progeny, there is no longer any basis on which this Court can conclude that the District of Columbia’s total ban on the public carrying of ready-to-use handguns outside the home is constitutional under any level of scrutiny. Therefore, the Court finds that the District of Columbia’s complete ban on the carrying of handguns in public is unconstitutional.”

This is a MONSTER win. I don’t expect things to change overnight, but this is DEFINITELY a step in the right direction.

Comments – John – This case has dragged on for over 5 years. Alan Gura even went to the US Ct of Appeals twice seeking to get Judge Frederick Scullin to issue a decision one way or another. I agree that this is a fantastic win for gun rights and the right to carry in the Nation’s Capital. George Lyon, one of the plaintiffs, urged Mayor Vincent Gray and the City Council “to swiftly enact a concealed carry law”.

Rob- We will see how this plays out.  I have several friends in DC who should concealed carry.  It is bizarre that it took five years for the court to reach this decision.  That was a political delay, not a judicial one.

John – With election season starting to heat up after the primaries, the NRA Freedom Action Foundation has announced that Chuck Norris will be the honorary chairman of the Trigger the Vote campaign. This campaign seeks to make sure that gun owners and gun rights supporters are registered to vote. Even though voter registration has become ridiculously easy over the years, you still can’t vote unless you are registered.

Comments-?  Remember R Lee Earney and his get out the vote series?

Rob – The city of Kansas City, Missouri wants to ban open carry within its city limits.  Mayor Sly James – Sly is a great name for a politician, by the way – said, “the sight of open carry is something that people could find too intimidating.” The Missouri Legislature had passed a bill that would have prevented cities from prohibiting open carry by those with CCW licenses. As we recently reported, Gov. Jay Nixon (D-MO) vetoed that gun rights bill. The legislature will meet in September to try and override the veto.

Comments- Rachel(comment)- it’s up to Missouri gun owners to make open carry non-intimidating.

Break

Rachel – First Lady Michelle Obama was in Chicago on Thursday where, as listeners to the podcast know, we often speak about shootings and murders that happen despite their gun control laws. After decrying the role of money and special interests in politics, Mrs. Obama told attendees at a Democratic fundraiser who paid up to $20,000 a couple to attend to dig deep in their pockets. She said electing Democrats would put kids first and help eliminate gun violence (sic) in her hometown. She didn’t have anything to say about cracking down on the gangs who are behind most of the shootings in Chicago. Go figure.

Comments-Rob- is gun violence a fault or a feature of Chicago machine politics.

John – Boston Police Commissioner William Evans evidently didn’t get the message from Vice-President Joe Biden. That’s because he said in an interview with public radio WGBH that “For the most part, nobody in the city needs a shotgun. Nobody needs a rifle.” He was responding to a question about gun permits in Massachusetts. He, like too many police chiefs in the Bay State, want the ultimate authority to say who can or can’t exercise their Second Amendment rights. I seem to remember that it was a move by another person in authority in Boston that triggered a war. That person was General Gage in April 1775 and the war was the American Revolution.

Comments-?  Rob- an only one!

Rachel- I actually think I agree with the police commissioner, in a way. For the most part – most days – you don’t need a shotgun or rifle to defend yourself.  But you never know when you will.

Rob- It is an election year and some Colorado Representatives are now reading the poll numbers.  Colorado legislators felt that they could do anything they wanted once they were elected.  That was when they rammed through new gun control laws and before three Colorado Senators were removed from office.  Those gun control bills were actually pushed through by Democrats to keep guns away from those with criminal backgrounds.  The legislative research committee said that about 420,000 background checks each year would stop criminals from getting guns.  Democrats allocated $3 million to the state agency in charge of handling all the projected extra reviews and checks, the Colorado Bureau of Investigations.  A year later, and the agency’s only performed 13,600 reviews — roughly 7 percent of what was predicted.

“I’m going to be asking some questions because I want to be a good steward of our tax dollars,” said Democratic Rep. Rhonda Fields, who nonetheless stood by the law and expressed optimism with its future, AP reported.

Paul- The first recall in Colorado was of Senate Leader John Morse.  Morse also ran a ballot initiative to make it harder to recall legislators.  That effort couldn’t gather the signatures to make the ballot.  There was a separate ballot initiative that did gather enough signatures.  That measure was to ban concealed carry on campus.  After looking at more poll numbers, the backers decided NOT to put the campus carry ban bill on the ballot.

Rachel (comment)- Last episode, we interviewed Luke Wagner of Colorado 2nd Amendment Association. They’re a great example of regular citizens doing extraordinary work to significantly change their state for gun rights.

John – They still have elections.. even in Cook County, Illinois.  Chicago area residents will vote if Illinois should impose an assault weapons ban and universal background checks required sell anything firearm related.  Both are non binding referendum designed to provide political cover for democrat legislators.

Paul – Just to let you know that they don’t have a justice system in New Jersey.  Baltimore Ravens running back Ray Rice was not prosecuted after he knocked his fiancee unconscious in an Atlantic City casino.  Instead, Rice received a two game suspension from the NFL.  Contrast his treatment with Shaneen Allen who was a licensed firearms owners and tried to drive through New Jersey.  She is facing three years in jail for a felony weapons violation.. from the same prosecutor who diverted Ray Rice to family counseling.

Rachel- Gun Quotes
“A man’s rights rest in three boxes: the ballot box, the jury box, and the cartridge box.”
– Frederick Douglass

Break

Segment 4 DGUs

We have had multiple emails pointing us to tonight’s 1st DGU.

John – DOCTORS ARE known for saving lives – but rarely do they do it with a gun.

But that’s exactly what happened yesterday, authorities said, when a psychiatrist, Dr. Lee Silverman,  returned fire on a patient who had shot him in the head and had fatally shot a caseworker Theresa Hunt  at the Sister Marie Lenahan Mercy Wellness Center in Yeadon, Delaware County.

“Without a doubt, I believe the doctor saved lives,” Yeadon Police Chief Donald Molineux said. “If he [the doctor] wasn’t armed . . . this guy could have went out in the hallway and just walked down the offices until he ran out of ammunition.”

This DGU is making national news because it involved a doctor and a hospital. The psychotic patient involved had both a criminal record including firearm violations and a history of suicide attempts. How he obtained the pistol is not known but Pennsylvania has background checks on private sales of handguns.

Paul

Rachel- It is not incongruous for a doctor, one known for saving lives, to carry a gun. Those fighting for hospital carry should bookmark this story and pull it up as needed.

Rob- The hospital’s gun free zone was broken.  The doctor fixed it.  I wonder if the doc makes house-calls!  Please leave a comment at the hospital website to thank the doctor for saving lives.

Paul-

Listener John P ( not going to try to attempt the name it will get butchered) sent in this DGU story.

Reading straight from nbcconnecticut.com

Two brothers fought off and helped detain a 15-year-old armed intruder who tried to rob them early Wednesday morning in New London, police said.
A teen, wearing a hockey mask and carrying a knife and a loaded gun, invaded a home on Crystal Avenue just before 3 a.m. on Wednesday, according to police.
Richard and Kevin Dennis were asleep when the teen broke in, but woke up and acted quickly.
Richard went toward the teen.
“That’s when he hit me in the head with the gun. Then I picked him up and he started wailing on my back with the butt of the gun,” Richard said.
Kevin got a gun to help his brother, and told the teen to drop his weapon and stay still.
“I heard my brother say, ‘Kevin, I need help. He has a gun.’ When I heard that, (I) grabbed my gun and went flying through the door,” Kevin Dennis said.
The teen did drop his weapon.
“He dropped it the moment he saw me. I got mine. The fight was over. It was night and day,” Kevin Dennis said.
When police arrived, they arrested the intruder.
The teen was charged with home invasion, burglary, second-degree assault with a firearm, first-degree threatening and carrying a pistol without a permit. His name has not been released because of his age.The resident who was assaulted had minor injuries, but declined medical treatment, police said.

Rob- This was a 2:30 am burglary. I wonder about the toxicology report. This kid is lucky to be alive. Can you imagine if you saw an armed intruder in YOUR house? The homeowner showed a ton of restraint!

We have the links to each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com if you want to share them with a friend.

Advertisement NJ2AS
Tips and tricks

Advertisement
Segment 5 Show close

Listener e-mail discussion

Ken in Arizona sent a second email about Target
Paul,

After hearing you read my Target email on the podcast, and following Gary’s comments about a business has the right to “ban” guns on their private property, I felt a need to further explain my position.

I know that Target’s policy is only a request for people to not carry their firearms inside their stores, just as Chipotle and Starbucks have “requested” the same. I could still legally concealed-carry in their stores. However, we are in the fight of our lives to keep our Constitutionally protected rights. (Note that I didn’t say “Constitutional rights”, there’s a big difference. But I digress.)

For a business to not be in complete support of our rights and to try to appease the PC/gun-grabbing/anti-freedom/Progressive crowd, just isn’t good enough any more in this struggle. We are, indeed, in the fight of our lives, the fight for our lives, and to accept and support a business that isn’t 100% with us is supporting our adversaries, if not completely, then at least partially. And partial support is still support, and just no good any more.

We need strong voices who publicly, loudly, and firmly state their support of The Constitution, and not voices who appease, compromise, equivocate, and preach “feel-good” fantasies and “reasonable” policies that make everyone happy and are “inclusive”, “reasonable”, and “common sense”.

It’s time for Truth, Justice, and The American Way. We’ve reached the time when nothing short of that will do.

Regards,
Ken Silva
Phoenix, AZ

Here’s extra comment that you can ignore. It’s just how I got here.

PS I am new to this cause and new to firearms. Sandy Hook is what woke me up. Why didn’t anyone stop the madman, I wondered. It was only Sandy Hook when I learned about “gun-free zones”. The insanity of such a policy was immediately obvious and distressing. They are a perfect way to make more victims. I discovered the entire shooting community and the other side of gun-ownership and gun-rights that I never knew existed, being a product of the mainstream media for 60 years. My ignorance was profound. My education has been eye-opening and equally as profound. My disgust with our “leaders” and the “4th Estate” is huge, and growing every day with my ongoing education. Thank goodness for new media, the internet, podcasts such as yours, and the time I have in retirement to devote to these issues. Unfortunately, most Americans are as I was for all those years, too busy to stray outside the mainstream, and therefore, brainwashed to the agenda of the powerful and omni-present mainstream media.

I see this fight we are in as one fueled by ignorance. Once people become educated, we will be back on the right track. It only took me a couple of months to counteract 60 years of learned ignorance. But our media and our politicians are not about education, so I’m not hopeful that our struggle will be over any time soon. As a digression, look at Common Core. Teach all the kids from the same playbook, and you limit ideas outside that playbook.

As another digression, look at the recent illegal immigration being encouraged by Washington and The White House. What better voting block than millions of new voters who don’t even speak the language. That’s a pretty clever way of keeping the voters ignorant. It’s criminal what they are doing. Keep fighting! Preserve, protect, and defend, indeed!
(Gee, I sound pretty radical, even to myself! Well, so be it.)

PPS I hope you keep us informed on the new doggies.

Rachel- The Polite Society download app is out on Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.

John- Also please check out Kathy Jackson’s Cornered Cat training classes. Her next class that has seats available is September 13th and 14th in Culpepper Virginia. Also remember that in September is the couples class in Centerton Arkansas with Jon Hodoway.  Go to Cornered Cat dot com for more classes and details.

John- Rob, do you have any new posts from your SlowFacts blog you want to mention?

Rob- I do.  I live in San Diego.  San Diego Sheriff Bill Gore said he will protect us and we have no need to protect ourselves.  Somehow Sheriff Gore overlooked the thousand of crime victims in June.  As usual, most of the victims this month are unarmed and defenseless. Sheriff Bill Gore says he may not issue licenses to carry a concealed weapon for self-defense.  In contrast, many other California Sheriffs do exactly that.

Paul-? Look at the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.  Subscribing from the link in our show notes helps Bob and Ben as well as helps us here at the Polite Society Podcast.

Join your local civil rights group like the New Jersey Second Amendment Society, Arizona Citizens Defense League, Gun Owners of California, Commonwealth Second Amendment,  Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Florida Carry, Georgia Carry, Georgia Gun Owners, Grass Roots North Carolina, Illinois Carry, Maryland Shall Issue,  Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry, and  Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.

There are Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance,  Nebraska Firearms Owners Association,   Citizens for a Safer New Jersey,New York State Rifle & Pistol Association,  Open Carry Texas, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Virginia Open Carry,  West Virginia Citizens Defense League, wisconsingunowners.org, and Wyoming Gun Owners.

For our Canadian listeners, and their supporters, join the Canadian Shooting Sports Association and the Canadian National Firearms Association.  If YOUR state or local organization isn’t read each episode, then send us an email and we’ll add them!

Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast. Until the mid-week show…
Rob: stay safe,
Rachel: be aware,
John: and we’ll see you down the road.

Episode 254 – Kevin Starrett, Luke Wagner and Kyle Coplen

Introduction- “An armed society is a polite society.. and this is the Polite Society Podcast where we support and report on civilian self-defense.”
John: Welcome to the polite society podcast recorded live on Wednesday, July 23rd 2014. I’m John Richardson.
Rachel: I’m Rachel Malone and on tonights show we’ll talk with Kevin Starrett from the Oregon Firearms Federation.
I’m Rob Morse. We will talk with Luke Wagner of the Colorado Second Amendment Association.
Rachel: We have an update from Kyle Coplen of the Armed Citizen Project in addition to our usual news and DGUs, so climb aboard
John: strap in
Rob: and hang on!
Rachel: Episode 254 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.
Show intro music.

Seg 1- Personal news from each participant

John – I’ve missed the last two podcasts so I guess I have some catching up to do. Last Wednesday, I got to tour PTR Industries plant in Aynor, South Carolina. They make the PTR-91 rifle. It is the civilian version of the HK G-3. I was able to interview Chris Petersen of PTR for a later episode. I also got to shoot the PTR-32 Gen 1 Plus in 7.62×39. In other news, Barb and I got married. If you read my blog, you may have heard me refer to the Complementary Spouse. Barb is more than a complimentary spouse now.

Rachel- I’ve had a houseful this past week and have spent most of my time keeping meals rolling for all my guests and taking care of the kids, but still found some time for gunpowder and lead. Instructed an Appleseed shoot in Waco last Saturday because my kid dragged me (proud of that kid!) and one of the participants let me shoot his K31. Loved it. =)

Rob- Dry practice. Planning to shoot IDPA this Saturday

Break
advertisement ABN
Seg 2- NewsNews_Partner_white

Rob- Let’s start with some good news for the right of self-defense.  Philadelphia lost a large court case because they infringed on the rights of legal gun owners.  The city was ordered to pay 1.42 million dollars as well as the costs of administering the legal settlement.  The settlement runs to 11 pages.  Here are some of the highlights-

  • Philadelphia agrees not to disclose License to carry firearms applicant information either electronically or in-person.
  • The police department agrees to annual training for the License and Inspection Board of Review, and the Gun Permit Unit.
  • The city agreed to post a copy of the application process on their website.  This includes license applications and the appeals process.  The city must also submit a copy of the license appeals process to anyone who has their license denied or revoked.
  • The city no longer requires or contacts character references from license applicants.
  • The city will not ask if applicants already own a firearm.
  • The city will not confiscate a license or a firearm from a licensee unless there is probable cause that they are needed as evidence of a crime. If they are confiscated, then the officer must immediately provide a property receipt, which shall include the pertinent information for their return.

That is a good day for civil rights in Philadelphia.

The decision must irritate the Pennsylvania attorney general, and that is a good thing too.

Rachel- I don’t know the whole back story on this positive turn of events, but I know one thing: it happened because somebody got off the couch and did something.

Rachel-This last weekend, 40 people were shot and 4 were killed in the gun control paradise of Chicago.  Chicago politicians blame weak gun laws, but the real cause are the drug gangs who feed on social policies that resulted in broken families and economic policies that destroyed jobs.  Chicago politicians have company.

Rob- Weekend death toll in ny?  I called the new york deputy commissioner of public information and spoke to his office.  I also sent them an e-mail request for information about this weekend’s statistics.

John- This is an election year, so some ridiculous bills get passed and some reasonable bills never make it to a vote in committee.  A recent case is the rider to a congressional bill written by Representative Thomas Massie of Kentucky.  Massie is optimistic about Senate support for the language he attached that would dismantle the local gun laws in the District of Columbia.  The congressman is realistic enough to doubt the measure will ever reach the Senate floor for a vote.  Quote “Twenty rank-and-file Democrats in the House voted for the amendment, and I know Democrats in the Senate would vote for the amendment.. but I suspect Harry Reid will do everything he can to prevent that vote from happening.”  Senate majority leader Harry Reid did not respond to questions about Massie’s pro-gun proposal.  Neither did some of the vulnerable Democrat senators from conservative states, Senators such as Alaska’s Mark Begich, Louisiana’s Mary L. Landrieu, and NC’s Kay Hagan.  Massie’s amendment would likely have a Senate sponsor in Kentucky Republican Rand Paul.

Rachel- Here’s an issue that divides even strong gun rights supporters. A man open carrying a gun in a south Kansas City Walmart store alarmed shoppers early Monday.  Yes, shoppers were frightened even though open carry is legal.  A customer in the store called police to report the man.  The customer also reported the incident to the store manager. The store manager then asked the armed shopper to take his gun back to his car.  The gun owners was doing that when the police arrived. Kevin Jamison of the Western Missouri Shooters Alliance said that while open carry is legal, it doesn’t mean it’s always a good idea.

Rob- Friends, this is not how you convince the public that gun owners are trustworthy.  In fact, it is the opposite.  Your ounce of good intentions are outweighed by the ton of bad press.  Let me say this again.  It doesn’t matter how you see open carry; it matters how your audience sees open carry.  In the battle for hearts and minds, your audience gets a vote and you don’t, because it is their opinion we’re trying to change.

Rachel’s reply-  We are all ambassadors all the time.

John- The first Tuesday in August is almost here!  You might remember that Missouri Governor Jay Nixon vetoed a number of pro-gun bills after the legislative session passed.  There was also a proposed state constitutional amendment placed on the Missouri ballot.  The amendment added language protecting ammunition and accessories typical to the normal function of our firearms.  The amendment recently survived a challenge in the state supreme court, so Missouri voters may have a say in the right to bear arms after all.  The amendment gets voted on in the August 5th election.  Missouri gun owners, and their friends, get active.

Rachel- We reported several personal attacks at Target department stores since the company asked customers and staff to disarm.  Here is the first reported murder on Target property since their disarmament press release.  The disarmed victim was part of a night cleaning crew.  The victim was shot and transported to a local hospital where he died.  The assailant was a known gang member and later tested positive for being high on bath salts.

Rob- I hate it when a gun free zone fails and people die.

John – Beretta USA announced on Tuesday that they plan to move ALL production to their new plant in Tennessee. Previously, the new plant in Gallatin, TN was only intended for new production lines. Beretta USA said the reason for this was due to Maryland passing such draconian gun laws in 2013 and the anticipation that it will only get worse. The production of the Army’s M9 pistol will continue until all current orders are filled. They will be leaving their administrative, executive, and import offices in their Accokeek, Maryland location.

Rob- The polite society podcast is a little late in getting out the news, but I love giving credit when law enforcement gets it right.  In Ohio, the Union Township Police Department will host a Gun Safety Class for children from ages six through 13.  The two hour training class starts at 10 am on Saturday, July 19.  The class covers the nomenclature and safe handling of handguns, shotguns and rifles.  The class does not include any live fire training.  Donuts, juice and coffee will be provided.

Rachel- Gun Quotes
The gun control extremist has at least two things in common with the Islamic extremist. He has a willingness to die for his fundamental beliefs. And he has the sanctimony to demand that others go with him.” – Professor Mike Adams

Hang on everybody, we’ll be right back after this
advertisement Concealment Solutions

Segment 3 Interviews

  • News from Kyle Coplen at the Armed Citizen Project
  • Interview with Kevin Starrett from the Oregon Firearms Federation by skype at 5:30 pacific!
  • Interview with Luke Wagner from Colorado Second Amendment Association

Segment 4 DGUs

Rachel- Bad choices sometimes have a happy ending, but there might be more to this story.  This home break in occurred in Carrick, Pennsylvania.  It was 2AM when two men fired through the front door of an apartment building and forced their way inside.  A 19 year old man and a 17 year old woman were in the building at the time.  The intruders forced the man into side bedroom.. the side bedroom where the homeowner kept a loaded shotgun.  Both intruders were shot.  One died at the scene.  The second intruder fell down the steps and was taken to UPMC Mercy hospital. His condition is unknown.

Rob- I hear Rachel’s comment, carry or hope you are lucky and guess correctly.

John- Sometimes there is no good solution.  40 year old John Mapp attacked his 38 year old sister.  The crime took place around 3:40 AM in West Philadelphia.   Mapp then attacked his 34 year old younger brother.  The younger brother is a paraplegic, but he remained physically strong enough to pull out his handgun and protect himself.  He shot his older brother once in the chest.   The older man was taken by police to the Hospital of the University of Pennsylvania where he was pronounced dead. The sister was also taken to the same hospital for her injuries.

Rachel- There are millions physically disabled individuals who are attacked each year.  Some of the disabled can defend themselves.

Rob- Phyliss Law’s home had been broken into before.  That is why some of the windows were already boarded up in this Prichard, Alabama home.   Phyliss heard the thieves pry open one of her windows.  This time she told her granddaughter to hide in the closet.  The 63 year old grandmother wanted the the thieves to leave, but they turned on the lights and began to inventory her home.. again.  This time she was armed with a 9mm handgun.  She fired when one of the thief entered her back bedroom.  She fired again and one thief was stuck in the head.  Despite his wound, both thieves were able to flee.   Later, when the police arrived, they briefly handcuffed Phyliss Law.  She was released on the scene.  The juvenile victim and his accomplice were arrested by police.  The wounded teen survived his wounds.

Rob- Now Phyliss keeps her shotgun near her bedroom door.

Rachel- Here is a good Samaritan story from Hubertus, Wisconsin.  An innocent man was walking his dog when three Pit Bulls escaped from their backyard and charged at him. Dennis Williams lives nearby, and heard the victim scream for help. Williams saw the attack through his window and ran to help.  He tried to stop the attacking dogs with a baseball bat.  Quote “It was one of the worst things I’ve ever witnessed. The dogs were on top of the man and his dog. They were not going to stop. I first tried hitting the Pit Bulls with a baseball bat, but they wouldn’t relent. There was blood all over the ground.”  Close quote.  Williams drew his handgun and killed one of the Pitt Bulls. The other dogs then backed-away.  The man and dog who were attacked required treatment for severe bite and puncture wounds.

We say children are not trusted with firearms, yet we trust these same children to watch their siblings.

John- This San Antonio, Texas homeowner had been robbed before.  This time a 20 year old man broke into the home of a 70 year old man who was ready for him.  After the intruder broke into through a back window, the 70-year-old homeowner used his handgun to shoot the intruder three times in the leg.  Paramedics transported the intruder to the hospital, and he is expected to survive.  The homeowner was not expected to face charges, police said.

Rob-  Two home invaders in Jackson, Mississippi thought 2:30am on a Friday morning was a good time for a robbery. They thought wrong. Jonquez Porter, 19, is now dead and his accomplice Romelo Porter suffered a wound to the leg as the homeowner fought back. Police have not identified the homeowner but had this to say about the incident:

“”You’re entitled to have a weapon in your home and certainly you’re entitled to defend yourself and your home. Apparently, from all we know, this is what this homeowner did,” (Asst Police Chief Lee) Vance said. “The deceased suffered the consequences that come sometimes when you break into somebody’s house.”

Rachel- We have the links to each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com if you want to share them with a friend.

Advertisement NJ2AS
Tips and tricks

Advertisement
Segment 5 Show close

Listener e-mail discussion
John- this in from a listener

Hey guys,
Love the show, and heard you are looking for feedback on what works/doesn’t work. I want to say my favorite parts are the DGU discussions because they give me examples to provide to others who do not yet appreciate the necessity of the right to own and carry a firearm.

Thanks for all your work.
Zach Esposito

Rachel- The Polite Society download app is outon Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.

John- Also please check out Kathy Jackson’s Cornered Cat training classes.Her next class that has seats available is September 13th and 14th in Culpepper Virginia. Also remember that in September is the couples class in Centerton Arkansas with Jon Hodoway, Go to Cornered Cat dot com for info on her classes and details.

John- Rob, do you have any new posts from your SlowFacts blog you want to mention?

Rob- Sheriff Gore is my sheriff and I reported on the victims in his county.

Rachel- Bob Mayne will be on our Saturday show. Bob and Ben Branam will also be doing a training class in Sioux Falls, SD in the spring of 2015. Tune in to this weekend’s show for details.

Rachel- Look at the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.  Subscribing from the link in our show notes helps Bob and Ben as well as helps us here at the Polite Society Podcast.

Join your local civil rights group like theNew Jersey Second Amendment Society,Arizona Citizens Defense League,Gun Owners of California, Commonwealth Second Amendment,  Connecticut Citizens Defense League,Florida Carry, Georgia Carry,Georgia Gun Owners,Grass Roots North Carolina,Illinois Carry, Maryland Shall Issue,  Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry, and  Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.

There are Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance,  Nebraska Firearms Owners Association,   Citizens for a Safer New Jersey,New York State Rifle & Pistol Association,  Open Carry Texas, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Virginia Open Carry,  West Virginia Citizens Defense League, wisconsingunowners.org, and Wyoming Gun Owners.

For our Canadian listeners, and their supporters, join theCanadian Shooting Sports Association and theCanadian National Firearms Association.  If YOUR state or local organization isn’t read each episode, then send us an email and we’ll add them!

John: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast. Until the weekend ) show…
Rob: stay safe,
Rachel: be aware,
John: and we’ll see you down the road.

Episode 253 – Jeff Knox


“An armed society is a polite society.. and this is the Polite Society Podcast where we support and report on civilian self-defense.”
Paul: Welcome to the polite society podcast recorded live on Saturday, July 19th, 2014. I’m Paul Lathrop
Rob: I’m Rob Morse and we have an interview with Jeff Knox, Director of the firearms coalition.
Gary Daughetry: I’m Gary Daughetry, and we have our weekly stories of defensive gun uses
Gary Harpster: I’m Gary Harpster, and we have our usual gun news
Rob: so climb aboard
Gary D: strap in
Gary H: and hang on!
Paul: Episode 253 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.
Show intro music.

Seg 1- Personal news from each participant

Paul: Museum story. My Son’s Birthday party story
Gary: I ordered a new left handed holster for personal and class training.
Break
advertisement ABN
Seg 2- NewsNews_Partner_white

1 Paul: Nick Leghorn over at The Truth About Guns reports that Remington has pulled all information about the R51, the handgun released this past winter just before Shot Show, off of it’s website. I REALLY wanted to like this gun, but was concerned when there were no examples available to fire at media day at the range. If true that it is going away  it is too bad. I really liked the style of the gun, it was kind of retro and futuristic at the same time. When I held the display model at the Remington booth it was hard to make the grip safety work reliably and the red dot laser was even harder to make actuate, but I thought that those things could be worked on. Alas it looks like Remington is not going to give the R51 a second try.
Comments?

2 Rob- California Governor Brown signed a bill into law banning single shot handguns. This is an anti-gun solution in search of a problem.  Single shot firearms are not used in crimes.  Nor are firearms converted from single shot back to normal semi-automatic operation.  So why write and pass such a law?  This was a must pass bill for anti-gun Democrat legislators who are eager to secure campaign funding.  Money talks in the Golden State, particularly anti-gun  campaign donations.

Gary D- Maybe the hunters that think they don’t need the NRA will join now that they can’t use their Thompson/Center Encore anymore.
Comments?

Paul- We have a lot of news from an epidemic of failed gun free zones.

3 Gary H- Jack in the Box restaurants all across the country continue to be an easy hunting ground for criminals since the company requested that gun owners eat elsewhere.  A Jack in the Box in Honolulu, Hawaii was robbed by a suspect carrying a rifle.  A Houston Texas Jack in the Box was held up by two armed robbers in broad daylight.  Including another holdup in Tennessee, two people were shot in some of the latest Jack in the Box robberies.

Brian Luscomb is Vice President for Jack in the Box.  He said, “Creating a warm and inviting environment for all of our guests and employees is a top priority for Jack in the Box.

The presence of guns inside a restaurant could create an uncomfortable situation for our guests and employees.. and lead to unintended consequences.”

Paul- Mister Luscomb, your gun free zone does not mean what you think it means.

Gary D- Another Bloomberg success story.

Comments?

4 Rob- Speaking of Bloomberg success stories.. Target Department Stores have been targeted by thieves now that concealed carriers are not welcome.  A Target customer was robbed at gunpoint by several thieves in the parking lot at a Georgia Target store.  In another Georgia Target store, a woman was severely beaten and her car stolen from the store parking garage.  On the west coast, a Target security guard approached a man for shoplifting in an Oregon store.  The thief pointed his gun at the security guard and fled.

Target’s interim CEO, John Mulligan, said: “Bringing firearms to Target creates an environment that is at odds with the family-friendly shopping and work experience we strive to create.”

Paul- Being robbed and mugged isn’t exactly the family-friendly experience I want when I shop.

Comments?

BREAK
5 Gary D- Police are searching for two suspects who robbed a Chicago Transit Authority train at gunpoint.  In case you forgot, public transit is another no-carry zone for honest Illinois gun owners.  These latest robberies occurred around 4 in the afternoon on the Orange Line train between the Halsted and Roosevelt stop.  This is the train typically used by tourists who fly into Chicago’s Midway airport.  The robbers boarded the train and announced an armed robbery. They robbed several people of an iPad, two laptops, an iPhone, bank cards and $105 dollars in cash.  The thieves fled when the train arrived at the Roosevelt station. The CTA did not make a statement other than to say it’s a “police matter.”  I call it another gun free zone not working in Chicago

Paul- Maybe you can excuse a corporate executive for not understanding the nature of self-defense, but when the executive is paid that much, he should ask the experts.

6 Paul- Here is a store that should know about self-defense.. and about customer service.  Absolute Outdoors in New Kent, Virginia has a large sign in their front window that says “No loaded guns”.  Ed Levine from the Virginia Citizens Defense League asked the store how the policy was enforced.  The store’s owner had this shockingly rude answer.

“You need to add to your list of titles:
Loser
Idiot
In desperate need of a life
life long member of the tiny dick club
Just plain stupid
Now that better describes you.

I’m usually there everyday so you should drop by and see me little man.”

Most guns stores simply ask you to keep your loaded firearm holstered, but not Absolute Outdoors in New Kent, Virginia.

7 Gary H- We have another advocate for gun-free zones in Missouri.  Missouri Governor Jay Nixon vetoed legislation that allowed specially trained teachers to carry concealed guns on school grounds.  Nixon said armed teachers jeopardize safety.  The Democrat governor waited until the legislative session closed before he issued his veto.  Now the Republican-led Legislature has to wait until the September session to attempt an override.

If trained teachers jeopardize students, do the Missouri Capitol Police jeopardize safety of the Governor and legislators too?

8 Rob- We don’t often think of a county as being a gun free zone, but I live in such a county in California.  San Joaquin County, California has similar restrictions with only a few hundred carry permits.  Those of us who have to live in gun-free California counties are told that the police will be there to protect us.  There is an important difference between protecting yourself and waiting for the police.  Last week that  difference mattered.

Three armed gunmen tried to rob a bank in San Joaquin county.  A deputy spotted the robbery in progress, but he was outside the bank and the citizens inside the bank were unarmed.  The robbers took three hostages.  Two of the hostages were badly injured as the robbers tried to escape, and one of the hostages was killed by gunfire.

The police will be there in minutes, and sometimes seconds are the difference between life and death.

Gary D- The robbery took place in Stockton, and the robbers were using AK pistols.  More failure of gun control.. just like Chicago.

9 Gary D- We reported on this story a few episodes ago, but the story of Shaneen Allen goes on.  Shaneen drove into New Jersey where she was stopped by a policeman for a lane change.  Unfortunately, she was carrying a firearm, and like an honest citizen, she informed the New Jersey officer who stopped her.  She was arrested since there is no reciprocity between New Jersey and Pennsylvania where Shaneen was licensed.  Shaneen is a single mom with two children and two jobs.  She works late and was robbed twice this year.  She took her firearms safety class and had her carry license for only a few weeks.

Think about this for a moment.  This young woman drove a car that is far more powerful than any handgun.  She used a drivers license issued by Pennsylvania and recognized all across the country.. and even recognized in New Jersey.  She is also recognized as a US citizen from a birth certificate issued in another town.

As I said, Allen had a license to carry a concealed weapon issued in Pennsylvania.  That licensing process is far more rigorous than getting her drivers license or her citizenship papers, particularly for a concealed carry license from Philadelphia where Allen lives.  New Jersey ignores that license and branded her a criminal.

I don’t know if you remember speed traps in the south and southwest where small towns would use law enforcement to fine and imprison strangers.  This is the same miscarriage of justice inflicted on an innocent woman.  Allen faces a felony weapons possession charge and faces three year in New Jersey prison.  This single mom was already jailed for 46 days before she could make bail.  She was about to accept a plea deal and serve the three years when she got a good lawyer.  This is bigotry against honest gun owners.

Show me the victim if she is a criminal.

There is a defense fund on Facebook, and I hope you will call the National Rifle Association and Gun Owners of America asking them to help her.  You are a member, aren’t you?

10 Paul- Anti-gun groups in Nevada want to put an initiative on the ballot to legislate universal firearms background checks.  The Las Vegas Review Journal came out against the measure in an editorial.  They said the gun control proponents must “overcome the strongest argument against expanded background checks: the fact that determined lawbreakers who want a gun will not respect the laws written to disarm them.”  The editorial then went on to cite the many examples of criminals either avoiding or passing background checks.

11 Gary H- Detroit has shown that armed citizens save lives.. and might save their city as well.  Detroit has a decreasing tax base and huge municipal debts.  Much of Detroit is abandoned, and the police can’t even patrol the ruins.  Despite those tough conditions, robberies are down 37 percent year to year.  Breakins are down 22 percent and there have been 30 percent fewer carjackings.  It isn’t that the Detroit economy is suddenly so much better.  What changed is that Detroit citizens are harder targets for criminals.

Police Chief James Craig said, “Criminals are getting the message that good Detroiters are armed and will use their weapon.  I don’t want to take away from the good work our investigators are doing, but I think part of the drop in crime, and robberies in particular, is because criminals are thinking twice that citizens could be armed.”

Paul- This week’s quote come from Lysander Spooner.  “A man is no less a slave because he is allowed to choose a new master once in a term of years.”

Hang on everybody, we’ll be right back after this
advertisement Concealment Solutions
Segment 3 Interviews

Interview with Jeff Knox, Director of the Firearms Coalition talking about universal background checks.  Red/Green stripe is an old proposal.  A green “G” is a known good guy.  There are a few obvious questions.  Who pays?  Will any period of review, say 5 years, satisfy the gun grabbers?

Segment 4 DGUs
1 Gary H- It is good to have friends with guns, even if they are strangers.  Donald Sacco was at an Orange County, Florida bus stop.  That is where he was attacked and robbed by Thomas Thorpe.  Thorpe Stabbed Sacco in the hand, leg and abdomen.  A passing motorist saw the attack and stopped his car.  The motorist drew his firearm and held Thorpe at gunpoint while other witnesses helped the wounded Sacco.  Thorpe was taken into custody by deputies and charged with attempted first-degree murder, aggravated battery with a deadly weapon, robbery and carrying a concealed weapon.  The victim was transported to the hospital in stable condition.

2 Rob-  With friends like this, it is time to change occupations.  A homeowner in a North Houston suburb went for his shotgun when three armed men broke into his home.  One of the thieves grabbed the shotgun and the two wrestled for control of the long gun.   That is when the thief accidentally fired his handgun and struck another thief.  The wounded thief was captured by deputies and transported to the hospital.  The two other thieves escaped.

Distance is your friend in a fight.  Keep your firearms close and your enemies far away.

I’m not much of a long-gun guy yet.  Is it true that the only use of your handgun is to fight your way to your long gun?

3 Paul –

This article was e-mailed into Guns Save Lives.

A woman in Gainsville, Texas confronted a man who wandered into her yard.  She thought the intruder was high on drugs because of the way he acted when she repeatedly asked him to leave.  At that point the intruder threw his hat on the ground, and came at her. The homeowner’s 13 year old boy had his Ruger 10/22 in hand, but did not have to fire a shot.  The intruder turned and ran at the sight of the firearm.  The homeowner’s 15 year old daughter called 911, but it took the police an additional 8 minutes to arrive.

This incident is typical of most defensive gun uses.  You only call the police after the threat is apparent.  The sight of a firearm stops most attackers.  The police arrive to take a report after the event is over.

Long guns are better than nothing.

4 Gary D- Two teenagers — a 15-year-old and a 17-year-old — tried to steal Victoria Davison’s car last month while she was in it, “I want the keys, car, everything,” commanded one of the teens.  Davison hesitated, prompting one teen to tell the other, “Go get the cannon” — a reference to his gun. But Davison had a “cannon” of her own and pulled it out of her gym bag. She shot the 15-year-old. “I shot the one that was in front of me. The one in the back of me, he said a curse word, and then he looked at his friend, and then he ran off while his friend was on the ground,” Police are investigating what may be “dozens” of carjackings and robberies tied to the teens. The wounded 15 year-old is also connected to a violent shooting where he shot a 43-year-old man in the face following an attempted carjacking.

I’m sorry everybody but I am a trainer and I tend to see teaching moments. She says in the interview that she had the gun in a bag and struggled to get the zipper open and the gun out. Another reason to if at all possible on-body carry if you can.

Victoria Davison interview

Teens accused in several carjackings seen together at Children’s hospital

5 Gary H-  A guest at the Grand Hyatt Hotel on the river walk in San Antonio, Texas had to use deadly force to defend himself and a woman when a mentally ill man threatened and then charged the pair. Torres went to the sixth floor of the hotel at 1 p.m. and started breaking lights in the hallway, according to police. He started to bang on a door, and when a witness opened it, Torres said he was “looking for someone to kill,” police said.

The witness slammed the door, so Torres banged on another one, police said.

The man inside of that room waited a moment to open the door, and when he did, Torres charged him. The hotel guest drew a concealed handgun, fired one shot, and struck Torres in the chest, stopping him just outside of the door.

No charges have been filed or are currently expected in the case.

Torres’ family says the man was suffering from an unidentified mental illness.

Gary – Teaching moment – If a stranger is pounding on your door, don’t open it.

6 Rob -Two homeless Oregon men thought someone reported them to the Bureau of Land Management as trespassers, so they went to the man’s home armed with a baseball bat and took turns beating him.  The beating caused extensive head, face and back injuries. In an attempt to escape after the attack, the victim grabbed a shotgun from his home and fired two rounds into the air. The suspects fled and called police to report that they had been shot at. They were later arrested and charged with assault.

Gary D- I guess that is the Joe Biden defense.

DGU –
This one was sent in by Greg in Bremmerton,

From the NBCLosAngeles.com site.
A market robber is believed to have accidentally killed his accomplice during a fight with the owner of the El Sereno store they were robbing Friday, the Los Angeles Police Department said.
A 21-year-old man allegedly shot a 35-year-old man at the market at 11:15 a.m., according to police.
“There was an altercation with the store owner, who tried to take the rifle away,” LAPD officer Nuria Vanegas said.
The man who was shot was wielding a machete, police said.
The men’s names were not immediately released.
The store owner was uninjured.

Paul- We have the links to each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com if you want to share them with a friend.

Advertisement NJ2AS
Tips and tricks

Advertisement
Segment 5 Show close

Listener e-mail discussion

Gary H- Email #1 From Ken in Arizona
I thought you’d like to know that Target’s “no guns allowed” policy is actually working! I just bought a new cell phone, and 2 new tablet computers, and a few accessories to go along with them. And not once did I ever consider going into Target to shop. Their policy worked. It kept me and my gun out. Apparently, smarter people than I are making good decisions after all.
Who says a “gun-free zone” doesn’t work.
Ken in AZ

Gary D- We got a message from John Willett of the Bold Departure podcast
Hi, What’s up guys? I was just listening to the episode with Russell Smith’s proposal for firearms purchases. Frankly, moving to combine photo ID and ability to purchase a firearm is a huge step in the wrong direction. I will add that we shouldn’t generate proposals based on the worst state’s laws. I have seen a proposal that makes a lot of sense. Rather than using the failed paradigm of relying on laws that prohibit activity, we utilize technology and an incentive for folks to conduct their own background check prior to a sale via a website that performs the same function as NICS does now. The website gives them a code that is good when combined with info from their existing ID for firearm purchases for a predetermined amount of time. The incentive is that the seller of the firearm would keep documentation of the sale with the code and that would provide them legal immunity against criminal action related to the sale.

Paul- The Polite Society download app is out on Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.

Rob- Also please check out Kathy Jackson’s Cornered Cat training classes. Go to Cornered Cat dot com for more classes and details.

Gary H- Look at the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.  Subscribing from the link in our show notes helps Bob and Ben as well as helps us here at the Polite Society Podcast.

Join your local civil rights group like the New Jersey Second Amendment Society, Arizona Citizens Defense League, Gun Owners of California, Commonwealth Second Amendment,  Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Florida Carry, Georgia Carry, Georgia Gun Owners, Grass Roots North Carolina, Illinois Carry, Maryland Shall Issue,  Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry, and  Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.

There are Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance,  Nebraska Firearms Owners Association,   Citizens for a Safer New Jersey,New York State Rifle & Pistol Association,  Open Carry Texas, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Virginia Open Carry,  West Virginia Citizens Defense League, wisconsingunowners.org, and Wyoming Gun Owners.
For our Canadian listeners, and their supporters, join the Canadian Shooting Sports Association and the Canadian National Firearms Association.  If YOUR state or local organization isn’t read each episode, then send us an email and we’ll add them!

Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast. Until the ( mid-week / weekend ) show…
Rob: stay safe,
Gary H: be aware,
Gary D: and we’ll see you down the road.

Episode 252 – Another MAIG Mayor Goes to Prison

Paul: Welcome to the polite society podcast recorded live on Saturday, July 12, 2014. I’m Paul Lathrop

Gary D: I’m Gary Daugherty, and we’ll talk about self-defense news.

Rachel: I’m Rachel Malone, we also have our normal DGU segment and some emails to talk about.

Gary D: so climb aboard

Gary H: strap in

Paul and hang on! Episode 252 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.

Show intro music.

 

Seg 1- Personal news from each participant

 

Gary D: Yesterday I finished training and qualifying two more students from my most recent  private Illinois concealed carry class.

Gary: Tonight Harley Nights.

Rachel: Participated in a highly successful CATI walk specially for the ladies – the Gunpowder and Lace walk – and then came home and went outside with a few friends to zero a rifle and got to fire off a couple of rounds about 15 minutes before we went live tonight. FNAR. Sweet rifle, sweet glass.

Paul: Starting the process of getting a new family member (dog), major annoyance while trying to do research for todays show, Auto loading videos that will not stop until the advertisement has run. (I will buy Dannon yogurt again sometime after I eat at Buffalo Wild Wings and get a downtown Manhattan apartment)

Matthew: Shot my first Appleseed today.

 

Break

advertisement ABN

Seg 2- News

Gary D – Headline – Police Bust Local Man on Felony Gun Charges – I’m sure you’re thinking good they got another bad guy off the street. But, wait. A FFL and a very vocal gun rights activist gets food poisoning so severe that he needs to be intubated in the hospital. Of course anybody who is intubated must be restrained so they don’t hurt themselves pulling the tube out of their throat. According to hospital policy anybody who is restrained has a mandatory meeting with the psychiatrist. Mandatory treatment means bye bye FFL, which I understand he has spent 6 figures in legal fees trying to get back, bye bye Illinois concealed carry instructor certification, bye bye Illinois FOID card. I don’t know what evidence was used, possibly facebook pictures of a personal gun collection, but two search warrants were issued for the man’s business and for his home where three handguns, two rifles, 1800 rounds of ammunition and some reloading gear was confiscated. Over the years he has ruffled a lot of even pro gun feathers in blog posts and on social media. Now he is being vilified for doing nothing wrong until the last minute when he didn’t immediately relinquish all of his guns after his FOID card was revoked, all because of comments made on social media. Be careful what you post.

 

Paul- It looks like there is a fight going on in Miami, and some good advice inadvertently is coming out of the policemen’s union  From the WVSN website

 

MIAMI (WSVN) — Miami-Dade County could end up with hundreds of police officers losing their jobs in a budget proposal made by Miami-Dade Mayor Carlos Gimenez, Tuesday.

“This is it, start of a long-term budget strategy that will help us avoid yearly budget crises,” said Gimenez during his announcement of the 2014-2015 budget proposal.

The budget cuts close to 650 county jobs to fill a $64 million hole in the general fund. Miami-Dade Police could see the largest cuts if certain concessions are not made by the local labor union. “If we get no concessions whatsoever, then you’re looking at about 250 police officers,” said Gimenez.

If police department cuts are made, officers from administrative posts would likely shift to the street and certain specialized units that deal with robberies and child abuse cases could see positions vanish. “One of the directions I told the director was that I wanted to have the same number of patrol officers in the street that we have today,” said Gimenez.

The Miami-Dade Police Benevolent Association fired back after the proposal, saying public safety is paramount and these proposed cuts will have a negative impact. John Rivera, president of the Miami-Dade Police Benevolent Association, said, “If the mayor’s not going to provide security, then my recommendation, as an experienced law enforcement officer for nearly 40 years, is either buy yourself an attack dog, put bars on your windows and doors and get yourself some firearms because you’re going to have to protect yourselves. We won’t be able to.”

Rachael: Jeff Knox reports in WND.com that the USA Today has started running full page ads paid for by Bloomfield press. That is the publishing company owned by Allan Korwin. He provides many of our gun quotes. The full page ads relate what you hear each and every episode here, Defensive gun uses. These are almost never seen in places like the USA today. Korwin plans to keep running these from time to time in the USA Today and expand them out to other papers and media outlets as well. Good on you Allan, keep it up! Please check out the show notes for this episode to find a link where you can help him keep these ads going.

 

Matthew: Miguel Gonzales reports in his Gun Free Zone blog that an interesting study came out last week. The study by Garen J Wintremute was a look to find out just how many attempts were made to “straw purchase” a gun. I am going to direct you to Miguel’s blog if you want all of the details including how the numbers were reached, but the end result of the study comes out that of all attempts to buy a gun in 2011 (the year the study was in effect) one half of one percent of all attempts were illegal or only about 1 in every 200.  It looks to me like the law is working.

 

Paul:Former New Orleans Mayor and member of Bloomberg’s MAIG or as I prefer Mayors Against Good Guys Owning Tactical Stuff (MAGGOTS) – Thanks to Chaz Murray of the Roadgunner podcast who I stole that from-  Ray Nagan was sentenced this week to 10 years for corruption. He was convicted on 20 of 21 counts of bribery, wire fraud, tax evasion and other crimes earlier this year. Former Mayor Nagan was in charge in New Orleans when Katrina hit and is largely responsible for the gun confiscation debacle that happened during the catastrophe. I sincerely hope that Mayor Nagan goes to a real prison and not a club fed.

Gun Quotes

 

Gary : I have a couple of gun quotes for you:

When a person has a gun, sometimes their mind clicks that this thing will win arguments and straighten people out. –Bill Cosby

When you carry a gun, you mean to harm somebody, kill somebody. –Bill Cosby

If this is the prevailing anti-gun mindset, then I understand why they believe that the government should keep our guns out of our hands.  Of all the gun owners I know, have trained and trained with, none of them have this mindset.

 

On a more positive note, we have a quote from of all people Brad Pitt,

 

America is a country founded on guns. It’s in our DNA. It’s very strange but I feel better having a gun. I really do. I don’t feel safe, I don’t feel the house is completely safe, if I don’t have one hidden somewhere. That’s my thinking, right or wrong.

(Brad, Since I know that you have more houses than just in California, and I think that if you were to ask the LA county Sheriff if you could have a CCW he would grant you one in the MAY issue state of CAlifornia I would suggest that is it far safer to carry the gun on your person than to have one hidden away where you may or may not be able to get to it.)

Hang on everybody, we’ll be right back after this

advertisement Concealment Solutions

Segment 3 Interviews

 

Segment 4 DGUs

 

Gary H: DGU #1

 

Jackson  Mississippi Police are looking for a third suspect involved in an early Thursday morning home invasion and shooting.

JPD Public Information Officer, Colendula Green tells us three suspects broke into a home around 2 a.m. on Myrtlewood. Police say the homeowner used his gun and fired several shots.

One person was hit in the head and taken to the hospital with life threatening injuries. A second person was found shot in the chest behind a house across the street several hours later.

Police say that suspect is also suffering from life threatening injuries. The third suspect is still on the loose.  (One suspects some training here. One chest shot and one head shot out of 3 suspects)

Rachael DGU #2

 

WISN out of Milwaukee tells the story of a carjacker that wasn’t so successful. The 15 year old criminal tried to carjack one person earlier this week. When the victim realised that he was being targeted he hit the throttle and started to drive away. The young punk fired at the victim, who drove himself to the hospital after being struck in the jaw by a bullet., Injured but alive and still in possession of his property. The next day the young Obama supporter (not in the story but added by Paul) decided to try, try again. This time he picked a woman who has a CCW and was carrying. He is in Serious but stable condition in the hospital and is facing multiple felony charges.

 

Gary D: DGU #3

 

On the last show Rob and John talked about a DGU that took place in Chicago I wanted to address that a little more — Obviously there was an argument going on and then someone went into the house came back out and started shooting. I hope what is taught in every concealed carry and self-defense gun class is first try to de-escalate the argument even if this means leaving the area. Second, the time to escape was when the guy went into the house not after he comes back out shooting.

 

We have the links to each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com if you want to share them with a friend.

 

Advertisement NJ2AS

Tips and tricks

 

Advertisement

Segment 5 Show close

 

Listener e-mail discussion

Rachel: Email #1

Rob,

 

I am the John from San Antonio who took the Appleseed training with Rachel and called into  Gun Talk.  I am a pediatric orthopedic surgeon and am trying to advance gun rights in my little corner of Texas.  My area of concern is that Texas state law mandates that hospitals and nursing homes must post the state designated signs to prevent concealed license holders from carrying on the premises.  As we both know, this turns hospitals into victim disarmament zones. Unfortunately, hospital administrators are not willing to allow staff to carry. This is allowed under state law.

I also presented a resolution to our county medical society board to remove gun free zones. They voted it down 22-2. I have been in communication with Timothy Wheeler, MD from Doctors for Responsible Gun Ownership to help me with the medical community. Unfortunately, he has run into similar problems in the past. On a better note, I have organized some Introductory pistol courses for medical staff. I got a couple of good instructors to do them for me. You might recognize their names: Bob Mayne and Ben Branam. The first course we got 12 students including the 16 year old daughter of a physician and one of the doctors who voted against the resolution at the county medical society.  We’ve scheduled the next one for September. I’ve also personally taken over 20 new shooters to the range in the past year and am going to take the NRA Basic and Pistol instructor courses next weekend. I’m also hoping Rachel will help me when the next legislative session convenes in 2015.

I hope to meet you at GRPC in Chicago.

 

John

 

Paul: Email #2

 

Thank you so much for your tribute to your little dog. I am so sorry for your huge loss. You especially touched me, as my doggie, Shuggie, 11 pounds of poodle love, is about the same age, with a similar history, and I thought I was going to lose him on July 1st. The previous night, he had collapsed 4 times in a 10 hour stretch. But, he recovered over the next few days and has rebounded this past week. I know the end is near for him, and I, too, dread the rapidly approaching day. Your experience is touching, and your  words were comforting. Thanks.
Ken Silva
Phoenix, AZ

 

Gary D: Email #3

 

Anthony Lucafo sent in a link to us relaying a story that Dick Durban is trying to push more gun control bills in the Senate. I don’t expect much to come of this, but we will keep an eye in it. After all Dick has often proved that he is aptly named.

Gary H: The Polite Society download app is outon Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.

 

Paul: Also please check out Kathy Jackson’s Cornered Cat training classes. Her next class that still has seats available is the weekend of September 13th and 14th in Culpepper Virginia. Don’t forget that the Tactical Couples class is the weekend after that in Centerton Arkansas.. Go to Cornered Cat dot com for more classes and details.

 

Rachel: Rob had a post from his SlowFacts blog.  WE are ordinary gun owners, and we have a super-power.  WE are trusted by our neighbors. The ordinary gun owner has a reputation for being honest, fun to be around, and trustworthy. That reputation is the antidote to the lies told by the anti-rights crowd because our neighbors believe us rather than the media. The question is this. Will we use our super-power for good? Will we take a friend shooting?

 

Gary D: Look at the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.  Subscribing from the link in our show notes helps Bob and Ben as well as helps us here at the Polite Society Podcast.

 

Join your local civil rights group like theNew Jersey Second Amendment Society,Arizona Citizens Defense League,Gun Owners of California, Commonwealth Second Amendment,  Connecticut Citizens Defense League,Florida Carry, Georgia Carry,Georgia Gun Owners,Grass Roots North Carolina,Illinois Carry, Maryland Shall Issue,  Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry, and  Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.

 

There are Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance,  Nebraska Firearms Owners Association,   Citizens for a Safer New Jersey,New York State Rifle & Pistol Association,  Open Carry Texas, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Virginia Open Carry,  West Virginia Citizens Defense League, wisconsingunowners.org, and Wyoming Gun Owners.

 

For our Canadian listeners, and their supporters, join theCanadian Shooting Sports Association and theCanadian National Firearms Association.  If YOUR state or local organization isn’t read each episode, then send us an email and we’ll add them!

 

Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast.  Until the ( mid-week / weekend ) show…

Gary H: stay safe,

Gary D:: be aware,

Rachel: and we’ll see you down the road.

 

Mention advertisers, ABN, Concealment Solutions, Crusader Weaponry and NJ2AS. Firearm Safety Institute

 

Episode 251 – Russell Smith

Introduction
“An armed society is a polite society.. and this is the Polite Society Podcast where we support and report on civilian self-defense.”
Rob: Welcome to the polite society podcast recorded live on Wednesday, July 9th, 2014. I’m Rob Morse.
John: I’m John Richardson, and on today’s show we have an interview with Russell Smith of the Armed Porcupine.
Rob: I’m Rob Morse and we have our usual news and DGUs, so climb aboard
John: strap in
Rob: and hang on!
John: Episode 251 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.
Show intro music.

Seg 1- Personal news from each participant

Rob- Dry practice.

John – My gun related news is that I’ve arranged a visit to PTR Industries in Aynor, South Carolina. PTR was one of the Connecticut firearms companies impacted by the new draconian laws post-Newtown. Rather than try to operate in a state that didn’t want them, they moved to South Carolina where Gov. Nikki Haley spoke at their ribbon cutting.

Here is a bit of news for our chat room warriors, we won’t record an episode next Wednesday. For everyone else it means we won’t publish an episode next Saturday.
Break
advertisement ABN
Seg 2- News

News_Partner_white

-Now here is an open carry event that won hearts and minds. There were the usual cowhorses, rodeo queens, fire engines and political candidates waving to the delighted crowd.  The event was the God and Old Glory parade in Westcliffe, Colorado on Independence day.  By far, the largest group of participants – and the one that got some of the most enthusiastic response from the crowd – were the estimated 250 advocates, many clad in red, white and blue, marching openly with guns holstered on their hips or slung over their shoulders. They carried everything from old-fashioned flintlock rifles to semi-automatics to fake plastic guns carried by children.  The Royal Gorge Tea Party carried a sign that said: Keep your gun in the right hands – yours.

Colorado parade

-Two organizations, Students for Concealed Carry and Ohioans for Concealed Carry, filed a lawsuit in Ohio Court.  They challenged the Ohio State University’s authority to ban lawful possession of firearms.  Currently firearms are banned for students, faculty and staff on University campuses.

The concealed carry groups think these university regulations infringe on a fundamental Constitutional Right to armed self-defense.  The regulations also disarm students and staff to and from campus, leaving them vulnerable to violent crime on their commute in what is historically a high crime area.  While Ohio law permits a concealed handgun licensee to store a firearm in a motor vehicle on OSU’s campuses, a student could still face administrative sanctions from the university including expulsion due to the certain provisions in the Student Code of Conduct. Michael R. Moran, a Columbus attorney representing the groups, points out that expulsion from taxpayer funded Ohio State for a firearms related incident carries severe consequences for a law-abiding student including an academic record blemish that “can virtually guarantee the disciplined student may never earn an accredited degree.”

Comment-  Last episode we had a similar article about a lawsuit brought in florida to allow concealed carry holders to keep their firearms in the cars.

r-Boise State University in Idaho just attracted a lawsuit, and it seems well deserved.  The student group Young Americans for Liberty invited Dick Heller to speak on campus.  Dick was the plaintiff in the Washington DC versus Heller case that returned some rights of armed self-defense to DC citizens.  Hours before Heller was to appear, the Boise State administrators said the students needed to pay a $465 security fee.  The excuse was that someone said claimed they would open carry at the event.  This is technically called a heckler’s veto, since anyone could claim they might violate school policy and therefore require more campus security.  This in turn allows the university administration to impose a security fee on any student group they didn’t like.  The lawsuit is funded by the group FIRE, Foundation for Individual Rights in Education.

Comment- John, does this remind  you of your university?

j- The laws to restrict the mentally insane from getting firearms don’t work if the public and the courts don’t follow through and apply them.  The excuse for the surge in recent anti-gun laws is the murder at a Connecticut school a year and a half ago.  Connecticut had laws in place since 1999 that allowed the mentally ill to be disarmed and go to trial showing they were, or were not, a danger to themselves and others.  Like the gun-laws that make it illegal for known criminals to have guns, these prohibitions are largely ineffective.  The law is often abused by Connecticut police and by couples waging lawfare against each other.

Rob Comment- California is considering a similar law.

Comment- It is an election year and the politicians are pandering for a press release and for Bloomberg campaign money.

r- A rash of animal shootings by police officers nationwide has law-enforcement agencies running for cover amid growing public outrage that could force state legislatures to require greater accountability from men and women in uniform. No government agency keeps a national database on the number of pets killed by police. But animal-abuse activists have kept statistics.  They say a pet is murdered by law enforcement every 98 minutes in America.  This is largely a result of officers having little-to-no training on how to deal with dogs.  The book Management of Aggressive Canines for Law Enforcement”  is a good starting point, and you might give to your local police if they lack such training.

Comment- Most officers are under control.  The out of control officers hide behind the deep pockets of the city lawyers and behind their union work rules.

j- Atlanta, Georgia deserves a shout out for a special kind of dumb.  Last year, concealed carry holders could enter city government buildings.  After the Georgia legislature passed laws allowing carry in bars and restaurants, the Atlanta Mayor banned private citizens from carrying in city buildings.  Mayor Kasim Reed needs to lose a lawsuit.  It ia amazing that the Mayor did nothing to keep armed criminals out of city hall, but now he wants to ban citizens who have been fingerprinted and had a background check.

Comment- Stop electing the village idiot into government office.

– This is why it matters.  41 people were shot in New York City over the week including Independence day.  Chicago recorded 104 gunshot victims during the same week.  None of the shootings were by licensed gun owners committing in the commision of a crime.  Not one in either city.

The fact that there is high crime in these gun-control paradise cities is lost on their corrupt politicians.  The top cop in Chicago blamed the violence on lax gun laws.  You can’t fix a failed society with prohibition, but blaming a piece of metal makes a great smokescreen for corrupt politicians.

Comment- You don’t achieve peace by disarming honest people.

j- Here is more news from Chicago.  You need lawyers and money to have a chance at a concealed carry permit in Illinois.  There are almost 200 lawsuits pending against the Illinois state police and the state special review board which grants and denies concealed carry permits. One example is Michael Thomas.  Thomas is a former Air force reservist who routinely carried a firearm in the military.  Now living in Chicago, the took the required firearms training courses, paid a host of fees, and submitting fingerprints for a background check to buy a firearm.  That is why he is puzzled why the Illinois special review board denied his application for a concealed carry license.  Thomas never had a run-in with the law.  He said “I have never been arrested or convicted of any offense, either misdemeanor or felony, in the state of Illinois or any other state.  I have no criminal record of any type.”  He feared a case of identity theft and asked the state police for a rehearing.  The state police refused to say why he was denied, and told him that the special review board’s decisions couldn’t be reviewed.  Instead, he would have to petition a court for an appeal.

There are 800 people like Michael Thomas who have been denied licenses by the board, a quasi-judicial body who meets behind closed doors and keeps its records and reasoning secret, even from applicants who are denied.  The Illinois law contains contradictory language that leaves the appeals process open to political interpretation. It states that in the event of a denial, state police “must notify the applicant stating the grounds for the denial.” But it also says that, “all board decisions and voting records shall be kept confidential and all materials considered by the board shall be exempt from inspection except upon order of a court.”

comment- Put not your faith in Illinois politicians.

r- And stay the hell out of New Jersey too. It looks like we have another innocent citizen railroaded by New Jersey’s anti gun laws.  Shaneen Allen from Philadelphia was arrested for traveling through New Jersey while possessing legal ammunition.  As usual, the law enforcement officers said a judge could sort it out.  That puts Ms Allen at risk of paying for a trial, and at risk of a felony conviction if the judge is as dishonest as they have been in the past.  Evan F. Nappen is defending her, but that doesn’t mean she will receive a fair trail.

We’ll keep you up to date.

Was she charged with driving while black.. with a firearms as an aggravating circumstance.

Gun Quotes

John “Convinced that the people are the only safe depositories of their own liberty, and that they are not safe unless enlightened to a certain degree, I have looked on our present state of liberty as a short-lived possession unless the mass of the people could be informed to a certain degree.” –Thomas Jefferson to Littleton Waller Tazewell, 1805.

Rob “Whenever the people are well-informed, they can be trusted with their own government. Whenever things get so far wrong as to attract their notice, they may be relied on to set them to rights.” –Thomas Jefferson to Richard Price, 1789. ME 7:253

Hang on everybody, we’ll be right back after this
advertisement Concealment Solutions
Segment 3 Interviews
Interview with Russell Smith talking about his green stripe universal background check proposal. Russ is at the Armoured Porcupine on Facebook.
Segment 4 DGUs
Green stripe summary.

John – I’ll wait until the end to tell you where this DGU happened because you won’t believe it. A military service member with an Illinois concealed carry permit was leaving a party with 3 friends when they noticed a cup of liquor on their car left there by someone attending a party next door. When they removed it, a party goer got upset, went inside the house,retrieved a gun, and came out shooting. The CCW holder got behind the fender of the car and shot Denzel Mickiel, 22, twice in the arm and back.  The four victims then left the immediate scene as others started shooting at them.

Mickiel remain hospitalized on Sunday but has been charged with attempted murder and will be held on $950,000 bond.

The city was Chicago!!!!

Rob- God bless concealed carriers.. particularly in Chicago.

r-The owners of the Lexington, Kentucky jewelry and pawn shop were suspicious when three young men walked into their store.  It was 90 degrees outside with high humidity and the three were wearing hoodies with the hoods over their heads.  Let us say the store owner was shocked, but not surprised when one of the three pulled a hammer from his jacket pocket and smashed a display case holding expensive watches.  The owner drew his pistol and ordered the three thieves to the ground.  That is how the police found them when they arrived minutes later

I don’t know that I’d draw my gun to protect property, but this store owner protected his store and his staff.

j- I don’t think the criminals are going to obey the gun control laws.  This one didn’t.  53 year old Steve Griffin threatened to kill a cashier at a Waffle house on Sunday.  On Monday he drew his gun and threatened a cashier at a Greenville, South Carolina Waffle House.  This clerk pulled her own gun, and Green ran before she fired.  Simpsonville Police arrested him later that day.

r- Four armed home invaders broke into a home in Springfield, Missouri very early this past Saturday morning. In the home were Rick Rogers, his girlfriend Chelsea St. John, and her daughter-in-law. When they realized the intruders were armed, Rogers rushed upstairs to get his firearm followed by his girlfriend. That is when one of the home intruders, Kenneth Fry, 40, grabbed Ms. St. John by the hair and drug her back downstairs into the kitchen. He told her, “get on the floor, you know I will kill you.” Fry then went to attack Mr. Rogers whereupon Rogers shot first and killed Fry. The other 3 intruders rushed out of the house upon hearing the shot.

Fast forward to Sunday afternoon, when two men were walking past her house, Ms. St. John looked at one of the men and realized he was one of the home intruders. She immediately called 911 and police ended up catching one of the men. The other is still on the loose.

Of the killing of Kenneth Fry, Mr. Rogers said he had no regrets. “I would do it again,” says Rogers. ” If they do it again, I would do it again. You got to protect your family.”

j- We have the links to each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com if you want to share them with a friend.

Advertisement NJ2AS
Tips and tricks

Advertisement
Segment 5 Show close

Listener e-mail discussion
Rob- A friend wrote me about Matt’s rant. I want to share his comment with all of you.

E-mail from listener Ian

I am listening to your podcast with the listeners rant. (Matt’s rant) He is right. You are all right. Here’s my understanding. in as few words as I can use because I can ramble.

Self defense includes and is not exclusive to protection personally or as a group of yourself, your family, your town, your city, your county, your state and your country. Any one of those can be defense against tyranny, whether it’s local or national.

You guys cover personal DGU’s regularly.

An example of local tyranny is The 1946 Battle Of Athens in Tennessee

Your listeners point is that the word tyranny rattles Average Joe’s cage is correct, because people believe that kind of thing only happens in other countries and America is home of the free. That could never happen here. This is a civilized country.

Then people who have it in the back of their mind that is a possibility one day there may be a tyrannical government that needs fighting against are marginalized. and unless you are a smart and eloquent person that can talk to that kind of audience, you simply won’t get through without coming across as a conspiracy nut.

So I concur. leave out the word tyranny until you can make someone understand the more immediate issue of violent crime and work up from there later.

Also, bear in mind the 2nd Amendment was not drafted wholly based on tyranny but, like much of the constitution and amendments, upon a deep understanding of history as a whole. That was the huge advantage of kick starting a whole new nation without baggage. It’s worth going and reading Lord Blackstone – an Englishman that had a heavy influence on the forming of the 2nd.

2nd Ammendment isn’t for only one angle. It covers many. and we don’t have to overwhelm people by zoning in on the nuclear option.

I’m slowly catching up with all the podcasts in my queue – the World Cup has put a dent in my listening schedule!

Ian Wright
F.A.S.T. O.C

j-E-mail number 2
This is an e-mail from listener Julian.
Congrats to Miss Rachel for getting a shout out on Tom Gresham’s national Gun Talk show from one of her Apple Seed students! Tom expressed an interest in learning more about Apple Seed and I thought it might be a chance for her to reach out to his show and get a little recognition for all her hard work and the PSP too.

r- The Polite Society download app is outon Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.

j- Also please check out Kathy Jackson’s Cornered Cat training classes. Her next class that still has seats available is the weekend of July 12th and 13th in Walla Walla Washington. Go to Cornered Cat dot com for more classes and details.

Rob, do you have any new posts from your SlowFacts blog you want to mention?

j-Look at the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.  Subscribing from the link in our show notes helps Bob and Ben as well as helps us here at the Polite Society Podcast.

Join your local civil rights group like theNew Jersey Second Amendment Society,Arizona Citizens Defense League,Gun Owners of California, Commonwealth Second Amendment,  Connecticut Citizens Defense League,Florida Carry, Georgia Carry,Georgia Gun Owners,Grass Roots North Carolina,Illinois Carry, Maryland Shall Issue,  Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry, and  Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.

There are Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance,  Nebraska Firearms Owners Association,   Citizens for a Safer New Jersey,New York State Rifle & Pistol Association,  Open Carry Texas, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Virginia Open Carry,  West Virginia Citizens Defense League, wisconsingunowners.org, and Wyoming Gun Owners.

For our Canadian listeners, and their supporters, join theCanadian Shooting Sports Association and theCanadian National Firearms Association.  If YOUR state or local organization isn’t read each episode, then send us an email and we’ll add them!

Episode 250 – Kathy Jackson and Frank Fiamingo

Intro- “An armed society is a polite society.. and this is the Polite Society Podcast where we support and report on civilian self-defense.”

Paul: Welcome to the polite society podcast recorded live on Saturday July 5th 2014 I’m Paul Lathrop
John: I’m John Richardson, and we’ll talk with author and instructor Kathy Jackson as well as Frank Fiamingo of the New Jersey Second Amendment Society.
Gary: I’m Gary Harpster and we have our weekly self-defense news
Rob: I’m Rob Morse and we have our weekly stories of defensive gun use, so climb aboard
John: strap in
Rob: and hang on!
Paul: Episode 250 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.
Show intro music.

Seg 1- Personal news from each participant
Rob- Dry practice with my SIRT pistol and handgun on Independence day.

John – We had family in town from Missouri yesterday and we all enjoyed the various displays of fireworks. They also brought me a T-Shirt from the MO Univ of Sci & Tech where my nephew is think of attending. The shirt said, “My mascot carries a gun” on the front and “Does Yours?” on the back. The school’s mascot is an old miner with a six-gun on his hip. I love it!

Paul – We have brought up our dog Dakota several times on the show. This week she left us. On the day she left us Dakota was 14 ½ years old exactly. Is seems to me that one of the cruel tricks that is played on us by God, or Mother nature, or whomever you believe in is that while humans have a lifespan that lasts 75 years or so our companions have life spans that are about ⅕ of that. I got home this morning and we got a call from the Veterinarian’s office saying that her ashes were back, and we brought her home.

Those that have had a 4 legged family member know the pain that Susan and I are going through. Dakota came to be a part of our family when she was 6 month’s old. She had been abused by her prior owner, and it took a lot of work for her to trust men, but after several months and a ton of love she finally trusted me and eventually she became comfortable around all adult males.
Like any canine family member Dakota took it on herself to be the family’s guardian, confidant, and occasionally troublemaker. She gave so much and all she ever wanted or expected in return was our love and attention. Those 2 things we poured on her. She was always our “Puppy” and “our baby girl” If you ever want to know what unconditional love is just get a pet like our little puppy. It didn’t matter what kind of day you were having, or if something wasn’t going right, or if she wasn’t feeling the best, we were the very focus of her entire existence always.

I posted that we lost Dakota on facebook Tuesday stating something to the effect that if I earned a spot in heaven and our Dakota was not there I would move along and find her because if she wasn’t good enough for heaven than I definitely had no place there. Thank you to everyone who replied offering kind words. There are 2 that I would like to bring up specifically. First Ben Cook said “If my animal friends are not in heaven, I’ll be sure to leave a trail to where I find them so that you can find us all there

Second there were several references to a poem called the rainbow bridge. If you all would indulge me I would like to read this short poem

Just this side of heaven is a place called Rainbow Bridge.

When an animal dies that has been especially close to someone here, that pet goes to Rainbow Bridge.
There are meadows and hills for all of our special friends so they can run and play together.
There is plenty of food, water and sunshine, and our friends are warm and comfortable.

All the animals who had been ill and old are restored to health and vigor; those who were hurt or maimed are made whole and strong again, just as we remember them in our dreams of days and times gone by.
The animals are happy and content, except for one small thing; they each miss someone very special to them, who had to be left behind.

They all run and play together, but the day comes when one suddenly stops and looks into the distance. Her bright eyes are intent; Her eager body quivers. Suddenly she begins to run from the group, flying over the green grass, her legs carrying her faster and faster.

You have been spotted, and when you and your special friend finally meet, you cling together in joyous reunion, never to be parted again. The happy kisses rain upon your face; your hands again caress the beloved head, and you look once more into the trusting eyes of your pet, so long gone from your life but never absent from your heart.

Then you cross the Rainbow Bridge together….

Break
advertisement ABN
Seg 2- News
News_Partner_white

John 1- Gun-rights advocates won another victory in Chicago.  A judge approved almost a million dollars in legal fees that the city must pay to attorneys who challenged Chicago’s gun store ban.  The original lawsuit was filed in 2010 by an Illinois offshoot of the National Shooting Sports Foundation.  That battle isn’t over.  Richard Pearson, executive director of the Illinois State Rifle Association, anticipates a legal challenge to the city’s new rules regulating gun stores out of 99.5 percent of the city.  He said, “The ordinance is prohibitive.  If you look at the hidden costs of opening a gun store, I don’t know how a person could make a living selling firearms in the city of Chicago.”

Rob 2- There was another victory for the right to choose armed self-defense.  A Florida appellate court ruled that college and university campuses must allow students to store firearms in their cars on campus.  This allows adult students to attend school and remain armed when they work those late night jobs.  Contrary to the public claims of school administrators, negligent discharges remain extremely rare.  This is another small step toward self-protection in Florida.

John 3- A Kansas open carry bill went into effect on Tuesday.  It is now legal to openly carry a gun in a holster, in your hand, or carry a rifle on a sling.  Captain Rance Quinn of the Kansas City Police Department said they will still respond to calls of man with a gun, but the department will change how they handle the encounter.  Quote “…How are you doing today. I see that you are exercising your right to bear firearms. Is there anything I can do for you today?”

Rob Comment- Why yes, officer.  May I buy you a cup of coffee while we talk about your department sponsoring more firearms training for the general public?

Rob 4- The attention seeking anti-gun Virginia State Delegate, Joe Morrissey, once carried an AK-47 onto the Virginia statehouse floor.  Now he faces criminal charges for having sex with the 17-year-old receptionist in his office.  A special grand jury charged the Virginia politician with supervisory indecent liberties with a minor, electronic solicitation of a minor, possession of child pornography, distribution of child pornography and contributing to the delinquency of a minor.

Comment- He was only following Bill Clinton’s example.

John – This is the same Joe Morrissey who as the State’s Atty for Richmond was disbarred for among other things, fist fights in the courtroom. Why is that anti-gun activists are so violent?

John 5- Here is a good example from law enforcement, and from a small police department at that.  Police Chief Michael Combs found out there were no firearms safety courses offered in the county, so  Chief Combs decided to offer his own course.  The department will host a classroom and firing range sessions at the Goodwill Fire Company on July 19th.  Pennsylvania is a shall-issue state and there are no training requirement for ownership or a carry license.  I think the Chief’s decision makes citizens safer!

Rob Comment- Thank you, Chief Combs.

Rob 6- Some gun-grabbing activist groups tell you that real women want to be helpless.  Not me.  I’ll remind you that the number of women who own guns has been rising rapidly.  The percentage of women who own a gun nearly doubled from 2005 to 2011.  Those guns are not gathering dust.  A growing number of women are at the range and taking classes.  Women are on the cutting edge of self-defense.  I offer as example of the students I see and the students of our frequent guest Kathy Jackson.

Rob- There is a list of women’s gun groups on my blog site Everytown for Gun Safety.wordpress.com

John 7- We’re not sure if it was on purpose or an accident.  On the first of July, a poorly written law in Mississippi exempted disabled military veterans from paying some hunting and registration fees.  Unfortunately, the law it required veteran submit to a disability review by the Veterans Administration.  Many veterans will decline that opportunity, thank you.  The bill also required non-veterans to submit to a mental health exam at the will of the Mississippi state police.  It isn’t clear how the bill will be implemented by law enforcement.  Gun owners need a strong state organization that takes a critical look at legislation.  This legislation may have taken Mississippi back to “may issue” status.

Paul 8- This probably wasn’t the answer they were looking for.  The MSNBC network conducted a poll asking, “Do you think people should be allowed to carry guns in public?” 84 thousand people answered.  88% chose “Yes! The Second Amendment guarantees the right to carry in pubic.  Another 4% chose “Only for self-defense.” and 8 percent said carrying a gun is too dangerous.

John Comment- I didn’t know MSNBC had 84 thousand viewers.

John 9- Because of changes in the Georgia gun laws, churches in Georgia now have an opt-in or opt-out policy towards concealed carry while at church.  An Episcopal bishop in Georgia said he will forbid concealed carry in church.  Other congregations have accepted concealed carry. Pastor Tom Rush said, “Quite frankly, we may have some people in our church that are uncomfortable with the idea… You know, I grew up in a day when we left the sanctuary doors open so people could come in at any time and pray. Unfortunately, we don’t live in those days anymore.”

This is part of a larger social trend of our culture splitting into isolated tribes.  Honest gun owners have had to choose which stores to enter based on the store’s no-guns policy.  Now that decision includes churches as well.

Rob- This issue isn’t confined to Georgia.  I live in California.  Last year a nearby church took an anti-self-defense petition to a city council.  The church’s public statements sounded inclusive, but their claims were wildly inaccurate.  I asked to speak with the church committee but they ignored me and never returned my calls.

Rob 10- In California, Assembly bill 1014 remains in committee.  The bill creates a new law aimed directly at California gun owners.  The bill requires police to proactively confiscate firearms and hold them for one year with no due process based solely on an accusation made by an immediate family member, a law enforcement officer or any health professional.

The person filing the complaint only has to believe quote “the gun owner poses a significant risk of personal injury to himself, herself, or another by having under his or her custody and control, owning, purchasing, possessing, or receiving a firearm.”  close quote.  One anti-gun doctor could declare all California gun owners mentally unfit.

John Comment- so will every vindictive divorce lawyer.

Rob Comment- We commented last week on California’s failing grades for mental health treatment.  They aren’t doing any better this week.

Paul Gun Quotes- The American Revolution was a beginning, not a consummation, said by President Woodrow Wilson.

Hang on everybody, we’ll be right back after this
advertisement Concealment Solutions
Seg 3 Interview with Kathy Jackson and Frank Fiamingo

Questions for Frank
Frank, earlier this week Governor Christie vetoed the magazine capacity bill that was on his desk, could you talk a little bit about that?

Are there any other bills related to gun rights that are still on his desk?
Why are gun owners blamed for violence?
Politicians want a soundbite solution.

What else is going on with the NJ2AS?

Questions for Kathy

Thanks for coming on Kathy, It’s been a while since we were able to have you on for a long form interview and I am so happy that we found a hole in your schedule so that you could join us tonight! I would like to discuss a few of the more recent blog posts. The first one that I would really like to cover is one you titled “Strength and Weakness” where you talk about a the recent Miss USA pageant winner and her take on self defense, in reference to a Larry Correa post. Could you talk a little bit about that?

Another post that I really liked was one of your shorter posts from late May entitled “He Didn’t Deserve That” One unfortunate side effect of our society is that everyone seems to be suing for everything. I thought that this post was quite illuminating in that it seems to have spread to some sectors of public opinion. Could you talk a little bit about that post?

Rob- Kathy, in one of your posts you said You’re never disarmed. “Your ultimate resource for self-defense are the things you carry inside yourself.” Would you tell our listeners more about that?

Guns and alcohol?

Normalcy bias- When someone chokes we want permission to help.
Couples Tactical Class

Segment 4 DGUs

Rob 1- Two young men walked into Marlene’s jewelry store in Fresno, California.  The two men looked at the display cases and slowly moved towards the cash register in the back of the store.  That is where one of the thieves pulled out a gun and pointed it at one of the store employees while demanding cash and jewelry.  Seconds later, the store owner pointed his shotgun around the corner from the back room of the store.  The unarmed thief yelled “shoot them” as he dropped and ran towards the door, but the armed thief turned and followed his cowardly compatriot.  Both young thieves were caught on video and are very lucky to be alive.

Paul 2- Thieves tried to steal a vehicle parked in front of a home in Wasilla, Alaska.  When that failed, they tried to force their way inside the home through the kitchen door.  The 65-year-old homeowner called 911 and then fired a single shot.  She missed, but the criminals turned and ran.  They were long gone by the time state troopers arrived.

Citizens are the first responders, either as witnesses or as victims.

John – comment – if the homeowner was a few years older, I might have guessed it was my first cousin Ginny who lives in Wasilla!

John 3- This man is my hero.  A Centralia, Washington man and his girlfriend were sitting in their living room when a homeless 43-year-old stranger entered their home armed with a knife.  The homeowner grabbed his shotgun and ordered the intruder out of the house. They both walked outside, but instead of leaving, the intruder pushed the homeowner down a flight of stairs on the back porch. The intruder then grabbed a machete sitting on the porch and approached the homeowner.  Rather than shooting his attacker, the homeowner hit him with the butt of his shotgun, putting him on the ground and holding him there until the police arrived.  The homeowner preserved the life of a drug addled man.  Sheriff Steve Mansfield said. “This is another example of why citizens need to take all possible precautions and be prepared if something like this occurs.”

Do you have that much restraint after getting pushed down the stairs?

Rob 4- Well your hero has some competition.   My hero is Orlandous Brown who suffers from cerebral palsy and needs a wheelchair.  Orlandous came home Thursday morning in the company of his friend Latisha Vernon and Latisha’s 17-year-old daughter.  That is when he discovered that someone was already inside his Easly, South Carolina home and was robbing the place.  The thief was armed, but so was Orlandous.  Latisha and her daughter fled the home and called 911.  Deputies moved the women a safe distance away, and entered the home a few minutes later.  They found 33 year old Orlandous wounded from a single round and they also found the intruder, 26-year-old Darin Lowe, dead from multiple gunshot wounds.

Orlandous was transported by ambulance to the local hospital where he underwent surgery and is expected to make a full recovery. Police believe Orlandous may have been targeted because he is disabled and the dead intruder thought he was an easy target.

Comment- The thief thought wrong.

Paul 5- There is no way and no reason to pretty this up.  Gun control kills.  Two armed teenagers shot a couple as they walked on the sidewalk of Newark, New Jersey.  The murderers told the couple to kneel.  They shot 17-year-old Cheyanne Bond in the head execution style.  Her boyfriend survived.  The money Bond’s family had set aside for the teenager’s tuition at nursing school will go toward her funeral.  The crime rate in New Jersey has exploded since gun-prohibition was enacted in the late 1960s.  Now, long time politician and anti-gun Newark Mayor Ras Baraka has the murder rate he worked for.

New Jersey murder rate

John- We have the links to each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com if you want to share them with a friend.

Advertisement NJ2AS
Tips and tricks segment
Advertisement
Segment 5 Show close
Listener e-mail discussion

Paul: The Polite Society download app is out on Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.

John: Also please check out Kathy Jackson’s Cornered Cat training classes. Her next class that still has seats available is the weekend of July 12th and 13th in Walla Walla Washington. Go to Cornered Cat dot com for more classes and details.

Rob: Also please check out the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.  Subscribing from the link in our show notes helps Bob and Ben as well as helps us here at the Polite Society Podcast.

Join your local civil rights group like theNew Jersey Second Amendment Society,Arizona Citizens Defense League,Gun Owners of California, Commonwealth Second Amendment,  Connecticut Citizens Defense League,Florida Carry, Georgia Carry,Georgia Gun Owners,Grass Roots North Carolina,Illinois Carry, Maryland Shall Issue,  Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry, and  Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.

There are Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance,  Nebraska Firearms Owners Association,   Citizens for a Safer New Jersey,New York State Rifle & Pistol Association,  Open Carry Texas, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Virginia Open Carry,  West Virginia Citizens Defense League, wisconsingunowners.org, and Wyoming Gun Owners.  Remember if your state or local organization isn’t read each episode, then send us an email and we’ll add them!

For our Canadian listeners, and their supporters, join theCanadian Shooting Sports Association and theCanadian National Firearms Association.

Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast. Until the mid-week show…
Rob: stay safe,
John: be aware,
Paul: and we’ll see you down the road.

Episode 249 – Jim Irvine and Molly Pitcher

Intro- “An armed society is a polite society.. and this is the Polite Society Podcast where we support and report on civilian self-defense.”

Rachel: Welcome to the polite society podcast recorded live on wednesday, July 2nd, 2014, I’m Rachel Malone.
John: I’m John Richardson, and we have an interview with Jim Irvine of Buckeye Firearms talking about training school staff to protect our children.
Rob: I’m Rob Morse and have an interview with Molly Pitcher of CATI-Austin talking about the upcoming Gunpowder and Lace ladies open carry walk.
Rachel, we have our usual weekly news and stories of defensive gun use, as well as Mary Ann Schow talking about gun games for our tips and tricks segment, so climb aboard
John: strap in
Rob: and hang on!
Rachel: Episode 249 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.
Show intro music.

Seg 1
Personal news from each participant
Rob- Dry practice and wondering about new training techniques.

John- Still waiting for a SIRT pistol coming out in M&P since I’m not a Glock fanboi.

Rachel- Gave a presentation along with a local CATI leader for TAG (Texans for Accountable Government). We talked about gun legislation in Texas – why it failed, good outcomes from that, and what we need from activists to get stuff done next spring in the legislative session. I like the way TAG functions – they encourage their members to take charge in their area of interest and provide support by facilitating communication to other activists who can help out.

Break
advertisement ABN
Seg 2- News

News_Partner_whiteRob- To open the news we have a rant from Rachel Malone. This one is about the heart of leadership, so let us know what is on your mind, Miss Malone.
Rachel-

I was asked the other day, “How many people do you have who would blindly follow you?”

My response: “Nobody, I hope.”

I don’t want people to follow me. Now, that might sound strange. I AM the leader of a gun rights organization, am I not? Aren’t I supposed to be leading the way? Why on earth would I NOT want people to follow me?!

I’ve got three reasons.

#1 – I’m not going to do your work for you.

The responsibility of running this country and holding elected officials accountable belongs to We the People. Last time I checked, I wasn’t a plural entity. I’m one person, and I’m responsible for myself. You’re another person, and you’re responsible for yourself. Get out there and do what you’re supposed to do.

Even though I am the director of a gun rights organization here in Texas – I want all you Texans out there to know, I’m not going to lobby for you. I’m going to lobby for myself. I’ll teach you how to lobby, I’ll teach you how to be involved, but I won’t do your work for you. Get out there and do the job yourselves!

Even if I wanted to be nice and do your work for you….

#2 – I’m not always right.

As hard as I work to research thoroughly and get my facts straight and present 100% correct information, I’m still very human. I’m going to mess up sometimes. It’s happened before, and it will certainly happen again. I’ll be responsible for my own mistakes, but please don’t try to make me responsible for yours.

Also, I may simply hold to a slightly different position than you on some things. So, perhaps our beliefs line up perfectly in most things but diverge in 10%. You’d be wrong to just blindly follow because you’d be violating your conscience in that 10%.

Even if I were always right and you knew you would always agree with me…

#3 – I want you to think for yourself.

If you end up following me, that’s great, but it has to be because you took time to consider the issue, look at the facts, and come to your own strong conviction that just happened to match up with mine.

A large part of what I’ve done with Texas Firearms Freedom is to take the time to do extensive research on an issue or on a piece of legislation, and then give people pertinent information on that bill. I DO give them my own conclusions and suggested action items as a convenience for them, but I always try to avoid pressuring people to just fall in line and do what I say.

My hope is that I can persuade people with logical arguments and facts, so that they take up my position with strong conviction. I don’t want passive agreement. I would rather have people believe what they believe with strong conviction whether they agree or disagree with me.

A person will fight for a belief with the same strength he believes it. So if you reach your conclusion by examining the facts and thinking for yourself, I think you’ll fight for it more strongly. You’ll have more reason to do so and more conviction that you’re right. You’ll be fighting for what YOU believe in. And THAT is what I want.

CONCLUSION:
I don’t want to have people blindly follow me. I want people to think for themselves and reach their own conclusions and chart their own courses to complete their own missions. I want to help them understand the process of effecting change so they can achieve their goals. Sure, I’ll tell them what I think and try to be persuasive, but at the end of the day, I don’t want them to agree with me just because I said something and they follow me. If they agree, I want it to be because they believe strongly the same things that I do, and they have reached those conclusions themselves.

Beware of anyone who asks you to blindly follow. Be very wary of any organization that sends you an action item without any explanation. Be extremely cautious and ready to cut ties with anyone who tries to get you to quit thinking and just do what they want you to do. That’s not their place. It makes your job a little bit easier right now, but it’s a cop out. Quit copping out. Do your own thinking.

I should also note that I consciously operate in the same way. You can’t buy my vote or agreement just because you’re my friend or you voted with me or helped me with some project. I won’t decide to agree with you as a favor to you, or because I “owe you one.” I’m not just going to follow you blindly no matter who you are and how much I like you as a person (and, I’m not going to refuse to work with you no matter how much I dislike you). No, you have to earn my vote or agreement. You have to persuade me. You have to show me that you’re right and convince me of the reasons. Do that, and you earn my support.

And I hope, for at least some of you, I will help you to think through issues and convince you of my position and earn your support. But please – make me EARN it. Don’t ever blindly follow me.

-Comments? Thoughts?

Rob- Rachel, that is why we give our listener news and DGU, so they can make up their own mind.

John- Hear-hear

1- John – Let’s start off with good news. Thanks to your efforts, Gov. Chris Christie (R-NJ) has listened to us. He vetoed the bill, A2006/S993, which would have banned possession of magazines with greater than 10 round capacity. Christie said in his veto message that the bill was one of those “cheaply recycled answers that never really address the root causes” of violence”.  He goes on to say, “These advocates argue that forcing an unstable, untreated, and likely clinically ill shooter to pause to reload during a rampage will humanely spare lives. This is the very embodiment of reform in name only. “ ANJRPC Executive Director Scott Bach said, “The Governor clearly recognizes the difference between legislation that punishes violent criminals vs. legislation that targets the rights of law-abiding citizens.”

Rob 2 -It wasn’t a quiet weekend in the windy city or the big apple.  21 people were shot in New York city and 42 people shot in Chicago over the weekend.  Both cities are the epitome of gun control and big government.  Both your big gulp and your magazine capacity are regulated and registered, but the violent crimes just keep on coming.  Strange, but the city government hasn’t learned that over-regulating the honest people hasn’t controlled the behavior of criminals at all.

Rachel- Maybe their gun free zone sign is broken, and no one told them?
John- I don’t think they want to learn.
Rachel- I don’t think they care. Regulation is the goal, not the means.
Rob- I think you’re right.

Rachel- Here is more news from Chicago.  Richard Hernandez was supposed to stop gang violence as a paid “interrupter” in the anti-gang CeaseFire program.  Now Chicago cops have another name for Hernandez. They call him a rapist.  Hernandez faces 36 counts of sexual assault and kidnapping of a teenage girl while he worked for the anti-violence program.  Hernandez is one of  nine employees of the CeaseFire who faced serious criminal charges in recent years.  Their convictions included illegal weapons possession and drug charges.

John 4- Outside the corrupt city of Chicago, Illinois now has over 60 thousand licensed concealed carry holders since the state started accepting application in January.  Firearms sales often slump during the summer as people get busy, but sales of handguns and the request for training and licensing courses have continued to grow.

break

Rob- 5 As part of the American Civil Liberties Union’s recent report on police militarization, the Massachusetts chapter of the organization sent open records requests to SWAT teams across that state. They received a very interesting answer.  Small police department pool their resources and share a SWAT team.  The teams are operated by law enforcement councils, or LECs. These LECs are funded by several police agencies in a given geographic area and overseen by an executive board, which is usually made up of police chiefs from member police departments.  The LECs also facilitate technology and information sharing and oversee other specialized units, such as crime scene investigators and computer crime specialists.

This is the interesting part, the SWAT teams said they do not have to respond to freedom of information requests because they are not a state agency.  On the one hand, they claim that corporate status exempts them from open-records laws. On the other, they still claim the privilege of using deadly force on behalf of the state, and their evidence is admissable as a law enforcement officer.  I think someone has something to hide and needed better legal advice.

6 John – The California Legislature has now passed AB 1964 and sent it to Gov. Jerry Brown. The bill would eliminate the single-shot exemption to the Cal Handgun Roster. Only handguns originally made as single shots would be exempted. A firearm that was converted would have to be on the roster or it would be outlawed for sale. The Firearms Policy Coalition has an page up urging Gov. Brown to veto the bill. Links are in the show notes. They are also asking people to make their voice heard on SB 53 which would ban online sales of ammo in California (among other things). A link for that is up as well.

Rachel 7- Will the last manufacturer to leave the blue states please turn out the lights.  PTR left Connecticut and gave a commemorative rifle to the Governor of its new home in South Carolina.  Remington moved some of its production lines from New York to Alabama.  Sturm Ruger & Co Inc is building a 220,000-square-foot building in North Carolina. Colt which is also headquartered in Connecticut, moved its shop to Texas at the end of 2013.  Beretta abandoned Maryland and moved to Tennessee shortly after Maryland lawmakers banned assault weapons’ sales.  The reasons are simple.  These companies moved because of laws, costs and people.  They found more of what they wanted in other states.

John – comment – I hope to visit the PTR factory in a couple of weeks when we vacation at Myrtle Beach. Maybe I’ll come back with an interview.

Rob- They don’t build airplanes in California any more, and they don’t build cars in detroit any longer.

John 8- If you felt a bump in the night, it was a wave of freedom felt on July 1 as several states recognized more rights of self defense.  In Georgia, the guns everywhere bill went into effect with 12 new pro-defense provisions in state law.  Even purple Virginia had seven new pro hunting provisions take effect.  Mississippi had three bills become law that limit local pre-emption, exempts disabled veterans from paying hunting license fees, and created a tax holiday for hunting and fishing equipment.  A Tennessee bill will allow a gun owner to carry his firearm in his car without a permit while a second Tennessee bill makes it illegal to harass hunters and fishermen with drones.  Blue state Maryland allowed Sunday hunting, expanded hunting season, and instituted special classes to teach hunters to cull the overpopulation of deer in some Maryland counties.

Rob 9-Ahh, smell the freedom.. except in Los Angeles, California.  There the stupid is still strong.  The LA City Council proposed a 10 round magazine capacity ban.  That would make possessing large-capacity magazines a misdemeanor.  It would eliminate any grandfather exemption and demand standard capacity magazines be surrendered in 60 days.  There are of course exceptions for law enforcement and museum collections.  None of these new laws would have stopped the latest killer in Santa Barbara.

John Comment-  Somehow the criminals will ignore our 23 thousand gun laws, but obey this one.

Rob Comment- The stupid is everywhere in LA.

Rachel 10- Last episode we reported on the Federal district judge who denied the appeal of Colorado sheriffs to rescind the new Colorado gun restrictions.

Rob- Comment- Is this the same judge who took data from before the background check law went into effect to show that people didn’t use background checks?

Rachel – Yep, that is the judge.  Well the sheriffs have decided to appeal her ruling.

Weld County Sheriff John Cooke said,  “These laws are unconstitutional and unenforceable due to the way they are written.”

Rob- John and I met Sheriff Cooke.  I remember him.

Break

11 John- The Bloomberg funded group “Moms demand action” was asked to leave a Target department store in San Antonio, Texas.  The group demand that Target refuse service to licensed concealed carry holders.  The daughter of one of the protesters was murdered in a gun free zone.. so they want to turn all Target stores into gun-free zones.

Rob- What?  I can imagine this in Dallas, but Austin.

12 John – Unfortunately, Target has now issued a “Starbucks” type of statement regarding the carry of firearms in their stores. They say, “But starting today we will also respectfully request that guests not bring firearms to Target – even in communities where it is permitted by law.” I take this to mean that while they won’t post their stores, they want their stores to be unofficially gun-free zones. While Everyday Moms for Illegal Mayors is claiming victory, a spokewoman for Target clarified that “It is not a ban,” she said. “There is no prohibition.” Nonetheless, it is a PR win for the anti’s.

Rachel- There is stupid even in Texas, but not much.

Rob 13- Really, Rachel, then explain this.  Dallas County has an agreement with a private gun range to accept the firearms taken from people charged with domestic abuse or the subject of a protective order.  Jan Langbein, CEO of Genesis Women’s Shelter said, “Imagine how much better victims would sleep at night knowing all the guns had been removed.”  I say, “Imagine how helpless the victims will feel if their abuser drops a dime on them and has the victim disarmed by the cops.”

John- My lawyer can beat up your lawyer.

Rob- Exactly.

Rachel- Comment- Are you guys picking on Texas?

Rob- I know restraining orders are fairly common in divorce cases, but I’ve never found an example of someone charged for making false claims of domestic abuse.  The liars are simply never prosecuted.

Rachel 14-  There  is no workable definition of an assault rifle, yet many anti-gun politicians use exactly that pejorative term Assault Rifle to ban modern sporting rifles.  Well Ares Defense has come up with an AR-15 configuration that going to frustrate the gun grabbers.  It doesn’t have a flash suppressor or bayonet lug.  It has a conventional stock, yet it uses stock AR uppers.  It operates like an AR.  Eats ammo like an AR, and it shoots like an AR, but it looks just like any other semi-automatic hunting rifle.

Comment- A few pounds of freedom coming to an over-regulated gun-banning jurisdiction near you.

John15-More cops are doing it right.  The Paragould, Arkansas Police Department trained citizens  to carry concealed.  The one-day class covered the laws surrounding handguns and how to properly handle, fire and care for them. Students then went to the range with instructors for a live-fire practice session.  One instructor said the class is important because it also teaches students how to avoid becoming a victim. “Not just teaching them the specifics about carry and conceal, where you can carry, where you can’t carry, but give them information that they can use in their daily lives.  Be aware of your surroundings and reduce the chances, of having to use that concealed handgun to defend themselves or a loved one.”  Classes are available each month until October.  This is the department’s nineteenth year teaching the class.

Rob, I read about some other departments doing this.  Good for them.

John – Kathi Jackson will join us on Saturday night.

Rob Gun Quotes

A gun is no more dangerous than a cricket bat in the hands of a madman. Prince Philip

Rachel-Coming right up, we have an interview with Molly Pitcher of CATI-Austin regarding an upcoming special event, as well as an interview with Jim Irvine of Buckeye Firearms, so stay tuned.

The Gunpowder and Lace Walk sponsored by CATI Austin will be held Saturday, July 12, 10:30 AM at the Capitol Visitors Parking Garage (12th st. and San Jacinto). Participants will meet on the corner for a safety briefing and then walk down Congress Ave. to 6th Street. Ladies, bring your black powder pistols and/or long guns. Chamber checks will be conducted as always to ensure safety (no round in the chamber for long guns). Long guns should be carried on a sling in a way that keeps the muzzle in a safe direction at all times.  More Info.  Facebook event page.  CATI TX page

Hang on everybody, we’ll be right back after this interview with Jim Irvine of Buckeye Firearms.

advertisement Concealment Solutions
Seg 3 Interviews
Segment 4 DGUs

Rachel 1- It is good to have friends with guns in Pennsylvania.  Christopher Vazques and an associate robbed a 60 year old man in front of the victim’s house, taking his valuables and keys.  The victim recognized them and called police.  Because his keys were taken, the victim stayed outside to protect his car.  The thieves came back to take the car and they began beating the victim when he said he’d reported the earlier crime to police.  Moments later a neighbor yelled for the two men to stop beating the victim.  The neighbor fired one shot, striking Vazquez in the chest.  The criminal died at the hospital.  The shooter was taken into custody and released without charges.

Rob- Police were called to the Step-N-Style in Dayton Ohio before noon.  Two armed and masked men entered the store and demanded cash.  The store had been robbed before, only this time the store owner was armed.  He shot one of the armed robbers, and his accomplice fled.  Police later identified the dead criminal as 16 year old Isiah Haggins, Jr.

He lived with his grandmother, and the family was surprized by his armed criminal behavior.

Very few criminals start with armed robbery.  The start with stealing property, then burglary, then, finally muggings and armed robbery.  Maybe this young man was different, but for most criminals committing armed robbery, it isn’t their first crime.

John – The manager of La Bodega Mexican restaurant was happy that an off-duty Midland (Texas) Police detective was eating in his restaurant this past Friday night. That is because Nyocomus Garnett, 35, entered the restaurant through its backdoor intent on committing armed robbery. After Garnett fired several shots in the kitchen, he exited into the restaurant where he was met by the off-duty detective who told him to drop his handgun. Garnett refused and then tried to shoot the detective. That is when the detective shot and killed Garnett. No patrons or restaurant staff were injured in the robbery attempt. Police say that Garnett had an “extensive history” with Midland law enforcement.

PAUL, PLEASE EDIT OUR MISTAKE HERE.

We have the links to each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com if you want to share them with a friend.

Advertisement NJ2AS

Tips and tricks segment with Mary Ann Schow on gun games. Trivial Pursuit, Battleship, Yatzie and old maid.

Advertisement FSI and Crusader Weaponry

Segment 5 Show close

Listener e-mail discussion
Rachel- From listener Chris Gillespie
I was a local store purchasing a monthly gun magazine. I reached the check out counter and the clerk asked if I concealed carry. I was thrown off guard by this question. I said “lets hope we never have to find out if I do.” How would you guys have answered that question?
Comments- Rachel? John? Rob?

Rob: The Polite Society download app is out on Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.

John: Also please check out Kathy Jackson’s Cornered Cat training classes. Her next class that still has seats available is the weekend of July 12th and 13th in Walla Walla Washington. Go to Cornered Cat dot com for more classes and details.

Rachel John, do you have any new posts from your Blog, No Lawyers, only guns and money you want to mention?

John: I do. I did a post Monday about the story we discussed a bit earlier. It was about the Target store in San Antonio that ushered the gun control protesters off their property. The organizer made a comment that stuck me with me. She said they were “armed with children and clipboards.” The UN and all responsible and moral people have condemned the use of children as soldiers. While qualitatively different than the warlords in the Congo and elsewhere, it is still using innocent children as tools and props in a war against gun rights.

Rob- Well said, John Richardson.

Rachel: Also please check out the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.

John: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast. Until the weekend show…
Rob: stay safe,
Rachel: be aware,
John: and we’ll see you down the road.

Episode 248 – Ben Branham and John Cardillo

NJ2AS linkPaul: Welcome to the polite society podcast recorded live on Saturday, June 28, 2014. I’m Paul Lathrop
John: I’m John Richardson, and we’ll talk with Ben Branham of Modern Self Defense
Rob: I’m Rob Morse and we have our weekly stories of defensive gun use
Gary: I am Gary Daugherty we will also talk about some strange technicalities of Illinois concealed carry law: so climb aboard
John: strap in
Rob: and hang on!
Paul: Episode 248 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.
Show intro music.

Seg 1
Personal news from each participant
Rob- On Friday I went to a friends house to load the software, and we had a ball shooting my SIRT gun.. in his living room. this is a combination of laser tag with a decent trigger and magazine change. We had a setup where we could shoot at a paper target to the right, and used a full length mirror to shoot the same target off to our left. Its is all done with mirrors.

I shot an IDPA match in Alpine this morning too. Paul, how many hours do you want me to use up talking about all the fun I had? Steel on a live range is noisier than a laser . So is shooting from inside a truck. It is a pain in the rear to try and maneuver to shoot out the back window of a truck.. but fun. Got to move. Got to shoot. Got to shoot targets that move. Used the sights and also shot from retention. 230 grains of fun from my 1911.

Truck at Alpine
Video >>  here  <<  (I’m behind the camera, not in the truck.)

John – No new news for me since the midweek show.

Break- advertisement ABN

Seg 2- News

News_Partner_white

 

 

 

 

 

John – On Wednesday, the Second Amendment Foundation filed a Federal lawsuitchallenging North Carolina’s restriction of their Concealed Handgun Permits to US citizens. The lawsuit was filed on behalf of Felicity Todd Veasey, an Australian citizen and a permanent legal resident, who has lived in North Carolina for the last ten years. She currently resides in Butner with her husband and stepdaughter who are US citizens. The suit asks the US District Court to declare the law unconstitutional based upon the Equal Protection Clause of the 14th Amendment and becauses it violates the 2nd Amendment. This suit is another of the Second Amendment Foundation’s challenges to restrictions on gun rights based upon alienage or citizenship. The NC General Assembly was asked to change the law during their short session but blew it off.

Rob- Comments –  Didn’t the Second Amendment Foundation win similar cases in other states.. in New Mexico for instance?  Now the North Carolina treasury will pay for the legislator’s laziness.

Gary – On Thursday, US District Court Judge Marcia Krieger upheld the Colorado laws that mandated background checks for private sales and that limited magazine capacity to 15 rounds. In her 50 page opinion, she said “”evidence shows that large-capacity magazines are frequently used in gun violence and mass shootings.” She also said that more competent defensive shooters need fewer rounds to hit their target which must explain why cops routinely have large – or standard – capacity magazines. Judge Krieger, in a footnote, also confuses the AR-15 with the M-16. As has become the unfortunate norm among many Federal judges, Krieger used the intermediate scrutiny standard to make her decision.

Rob- Comments –  It sounds like this judge knows nothing about firearms or the criminal use of firearms in a crime.

Matthew- 163 Democratic members of the US House of Representatives have signed an open letter to House Speaker John Boehner demanding a vote on gun control measures. This is about 80% of the total number of Democrats in the House. Given the timing of the letter, it seems this group of legislators think that gun control is a winning topic for Democrats despite a majority of Americans being opposed to more gun control.

Comments – John – I say, yes, please let’s make gun control an issue. We need more pro-gun Congressmen and women and this will help mobilize gun owners to get out and vote.

Comment- rob- These politicians are placing their campaign bets.  They think the bad publicity they get for supporting gun control will be offset by  fawning press coverage and campaign donations from anti-gun groups.

Paul – The National Shooting Sports Foundation just released a report this week that detailed the impact of hunters and target shooters on the economy. The $48 billion spent by hunters and shooters is responsible for 866,000 jobs and a total economic impact of $110 billion. The amount spent is more than the annual retail sales of companies like Coke, FedEx, and Disney. To put it in even greater perspective, the number of jobs – 866,000 – would make it the world’s 7th largest employer. The data used in the report comes from 2011 statistics. Imagine what it is now after the post-Newtown boom in sales of firearms and ammo.

Rob- Comments – Don’t ask me how much I paid for the venison I put in the freezer.

Rob- Ducks Unlimited used to put in duck ponds and graze areas.

John – This next story makes you want to say what the heck? Back in March, a legal concealed carry permit holder saved the life of the manager of Keith’s Superstore in Lumberton, Mississippi by stopping a thief in the act of stabbing the manager.  He did so without firing a shot and held the thief until police and EMS arrived. Fast forward 3 months. It now seems that the owners of Keith’s Superstore have posted “No Guns” signs on the door of the store and were quite rude when asked about it.

John- Comment – I wonder why they haven’t posted “No Knives” signs on the door instead.

Rob – Listen to this and hear your future.  Clark Aposhian could be said to be Utah’s top gun lobbyist.. and he had his guns taken away after a domestic dispute with his ex wife.  Aposhian was charged with disorderly conduct, domestic violence in the presence a child, criminal mischief, and threats of violence.. All this for sounding an air horn in a residential neighborhood. Aposhian was arrested last year after he drove his “deuce and a half” military surplus vehicle to his ex-wife’s house to pick up his daughter.

Quote  “I’ve been cleared of all these untrue and unfounded allegations. I’ve been vindicated. It’s unfortunate it took over a year to have that happen, at a great cost taxpayers and Cottonwood Heights, as well as at a great cost to myself.”

Last June a court ordered that Aposhian could not possess any firearms in light of a protective order filed against him. Aposhian said Monday that the protective order has been dismissed and he can have his guns back.

Matthew – Comment- You and I hear days in court.

John – Comment- Yeah, Lawyers hear the cash register ring. I am still confused on why divorce lawyers practice “family law”.

Rob Comment-  One of my friends used to thrill the little boys in the neighborhood when he drove his grandson to school in the company dumptruck.  That was not harassment and domestic violence.  This sounds like a couple conducting lawfare on each other using their lawyers as blunt instruments.

Paul- We talked about Washington DC’s new domestic violence gun ban a week ago.  Well, we told you so.

Matthew- Law enforcement officers beat their wives or girlfriends at nearly double the rate of the rest of the population, and trying to control that is not only difficult for the victims but potentially deadly, experts say. The trouble lies in the very nature of police work. One of the hallmarks of a good cop is to radiate authority and control, and in the wrong hands, those characteristics can be misused and lead to domestic intimidation and violence.

Gary- I’m sorry but the police are not there to save us.  An arrest was made Wednesday after two bodies were found along a rural road in southeastern Wisconsin earlier this month.  One of the bodies was identified as a woman reported missing late last year.  A West Allis man, 52-year-old Steven Zelich, was taken into custody in the death investigation.  Police identified Zelich as a former West Allis police officer.  The second victim found locked in a trunk alongside the road has not been identified.

Paul- Gun Quote- If you are not prepared to use force to defend civilization,  then be prepared to accept barbarism.  Economist and Marine Corps veteran, Doctor Thomas Sowell

Hang on everybody, we’ll be right back after this advertisement from Concealment Solutions

Seg 3 Interview with former New York policeman, and current self-defense advocate, John Cardillo.  Here is John’s recent article in the Blaze about his views on self-defense after being a New York city cop.  Here are John’s older articles in the Blaze.  Here is a link to his current company, PsyID.

Segment 4 DGUs

Why Paul is not in Illinois getting trained for his CHL.  Illinois has restrictive requirements for reporting out of state crimes, so does not allow out of state residents to apply for a permit to carry.  It could easily expand the requirements to include Mental health reporting, Domestic violence reporting, Debts, Driving infractions, DUI reporting, and Definition of felony versus misdemeanor convictions.

Break-

John -1 Sharon Doyle forgot her firearm when she went to work on Monday. So she went home and retrieved .38 revolver. That decision probably saved her life. A robber came into her health foods store with a knife and announced that this was a robbery. After going behind the counter and forcing the register open, he held a knife to Doyle’s chest. Doyle had previously served as a Philly police officer and a Secret Service agent. She credits her training with saving her life.

“I just went into a mode like this is what has to be done,” Doyle said. “One of us is walking out of the door and it’s gonna be me.” She shot the unidentified robber in the torso and called police. The unidentified robber was taken to the hospital where he was pronounced DOA. Doyle didn’t regret her actions.  She said “It might have saved somebody else because he looked like he was on a mission.  So, if it wouldn’t have been here, it may have been somewhere else.”

Rob- This police officer knew she had to be armed or be lucky, and she decided to be both armed and lucky that she was.

Gary- I get this comment in class often, “I only carry if I’m going some place dangerous”, I try to dissuade this opinion.

Rob – Two men are in the hospital following an attack in Chino Hills, California.  At about 2AM, Raiveon Wooden broke into the home of his ex-girlfriend and her parents.  He hid in the garage.  When the girl’s father went to investigate noises in his garage, Wooden attacked him and stabbed him multiple times.  Fortunately, the father was armed and shot Wooden, ending the attack.  Both men are being treated for non life threatening injuries.  Wooden faces charges of burglary as well as attempted murder.

Paul- We have the links to each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com if you want to share them with a friend.

Advertisement NJ2AS
Tips and tricks segment
Advertisement
Segment 5 Show close
Listener e-mail discussion

Rob- Thank you to Scott Gibbons for sending in some news and DGUs.

Paul: The Polite Society download app is outon Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.

Gary: Also please check out Kathy Jackson’s Cornered Cat training classes. Her next class that still has seats available is the weekend of July 12th and 13th in Walla Walla, Washington. Go to Cornered Cat dot com for more classes and details.

Paul: Rob, do you have any new posts from your SlowFacts blog you want to mention?

Rob- That rant I did about crime in San Diego on our Wednesday show, well, it is a blog post and up at Ammoland and a Clash Daily.  It also turns out that in the county just north of me, annual applications for carry permits have already grown 10 fold year to year, and we are only in June.

Rob: John do you want to mention anything off of your blog you would like to talk about?

John:  I did a post today on the world’s most powerful handgun. Today marks the 100th anniversary of the day that Gavrilo Princip assassinated Archduke Franz Ferdinand of Austria. That was the spark that set off WW1. We often refer to pistols with calibers less than 9mm Luger or .38 Special as “mouse guns”. Well, it was a “mouse gun” – a FN Model 1910 in .380 Auto that was used to start WW1.

Rob- I’ve been on that bridge and read the report of how Franz Ferdidinad’s security detail was pulled from the motorcade.

Matthew: Also please check out the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.

Gary- I’m a member.

Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast. Until the (mid-week / weekend )show…
Rob: stay safe,
Matthew: be aware,
John: and we’ll see you down the road.

Mention advertisers, ABN, Concealment Solutions, Crusader Weaponry and NJ2AS. Firearm Safety Institute